Another serious vehicle accident on Hwy 97

[zookeeper]

I'm talking about science here, not emotion. There is no scientific evidence that Okanagan drivers are worse than elsewhere, but there is scientific evidence that roads can be made safer.

I do not know much about road construction, but I can tell you after I moved out of the Okanagan my ICBC rate went down. When I asked why it was so much cheaper I was told the accident rate was much lower in the area that I live. I drive the highways here frequently and am shocked to see how many people keep well within the speed limit after driving the Okanagan highways for many years where you could be doing over the limit and people would pass you like you are standing still. I am going to go on side with jimmy4321.

[Woodenhead]

I'm talking about science here, not emotion. There is no scientific evidence that Okanagan drivers are worse than elsewhere, but there is scientific evidence that roads can be made safer.

I do not know much about road construction, but I can tell you after I moved out of the Okanagan my ICBC rate went down. When I asked why it was so much cheaper I was told the accident rate was much lower in the area that I live. I drive the highways here frequently and am shocked to see how many people keep well within the speed limit after driving the Okanagan highways for many years where you could be doing over the limit and people would pass you like you are standing still. I am going to go on side with jimmy4321.

Going with my own experiences with living in different areas + insurance, I will side with Glacier. It's not really any worse here than most other places.
IIRC, statistically, the most dangerous provinces to drive in are Saskatchewan and Yukon.

[harblz]

Almost inevitably, when there's an accident on 97 that involves someone crossing the center line, the commentary amounts to: "Those durn kids and their texting, probably speeding too". Just as (almost) inevitably, the accident was because an older driver had a medical event/emergency on the road.

[zookeeper]

Speed
• More stats, tips and videos from ICBC on speeding.
Fatal victims where speed*
was a contributing factor, by region and in B.C.
2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 5-year
average
British Columbia (total) 133 133 113 96 100 115
Lower Mainland 38 32 30 25 26 31
Vancouver Island 19 19 18 12 10 16
Southern Interior 53 56 37 34 49 46
North Central 23 26 28 23 15 23
Unknown 0 0 0 2 0 1
*
Speed: Includes exceeding speed limit, excessive speed over 40 km/h and driving too fast for conditions.
Fatal victim: Refers to a road user who died within 30 days after the date when an injury was sustained
in a crash involving at least one motor vehicle. Excludes roads where the Motor Vehicle Act does not
apply, such as forest-service roads, industrial roads and private driveways. Also excludes off-road
snowmobile crashes, homicides and suicides.
5-year averages for fatal victim counts are rounded up to the nearest whole number.
Source: Police Traffic Accident System (as of July 31, 2013).

Distraction
• More stats, tips and videos from ICBC on distracted driving.
Fatal victims where distraction*
was a contributing factor, by region and in B.C.
2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 5-year
average
British Columbia (total) 91 99 101 79 81 91
Lower Mainland 32 38 35 22 28 31
Vancouver Island 19 18 16 5 9 14
Southern Interior 31 33 37 33 35 34
North Central 9 10 13 18 9 12
Unknown 0 0 0 1 0 1
*
Distraction: Includes use of communication/video equipment, driver inattentive and driver internal/
external distraction.
Fatal victim: Refers to a road user who died within 30 days after the date when an injury was sustained
in a crash involving at least one motor vehicle. Excludes roads where the Motor Vehicle Act does not
apply, such as forest-service roads, industrial roads and private driveways. Also excludes off-road
snowmobile crashes, homicides and suicides.
5-year averages for fatal victim counts are rounded up to the nearest whole number.
Source: Police Traffic Accident System (as of July 31, 2013).



High-risk driving
• More stats, tips and fact sheet from ICBC on high-risk driving.
Fatal victims where high-risk driving behaviour*
was a contributing factor, by region
and in B.C.
2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 5-year
average
British Columbia (total) 176 172 159 134 133 155
Lower Mainland 52 49 49 42 46 48
Vancouver Island 28 25 24 17 15 22
Southern Interior 64 67 54 48 56 58
North Central 32 31 32 25 16 28
Unknown 0 0 0 2 0 1
*
High-risk driving behaviour: Includes failing to yield right of way, following too closely, ignoring a
traffic control device, improper passing and speed.
Fatal victim: Refers to a road user who died within 30 days after the date when an injury was sustained
in a crash involving at least one motor vehicle. Excludes roads where the Motor Vehicle Act does not
apply, such as forest-service roads, industrial roads and private driveways. Also excludes off-road
snowmobile crashes, homicides and suicides.
5-year averages for fatal victim counts are rounded up to the nearest whole number.
Source: Police Traffic Accident System (as of July 31, 2013).


Driving too fast for conditions
• ICBC’s fact sheet on unsafe speed.
Fatal victims where driving too fast for conditions was a contributing factor,
by region and in B.C.
2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 5-year
average
British Columbia (total) 62 57 44 45 54 53
Lower Mainland 10 7 6 5 11 8
Vancouver Island 8 12 5 6 6 8
Southern Interior 28 27 21 20 30 26
North Central 16 11 12 12 7 12
Unknown 0 0 0 2 0 1
Fatal victim: Refers to a road user who died within 30 days after the date when an injury was sustained
in a crash involving at least one motor vehicle. Excludes roads where the Motor Vehicle Act does not
apply, such as forest-service roads, industrial roads and private driveways. Also excludes off-road
snowmobile crashes, homicides and suicides.
5-year averages for fatal victim counts are rounded up to the nearest whole number.
Source: Police Traffic Accident System (as of July 31, 2013).



http://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/newsroom ... istics.pdf

[Silverstarqueen]

quote="Silverstarqueen"And the powers that be are talking about increasing the maximum speed on B.C. highways. Now while speed does not cause vehicles to cross the line, allowing higher speeds can't be a good thing until people learn to drive. Is it the summer heat rotting people's brains? Focus on the @#$% road and not whatever else you thought was more important than arriving alive./quote
We don't know what caused this accident, but it is safe to say everyone makes mistakes at one point. When you have a poorly designed highway with ever increasing traffic, there will be more accidents than say a highway that was designed properly. Example: Count the number of accidents between Vernon and Kelowna, and compare this to the number of accidents between Hope and Abbotsford. Or compare this to the number of accidents on the 4 lane divided section east of Kamloops.

Hopefully everyone makes a full recovery from this latest accident.

I don't think you can design a highway for drivers who fall asleep at the wheel, or are grossly inattentive to the task at hand. Unless we go to the automatically driven cars like the ones they are testing (in California I believe). But I think we are a long way from using that technologie. The design of that highway was not the problem, it was, as usual, pilot error. I'm sorry but "everyone makes mistakes" is not cutting it for having several lives at stake while you drive a vehicle down the road. Short of having an undiagnosed medical condition suddenly strike them , the driver is responsible for being sleep or alcohol impaired while driving.

[Glacier]

I don't think you can design a highway for drivers who fall asleep at the wheel, or are grossly inattentive to the task at hand.

That is true, but you can design a highway so that when this happens the carnage is mitigated. If you have a median 6 inches from the yellow line (as is the case here), it takes 0.1 seconds of unattive driving to cause the car to hit and jump the median (which is only 8 inches high in this location). On the other hand, if you have a 30 foot wide median like say heading into Kamloops, and the driver has a 1 second lapse in consentration, he will still have time to prevent himself from hitting the oncoming traffic.

Are the drivers really that much better in Kamloops than Vernon, or is it that the highway was better designed?

[Woodenhead]

http://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/newsroom ... istics.pdf

...and going by province, BC falls somewhere in the middle. (Plus ICBC stats aren't ones that I fully trust on a good day. But that's irrelevant)

Are the drivers really that much better in Kamloops than Vernon, or is it that the highway was better designed?

Exactly. Correlation vs. causation.

[zookeeper]

...and going by province, BC falls somewhere in the middle. (Plus ICBC stats aren't ones that I fully trust on a good day. But that's irrelevant)

I never said I moved out of province. I have driven all over Canada and the United States, I don't believe your roads are the problem.

And yes, because even ICBC is just being emotional, and making up fake statistics just to make out that Okanagan (and area) drivers may be the worst in the province as far as speed and inattention. Maybe instead of highway barriers someone should just build a bubble over the whole Okanagan.

[Woodenhead]

Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is interesting, but what they hide is crucial.

[Glacier]

Maybe instead of highway barriers someone should just build a bubble over the whole Okanagan.

That's just silly talk. You can never eliminate risk, but you can mitigate it, which is why safety is a two pronged approach. The first is enforcement and education, and the second is road design.