Crossroads Closing

[cv23]

I didn't say that the user pay type facilities enjoy a greater success rate than those more similar to Crossroads, when I said that success depends a lot on the degree to which they are vested in their own recovery I was not speaking in monetary terms, I was referring more to the degree of emotional commitment to recovery. Claims to huge success rates (80 - 90%) made by any facility are suspect at best, research into addiction treatment just hasn't progressed that far yet.

CV23, a lot of your dismay stems from the way you perceive addiction and it treatment. If you look at it as a medical problem then the idea of supplying addiction treatment in much the same way we would supply mainstream medical care begins to make sense.

Thank you for the clarification of your use of the term "vested interest".

I have no real dismay about Crossroads closing as the more I read and hear about that particular facilities operation seeing it closed may actually be a good thing. Hopefully another facility which can operate within it's available budget,or find alternative means of funding, replaces it. I haven't really questioned the need for such facilities as I have the manor by which some of these facilities are run. and now their success rates.
I will never see addiction to illegal drugs or alcohol as medical issues that the state should soley be responsible to deal with. These addicts made bad personal choices so therefore should bare some of the responsibility for correcting/treating the results of the personal choices they made. You say that I need to think of these addictions as medical. Many cancer patients developed the disease with no clear reason, while many more each year develop the disease because of smoking. I have personally witnessed patients at the Cancer clinic receive a Chemo treatment to save their lives and then watched them step outside to have a cigarette. To me here is a clear abuse of the medical system itself. Why are we wasting valuable medical resources trying to save this persons life when that person clearly has no "vested interest" in saving their own life? Maybe the medical system needs to look more closely at who they are offering treatments of all kinds to and decide if the available funds will best be invested in helping those who want the help and are willing to make the personal invest in themselves?
Again I seem to be the only one in this forum offering possible solutions to Crossroads current problem rather than just screaming that the problem is government mismanagement of funds/resources which we all know has been going on for decades if not centuries with no end in sight. Crossroads end is in very clear sight and equally clear is that it has to be either those who need the facility or those want the facility to continue operating to be the ones to save it. Take your pick but whining about government waste here in these forums hasn't and won't help save Crossroads. Its come to either user pay or supporter pay because the available government funding is at its max.

[xyz123]

Ifyou look at addictions asd a medical problem your just wrong. The only reason the helath boards in BC got involved was du eto MCFD screwing up so grossly when they had the addictions portfolio. I cringe when i hear other sya its like diabetes. Nothing to support that but a few bad studies. Yes some medicalinetrvention can be helpful should there be some underlying issues that CONTRIBUTE to addiction. Saying 50% of the people have mental health problems isnt very helpful either.

In a society that choses to make drugs illegal we place addicts in a situation where they develop a DSM IV diagnosis of anti-social personality disorder. Life in the street is a traumatic existence. So most all suffer form the Anxiety disorder of post traumatic stress disorder. Yes some people do manage mood and diassociatve disorders with narcotics. Its few and far between.

What is success rate at Crossroads? Define success and prove that is the indicator that actually reflects success. If someone goes through treatment and gets their lives togahther but drinks or gets high here nad ther they arent a success to some to others they are. I disagree that success is mulitple entries into the program as the Ed. stated on the CBC.

[Queen K]

I wonder if Sir Gray asked anyone in Scottsdale Arizona on his working junket down there if they happen to have a drug rehabilitation facility.

"Does Arizona have a rehab facility for addicts and alcoholics?"
"Why yes, yes we do, here's the website http://scottsdalerecovery.com/"
"Why Thank you, we have to close ours down ya know."
"Lack of demand?"
"No, got lots of demand."
"Lack of political will power?"
"Yup, and we don't know how to read all those fancy dancy studies on how assisting people to get off of drugs and alcohol actually helps society save money."
"Can we offer reading courses?"
"No thank you, we have a university."

Pause
"Got golf courses?"
"Sure do, let's go."
"Great."

[fluffy]

The subject of addiction treatment has always been a hot one. The idea that addicts arrive at their current state through personal choice and as such "deserve" what their choices have reaped is not uncommon and makes perfect sense to some. It is worth noting that most people who have had direct experience with addicts and/or their treatment see that the issue is not quite as black-and-white. The ability to make simple choices, an ability most of us take for granted, is a lot more complicated for an addict than anyone who hasn't been there can understand. The difficulty in making choices where the addiction is involved becomes truly insurmountable as the need to use inevitably trumps all other considerations. It's hard to explain to someone who hasn't experienced the mental conflict themselves, even those who have watched a loved one struggle cannot appreciate the inner turmoil that surrounds "choice". In essence it is a matter of choice, it's just that the "right" choice is close to impossible to arrive at without assistance. Treatment centers are all about supplying that assistance.

[cv23]

Sorry to stray somewhat off topic but what about addiction to nicotine?
Should treatment of that addiction also be 100% socially funded if the client is insolvent?

[theyeti]

province already does give out patches and gum for nicotine addicts

[cv23]

province already does give out patches and gum for nicotine addicts

Why doesn't/shouldn't the government supply fully funded treatment centers for this drug addiction?

[theyeti]

none of my concern . im fully aware there r billions wasted/ stolen from government coffers every single day,. worrying about a few cents for nicotine gum is way too small an issue for me waste any time on

[fluffy]

Why doesn't/shouldn't the government supply fully funded treatment centers for this drug addiction?

Good question, although smoking treatment centers are not common they do exist. Tobacco addiction can be just as severe as any addiction in its grip on the user and it has been repeatedly shown that the bottom line cost of smoking and all of its ramifications far exceeds any revenue gained from taxation on sales. I think it's probably that the social downside of smoking is minimal when compared to drugs and alcohol. The crime and family damage potential just isn't there so it's not perceived as a serious societal threat. Smoking for the most part is not a barrier to leading a "normal" life.

[Necro]

ok.

I am a tenant at the New Gate Apartments.

I have been to Crossroads.

I know the staff, the struggles of addiction.

Whats missing here is the personal stories, the road to addiction, as it were.

Some seem so compelled to paint a broad stoke when dealing with "those people", "they", have made poor personal choices, "they", are not deserving of any chances due simply to "their", poor lack of judgment"

Let's get serious.

I'm going to pose questions, you're going to say "awww poor baby".

More than several tenants here have been brutally abused at the hands of their parents, now I am not talking about a slap in the back of the head, no, I am talking about Rape, I am talking about being beaten to the point of Coma, I am talking about parents getting wasted and punching the s**t out of their kids, letting them get physically and emotionally abused by the people we as a general public assume have the best interest of these individuals at heart.

Abuse does not know colour, creed, gender, nor financial status, it is painful, and leaves those who have suffered it often times with more than they can bare.

No-one here wants to bare these scars any longer. All of us want freedom from the nightmares.

I live in Canada, I live in a country where personal freedom is coveted, I paid, dutifully, my taxes for more than 25 years.

I am entitled to help when I need it, as I have afforded help before me, and I still work, and I will always work.

Point your hatred at me, your questions at me, but do not point your pity at me no, it is I who point my pity at you, and all those that would ever raise their hand to the cornerstone of your wisdom.

..

[theyeti]

thank u sir or miss for your truthful and relevant post . most ppl have not the courage to bring up these issues .

[Necro]

thank u sir or miss for your truthful and relevant post . most ppl have not the courage to bring up these issues .

thank you, I really, really mean that.

[fluffy]

Some seem so compelled to paint a broad stoke when dealing with "those people", "they", have made poor personal choices, "they", are not deserving of any chances due simply to "their", poor lack of judgment"

Invariably these are people who have had little or no in-depth experience with addicts/addiction. The idea that an addict's thought processes are basically different from "normal" people is foreign to them so they can't help but view the issue in their own terms. No insult intended, but they just don't get it.

[theyeti]

because they r so much better than us lowly common folk

[cv23]

Necro , could you explain the link between your very eloquent physical abuse post and the lack of available funding the Crossroads treatment facility is facing which after all is the topic of this thread?
You say you attended Crossroads, are you a success story?
What do you think the problems are that have resulted in Crossroads losing money to the point they are forced to close?
Could you also tell us other than paying the same taxes all working people in Canada pay what you have given back to the system that has given you treatment for some form of addiction?