Kelowna Rail Closure

[Anonymous123]

Pretty simple Anonymous123 they have an area big enough to store raw logs, Tolko mill does not so they store raw logs in Okanagan Lake as those who owned it before i.e Riverside, Fletcher Challenge, Crown Forest Industries, Crown Zellerbach

Correct, as well as the fact that TFL 49 and the Forest License are situated on the west side of Okanagan Lake, which makes booming and towing far more affordable than an extra hour each way of trucking from the log dump to the mill. It also keeps hundreds of logging trucks from adding to traffic congestion and helps air quality.

Gormans licenses aren't near their mill and yet they truck in the raw product and still manage to make it. Having said that I'm not for or against the mill being where it is, just saying that not all mills are on the water. My comments are in response to Lady tehMa and cv23's assumption that mills need to be "on the water".

[LoneWolf_53]

There are other places to put a mill. Why does it need to be downtown? That made sense in the 50's but it doesn't make sense anymore. That's why you don't see people putting in mills in downtown anymore...lol. If people are gonna lose their job over a mill closing it's not going to be because it's being kicked out of downtown but because they can't make enough money to keep it opened regardless of where it's located or moved to.

So let me get this straight, you're peeved off at the mill, that was there long before the land was viewed as "downtown", and newcomers encroached on its turf, and you want to boot them out, that about right?

If anyone should be peeved it's the mill at the plethora of NIMBY's it's surrounded by.

I'm sure when it's no longer a viable business, and it makes more sense to sell the real estate and shut her down, taking a lot of well paying jobs with it, you'll then be crying about how there aren't any good paying jobs in Kelowna. LOL

[Cumungala]

The Tolko Mill has been planning on building a district heating system that will transport exhaust energy from the mill to heat various places downtown. If this goes ahead then the sawmill is not going anywhere anytime soon. Everybody will just have to deal with it. Things could be a whole lot worse, we could have a pulp mill or a petrochemicals plant, but people are complaining about a sawmill? Really? I have no problem at all with this mill or its location and I would be totally fine with them continuing operations on Manhattan Point. Nobody living in the North End and ESPECIALLY nobody in the high rises on Sunset should be complaining as the mill has been there the longest of anything in that area. If you don't like it then you should probably move!

[KL3-Something]

I actually quite enjoy when I walk outside downtown and can smell the woody odour of the mill as you often can.

Mind you, I come from a family that mostly worked in the forest industry. So I'm sure the enjoyment is at least one part nostalgia.

I hope it stays for a long time to come. But I also know that Kelowna is not industry friendly and the forest industry is already on it's knees around here.

[Lady tehMa]

I actually quite enjoy when I walk outside downtown and can smell the woody odour of the mill as you often can.

Mind you, I come from a family that mostly worked in the forest industry. So I'm sure the enjoyment is at least one part nostalgia.

I hope it stays for a long time to come. But I also know that Kelowna is not industry friendly and the forest industry is already on it's knees around here.

Ditto that KL3, my Dad worked in mills most his life. I love the perfume of fresh-cut wood in the air, smells so good!

Gormans licenses aren't near their mill and yet they truck in the raw product and still manage to make it. Having said that I'm not for or against the mill being where it is, just saying that not all mills are on the water. My comments are in response to Lady tehMa and cv23's assumption that mills need to be "on the water".

The mill was built on the water in a time where water transport made the most sense. It still makes sense for them now. If Gorman's had an option that would cause them to spend less for transport, do you think they'd take it? Why would Tolko want to pay more to transport - or to move; does that make fiscal sense to you? O.o

[TheDudeAbides]

Ditto that KL3, my Dad worked in mills most his life. I love the perfume of fresh-cut wood in the air, smells so good!

Sounds like you people should put on your prince george dinner jackets and get together for a reunion or something. Reminiscing about saw mills. The industry has been slowly dying for a long time. Pulp mills too.

With ebooks and most things done electronically now, the world apparently uses only about 30% of the paper it used only 10 years ago. It's called progress. When I hear people reminiscing and getting sentimental about the good old days I roll my eyes. That is just living in the past and the past is gone. If it doesn't make sense any more get rid of it.

[Liquidnails]

According to the Economist, and other sources, paper usage has actually increased over the years, and is still on the rise.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicd ... ly-chart-0

Edit to say that the pulp and paper industry is still suffering though because all of our mills are old, outdated and expensive to run. It's hard to compete with South American and Asian producers with cheap labour, less regulation and more efficient processes.

[cv23]

If it doesn't make sense any more get rid of it.

And just how are you now the one to determine what "doesn't make sense any more" in and for Kelowna?

[Gilchy]

Sounds like you people should put on your prince george dinner jackets and get together for a reunion or something. Reminiscing about saw mills. The industry has been slowly dying for a long time. Pulp mills too.

With ebooks and most things done electronically now, the world apparently uses only about 30% of the paper it used only 10 years ago. It's called progress. When I hear people reminiscing and getting sentimental about the good old days I roll my eyes. That is just living in the past and the past is gone. If it doesn't make sense any more get rid of it.

Let me know when they can build houses out of epaper, and then we can declare the demise of the lumber industry.

[2manyfords]

Yeah,

Last time I looked, most new home construction was built from milled lumber. Or should we give up on lumber mills altogether, and start "outsourcing" the stuff that is available in pretty much our own backyards. When the cost of lumber skyrockets because it is not "viable" to have it fairly local, most would probably complain because they cant afford a new stick-built house, or to renovate their existing home.........

Seriously, how much industry needs to move/ shut down before it's realized if affects everyone. I for one could not live off of a service/ tourism industry wage.

[TheDudeAbides]

Let me know when they can build houses out of epaper, and then we can declare the demise of the lumber industry.

Lol...once again, is a mill in downtown Kelowna the only source of that wood? Are the wood products they make magical wood products? Is there special fairy dust they use on that wood that can only be found in downtown Kelowna that must be applied right away? Hehe...you people really crack me up.

[TheDudeAbides]

According to the Economist, and other sources, paper usage has actually increased over the years, and is still on the rise.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicd ... ly-chart-0

Edit to say that the pulp and paper industry is still suffering though because all of our mills are old, outdated and expensive to run. It's hard to compete with South American and Asian producers with cheap labour, less regulation and more efficient processes.

That article apparently is coming up with that conclusion by starting out in 1980. No way to be sure what numbers they are using because they don't post any. Also it isn't hard to see why computers caused a surge in paper use. It made it so easy to waste page after page with printers.

Here is an article that does prove the data. Follow the money.
http://blog.infotrends.com/?p=12291

Paper use is declining in N. America and N. America is by far the largest consumer of it so......

Also, that trend is expected to spread as tablets/e-readers get cheaper and less than 1st world countries start transitioning to electronic records. Also, newspapers. That's a huge use of paper that is more or less obsolete now. It's like reading yesterdays news because the same stories were online the day before. You get ink on your fingers. Magazines....it just all seems so primitive now.

Stick a fork in it and 40% of the wood industry is pulp and paper so....

Where do those wood chips from Tolko go? What happens when there isn't anywhere for them to go anymore? I think this rail closure is just the beginning.

[Catri]

What's the economic benefit of getting rid of the mill? What land use would you propose for that site that would provide comparable local jobs and contribute on the same scale to the local economy?

[TheDudeAbides]

What's the economic benefit of getting rid of the mill? What land use would you propose for that site that would provide comparable local jobs and contribute on the same scale to the local economy?

DE TOOK ERR JAAABS!


For the 3rd time...they can move the mill or build a new one if it's still viable. I swear it's like idiocracy around here sometimes...haha.

[GordonH]

For the 3rd time...they can move the mill or build a new one if it's still viable.

So do you have knowledge that Kelowna Tolko mill is closing down, when will this happen and does Fortis know about this.