Another departure from city hall!

[fluffy]

Wow Fluffy! Are you saying others aren't entitled to their thoughts and opinions because it might screw up someone's day? Really??

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but expressing an opinion without factual basis is just gossip, and widely accepted as a sign of flawed character. "Dysfunctional" is a pretty harsh way to frame things when you just don't like current council for business decisions they have made. I'm pretty sure that if the decisions had gone the way you wanted them to that the other half of the screamers in town would be calling them names too.

I find it incredible the amount of gaffles that the City of Penticton has done either through decisions from council or upper city management. The list is endless but it seems to me being a northerly neighbours that it's been mostly in the last 5 to 10 years.

I'd be interested in hearing what sort of things you have on your list. Council has made some decisions on divisive issues, but just because you don't agree with them does that qualify as mismanagement?

Totally off-topic, but I'm of the mind that the anonymity and lack of accountability inherent in internet discussions has lead to a serious erosion in common civility.

[southy]

Sorry Fluffy - you sir are making some very major assumptions about other peoples opinions. Explain to me HOW you know their opinions lack factual basis? Who are you to say it's flawed character. Seriously Fluffy - take a look at your own opinions before you start judging others.

[fluffy]

Sorry Fluffy - you sir are making some very major assumptions about other peoples opinions. Explain to me HOW you know their opinions lack factual basis? Who are you to say it's flawed character. Seriously Fluffy - take a look at your own opinions before you start judging others.

Yes, I am. I'm assuming that your comments are based solely on your dislike for council and not fact. This is easily resolved, you can just offer up the factual basis for your claim that these departures are the result of some form of dysfunction.

[antiArmChairQB]

I am new to the forum but I agree with Fluffy. Southy give the readers some facts and support for your statement of dysfunction with staff at the COP?

[twobits]

I am new to the forum but I agree with Fluffy. Southy give the readers some facts and support for your statement of dysfunction with staff at the COP?

Evidence? How about the parade of senior staff that have left in the last few years either voluntarily or otherwise after only a short term in their positions? As the reasons will never be made public due to confidentiality concerns, which is rather convenient to your "provide evidence" request, the shear number of departures sets off some serious alarm bells about dysfunction in City Hall does it not?
So where is the problem? The City advertises for a position, HR staff receive application and vet and shortlist. Managers review shortlist and provide refined shortlist to CAO. Decision on who to interview is determined and CAO and upper managers participate in interviews. A short short list is then arrived at which the CAO then presents to council with recommends in order of CAO's opinion in camera. Council then makes the decision.
So again, where is the problem and why does Penticton have a parade of mangers coming and going? Is it because they somehow after the entire vetting process are found to be "not the correct fit" because they dared to question the gong show logic of their direct manager?
That's where my money is.

[fluffy]

So where is the problem?

That's the question of the day, assuming there is a problem and I'm not convinced there is one. There are all sorts of possible reasons for turnover in staff, I think it's prejudicial to think that there is reason to find fault with city staff or council at this point. The "parade" started with the core review a few years back where a number of upper management positions were deemed redundant, underutilized or simply unnecessary. How many have left since, how big a "parade" are we talking about here? And what were the published reasons? I have to wonder if maybe you just want there to be a problem.

[twobits]

That's the question of the day, assuming there is a problem and I'm not convinced there is one. There are all sorts of possible reasons for turnover in staff, I think it's prejudicial to think that there is reason to find fault with city staff or council at this point. The "parade" started with the core review a few years back where a number of upper management positions were deemed redundant, underutilized or simply unnecessary. How many have left since, how big a "parade" are we talking about here? And what were the published reasons? I have to wonder if maybe you just want there to be a problem.

No, the parade did not start with the core review. That was a needed broom sweep of deadwood. And no, I do not want there to be a problem. Stability and continuity are desirable for obvious reasons. I'm sorry fluff...I do respect your enlightened and measured comments 99% of the time but I think right now it is your bias in favour of this clown show council that is clouding what is obvious. This parade started with two top tier managers taking jobs in Fort Mac for lords sake. For people earning well above six figures in the Okanagan, it was not money that lured them away. Or do you consider a move to Fort Mac for these folks a career advancement? Sorry but there is a problem in the hierarchy in the 100 block.

[JagXKR]

Seems if it quacks like a duck well... it's a duck. Something is rotten in Denmark, or in this case 100 block. Does not pass the smell test. Does not cut the mustard. Just par for the course.
No more phrases come to mind.

[fluffy]

...but I think right now it is your bias in favour of this clown show council that is clouding what is obvious.

I hold no great love for current council, but I do see that they have a pretty tough job to do in a town that always seems to be starkly divided on most issues, and I'm not as quick as many to pass judgement based on speculation. From where I sit I suspect your bias against this council is affecting your perception. (touche)

This parade started with two top tier managers taking jobs in Fort Mac for lords sake. For people earning well above six figures in the Okanagan, it was not money that lured them away. Or do you consider a move to Fort Mac for these folks a career advancement? Sorry but there is a problem in the hierarchy in the 100 block.

So we have a parade of two so far, who took jobs in a place more famed for its ridiculously huge money than anything else. What makes you so sure it wasn't money that took them there? The lure of early retirement can tug pretty hard.

The bottom line here is that we really don't have any reason to suspect a problem without any inside information. There are perfectly reasonable explanations for the four departures that have come under discussion so far. That is reason for nothing more than suspicion.

[fluffy]

Seems if it quacks like a duck well... it's a duck. Something is rotten in Denmark, or in this case 100 block. Does not pass the smell test. Does not cut the mustard. Just par for the course.
No more phrases come to mind.

"Put your money where your mouth is" comes to mind. :)

Do you have anything concrete to offer?

[JagXKR]

"Put your money where your mouth is" comes to mind. :)

Do you have anything concrete to offer?

Nope. Just fishin...but Occum's razor comes to mind.

[fluffy]

...but Occum's razor comes to mind.

Which means what? They found a better job? More money for less work?

[JagXKR]

Simplest thing for me would be a problem with 100 block, somewhere within. Many departures from different people in a short time is fishy. Wages, working environment, meddling from other departments, personality conflicts....could be any, all or none. I do not know and I'm certainly not as sure as twobits but I think where there is smoke there is fire. Oooh another one.
We may never know the true nature of what is really going on but it just does not "feel" right. My only real concern is cost. Is it costing taxpayers more to keep getting new people? I'm a saver and always want to get my money's worth. When the city spends my money I want a good return, even if it takes a while.

[fluffy]

Fair enough. At least placing your suspicions under an umbrella of "I don't know, but..." is a little less accusatory, a bit of honesty that seems to be escaping a couple of others here. :)

[Dawnland]

I usually try to keep my opinions out of City politics and stick with the FN or RDOS topics, but...
I recall the departure of Communications Officer, Simone Blais around the end of Summer last year. I believe she took a position at UBCO. In my opinion, that was the beginning of the lack of engagement, consultation and crappy ideas. Because communications is a two-way street, I wonder if she saw the writing on the wall of the one-way method in the new mayor and council? With all the strife created with the hit-or-miss project execution, Tina Lee has her hands full.