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Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby Scrobins94 » Oct 26th, 2017, 12:29 am

WalterWhite wrote:
Scrobins94 wrote:Of course it would get voted down, it's not in Rutland. Cheers to City Council. :130: :biggrin:


Thanks for contributing an uninformed and completely irrelevant comment. Has absolutely nothing to do with "where" it's located - and everything to do with following existing guidelines and permit processes - or in this particular case, the lack thereof.


Everyone makes mistakes. Seems to me like he is trying to rectify things.

Oh and before you point fingers you might want to look at yourself in the mirror.
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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby 713mace » Oct 26th, 2017, 1:23 am

Hey wake up 'gold-bick-hired-goons' Agri-Tourism is a facade, the kibosh on Kuiper is strictly a cause-stalking enterprise along with City Hall with Agriculture BC geneology failed experiment of attempting to price-out and evict Kuiper from his property at an assessed land value far less than being located in a key area that many 'neighbourly types' and central to City of Kelowna Counselmen and it's neighbours- would love to sink their teeth and get their greedy paws on. The area being a host to a number of Hutch and other trailer park property owners, denigrating property and home owners as close to being located directly across the street from this farmer's property. Oblivious that the City itself has no interest in shutting down and obvious the City is turning a blind eye to. Kuiper's property A fugazi-agri-disneyland winery that no-one attended and no one cares about now having to close? The Winery Denizens remodel of a City Hall hocus-pocus property scheme takeover ere takeover of chartered rights obstructors whose City Counselors had inadvertantly made Canada seem like gentrification capital-central and the one and only answer to generating non-existant bogus agri tourist dollars in the name of supporting its citizens that reside in an approved signature Agri Tourist Trailer Park out in the cold Dec. 1st, 2017 subjugation and against the law relative of eviction in BC between the months of Oct. to May? The problem is in 'Agri Tourism' and it's migrant workers from all over the world who reside temporarily in the area, use a number of 'other locatons' while farmer Kuiper has hosted camping fruit pickers from other Orchards and properties in the area that recently proven- have been staying there where are they going to go? Informatively, these abodes exist next door and across from Farmer Kuiper's Trailer Park at Frequency Winery.Why this will never work with City Hall Hired Goons. Bogus tourist dollars, "No" to all in support of Farmers and Trailer Park Tenants based upon Agricultural Development Neighbourhood and in a bogus City Hall Pissing Contest doondoggle. Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Asking myself as to Where's the forced accommodations evacuation plan of next year for these orchard fruit pickers where are they going to stay in favour of Kuiper's Trailer Parkland. Willow Creek Trailer Park and Campground Air BNB on Lakeshore Blvd.? City Hall better hope they have the IHA (Interior Health Authorities) to cover accommodations of it's residence or one can actually hear a pen scratching BCHRT form being filled out in the background. Can Kuiper fight City Hall Goons a Third Time and Win? Is there any retrodiction to this vote being scrutinized by MLA's or MP's who do the Tenants complain to obviously they can not be blamed!?
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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby Calvin r Kuipers » Oct 26th, 2017, 3:00 am

Calvin Kuipers
3317 McCulloch Road
Kelowna, BC V1W 4G4

This is the exact letter to the advisory council, I am done with you people. If you want to slam me slam me.
It was a sorce of income. It's over now, I have 1 month to comply.


May 5, 2017


City of Kelowna

To whom it may concern:

In 2008, I began the installation of a ten unit RV Park on my 14.2 acre property on McCulloch Road in East Kelowna. I have put in considerable time and money into this park to make it operational. The site was carefully chosen so there would be minimal impact on the farming value of the property. It is located in the lower southwest corner of the property and is accessed from Gulley Road which runs along the south perimeter of the property.

This portion of the property is not useful farm property as there is a high water table combined with a hard-pack soil layer which limits plant growth. Prior to my father purchasing this property, it had been planted in native table grapes by the previous owner; however, there was a large bare area in this corner of the property. My father removed the table grapes and planted apples on the entire property; again, apples planted in this southwest corner of the property did not survive. Eventually the apples were removed and for several years the property was used for summering cattle which were purchased in the spring and sold in the fall.

Wanting to make better use of this property, and also in 2008, my wife and I decided to plant six acres of the property in wine grapes. We used the southeast part of the property, bordered by McCulloch Road and Gulley Road because it gave the best east-west orientation for the grapes, and although we avoided planting grapes in the extreme southwest corner due to previous experience of poor survival rates of plants, and to our decision to operate an RV Park in this no-grow zone, we also experienced extreme losses of vines at the western border of our vineyard which is closest to the RV Park. Removing dead vines from this area shows lack of root growth due to the hard-pan layer beneath the top soil.

Knowing that there were water issues in spring and early summer in the southwest corner location of the RV Park, I brought in 8 truck-and-pup loads of blast rock to make a solid base for the road, to allow larger RVs to enter the park. In the past several years, I have brought in at least sixteen loads of asphalt grindings to keep the road useable. Even so, there are periods of time when the individual RV sites are too wet to allow RVs to pull in and leave the sites.

Each year for the last 3 years I have dug trenches and installed “French drains” to divert water from the park to city drainage ditches. I have had the city clean the ditch to enable the water to flow away better, but I still have standing water at this time. In most years, this area experiences water issues well into July.

Under the new city bylaws regarding opening and closing dates for RV Parks, the park would therefore be open from August to the end of October. This is not a long enough time period to allow a profitable season. Also, since we are actively farming the property ourselves, we are extremely busy with the vineyard and our other farming activities (lamb, meat chickens, and egg laying chickens), it is a difficult time to have continual turnover of RVs.

For the first few years of operating the RV Park, the park had considerable turnover of RVs. Although I have never had complaints from neighbors, we did experience some incidences of after-hours noise and partying due to short term renters who are in town for a weekend or a week and want to party, make noise and light fires in contravention to the park rules.

Over the past few years, the park has begun to cater to those with low incomes, but with RVs and who want to live in a rural setting on a permanent basis. I charge $500 per month plus power. Typically, disability cheques are around $980, so on average, this leaves them with around $400 per month for other living expenses. Because they live here on a permanent basis they don’t move their trailers and therefore, the water is not an issue. I do not raise my rates in the summer as I am not a greedy person and these people can’t afford higher rents. Frequently, some of the residents of the park do farm labor for us. With only six acres in wine grapes, a small vineyard, it is difficult to attract large numbers of pickers for harvest, or farm labor for installing and removing netting, or for seasonal work with the vines, and so frequently the RV Park residents will assist with needed tasks.

To comply with city bylaws, we have at times attempted to close the RV Park over the winter, but these low-income people have nowhere else to go. They want to continue to live independently in their own RVs. It would be a severe hardship for most of them to have to move, as several of them have mental or physical disabilities. I firmly believe that if the RV Park is forced to close for the winter, the City of Kelowna will have at least four more homeless people on their streets.

2016 was the first year in the history of this property that I showed somewhat of a profit on the property. Diversification is mainly the reason. The R.V. park is instrumental to this income; and having the RV Park provide a year-round income is extremely helpful to our small farm. The property is not large enough to enjoy economies of scale as in some other communities but we do produce some valuable commodities. Over the years, we have sold garlic bulbs, raspberries, tomatoes, meat chickens, lamb, and eggs to supplement the farm income, but my wife and I still need to spend some time working off property in order to keep the farm operational.

The site which the RV Park occupies is not a viable farming area. None of the crops planted there over the past 40 years have done well enough to survive. Now that there is an asphalt road, sewer lines, and power to the 10 satellite spots (although two of these have been permanently discontinued), this piece of property is unable to contribute in any other way to the farm. There is certainly nothing agricultural that can be done on this site from November to March, which is the period of time that the City of Kelowna wants the park to be closed.

With the huge investment needed to develop this RV site, approximately $100,000, due to huge costs for water and electricity, as well as the investment put into planting and maintaining the six acre vineyard, this farm really needs the year round income the RV Park could provide if allowed to stay open year round. In 2013, the vineyard was hit hard by a severe 30 minute hail storm which completely destroyed our grape crop for that year. It was a heartbreaking weather event, to see the crop destroyed and the vines themselves severely damaged. Many of the young vines did not survive the following winter and we have had to replant more than 2000 vines. We would likely not have been able to replace these vines without the year-round income generated by the RV Park. It is not only the loss of the crop and the replacement of the vines, but then the replanted vines take several years to reach the capacity the damaged vines had reached so it is a continual drain on farm income.

I love this property and want to keep farming it. My wife and I frequently give impromptu farm tours to the many tourists who drive past us on McCulloch Road. Many of them have never seen grapes growing, not seen chickens busy scratching the dirt and eating bugs, been close to alpacas, or lambs frolicking in the field, and we are happy to be able to share this wonder with them. I believe we are providing a valuable service and working hard to improve our farm land – we have been picking rocks and producing and adding compost to this property for over 20 years. Please allow our family to continue to farm by granting us non-farm status use for this small piece of our farm and allow us some diversified, non-weather-dependent, and year-round income.

Sincerely,

Calvin Kuipers

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby Padre » Oct 26th, 2017, 4:01 am

Oh ya lets hate on Calvin Kuipers and ignore the fact that this ruling puts 11 MORE ppl with no place to live in 30 days, in the middle of winter...Some of us have the option to move our RV's... but to where ... all the RV parks are closed as per BYLAW... cant move on to residential property BYLAW... cant move to commercial property w/out permits, time, money BYLAW...cant move onto crown land BYLAW...so our only choice is to leave Kelowna, but that's OK were poor and marginalized, u rich TROLLS wont miss us, but others will become truly HOMELESS !! but that's OK because none of u go downtown to see the dozens (100+) homeless that occupy our DT core because of our inept useless BYLAWS that only serve to make Kelowna's "Old Money" richer !!!!!!

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby Padre » Oct 26th, 2017, 4:15 am

Kelowna needs to update RV bylaw

Brenda Carr Apr 5, 2017 0

Editor:

Did you know that our fair city has a bylaw that prohibits any RV over 5,500 kilograms from being parked anywhere on your private property? Since this bylaw (Zoning Bylaw 8000, Section 4.3.7(b)) was enacted years ago, the size of the average RV has increased, as has the population that have such vehicles.

You can drive through almost any neighbourhood today and find RVs of every kind parked on nearly every property.

Even real estate ads boast of properties within our city limits that have “room for all your toys” or “RV parking,” so it seems that having an RV is not an isolated occurrence.

How many folks out there were told that the RV they just spent a good deal of money on cannot be parked on private property? How many prospective home buyers were informed of this city bylaw when they viewed that home with “plenty of RV parking?”

There are virtually no available RV storage spaces in the city, so one wonders what would happen if a complaint was made to every owner of an RV that was over the 5,500-kg limit?

All it takes is one complaint from one person and your RV will have to be moved or you will be levied a fine for every day that the RV remains on your property.

So, although it is spring and many RVers are looking forward to packing up their units and hitting the road to relax and enjoy the beauty of our province in their home away from home, perhaps they had better spend it trying to find a place to store that unit before they are faced with a visit from a city bylaw officer.

Or, perhaps what all owners should be doing is sending a message to our city council that this is a bylaw that is outdated and needs to be changed to reflect current RV ownership and needs.

Brenda Carr, Kelowna

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby W105 » Oct 26th, 2017, 5:01 am

Padre, sorry that your going to be evicted, but Bylaws are in place for a reason...it was your Landlord that knew he wasn't in compliance, so take it up with him..none of us can do whatever we want on our own properties..might seem unfair sometimes, but can you imagine what would happen if it was a free for all ??

on the westside Okanagan RV Park is open all season and is completely empty right now...there also the Raven's Nest that's open all yr (don't know how many spots are available there)
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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby LANDM » Oct 26th, 2017, 5:40 am

713mace wrote:Hey wake up 'gold-bick-hired-goons' Agri-Tourism is a facade, the kibosh on Kuiper is strictly a cause-stalking enterprise along with City Hall with Agriculture BC geneology failed experiment of attempting to price-out and evict Kuiper from his property at an assessed land value far less than being located in a key area that many 'neighbourly types' and central to City of Kelowna Counselmen and it's neighbours- would love to sink their teeth and get their greedy paws on. The area being a host to a number of Hutch and other trailer park property owners, denigrating property and home owners as close to being located directly across the street from this farmer's property. Oblivious that the City itself has no interest in shutting down and obvious the City is turning a blind eye to. Kuiper's property A fugazi-agri-disneyland winery that no-one attended and no one cares about now having to close? The Winery Denizens remodel of a City Hall hocus-pocus property scheme takeover ere takeover of chartered rights obstructors whose City Counselors had inadvertantly made Canada seem like gentrification capital-central and the one and only answer to generating non-existant bogus agri tourist dollars in the name of supporting its citizens that reside in an approved signature Agri Tourist Trailer Park out in the cold Dec. 1st, 2017 subjugation and against the law relative of eviction in BC between the months of Oct. to May? The problem is in 'Agri Tourism' and it's migrant workers from all over the world who reside temporarily in the area, use a number of 'other locatons' while farmer Kuiper has hosted camping fruit pickers from other Orchards and properties in the area that recently proven- have been staying there where are they going to go? Informatively, these abodes exist next door and across from Farmer Kuiper's Trailer Park at Frequency Winery.Why this will never work with City Hall Hired Goons. Bogus tourist dollars, "No" to all in support of Farmers and Trailer Park Tenants based upon Agricultural Development Neighbourhood and in a bogus City Hall Pissing Contest doondoggle. Those who live in glass houses should not throw stones. Asking myself as to Where's the forced accommodations evacuation plan of next year for these orchard fruit pickers where are they going to stay in favour of Kuiper's Trailer Parkland. Willow Creek Trailer Park and Campground Air BNB on Lakeshore Blvd.? City Hall better hope they have the IHA (Interior Health Authorities) to cover accommodations of it's residence or one can actually hear a pen scratching BCHRT form being filled out in the background. Can Kuiper fight City Hall Goons a Third Time and Win? Is there any retrodiction to this vote being scrutinized by MLA's or MP's who do the Tenants complain to obviously they can not be blamed!?


Huh?!?! Can you summarize this into one short sentence?

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby lightspeed » Oct 26th, 2017, 5:51 am

Padre wrote:Kelowna needs to update RV bylaw

Brenda Carr Apr 5, 2017 0

Editor:

Did you know that our fair city has a bylaw that prohibits any RV over 5,500 kilograms from being parked anywhere on your private property? Since this bylaw (Zoning Bylaw 8000, Section 4.3.7(b)) was enacted years ago, the size of the average RV has increased, as has the population that have such vehicles.

You can drive through almost any neighbourhood today and find RVs of every kind parked on nearly every property.

Even real estate ads boast of properties within our city limits that have “room for all your toys” or “RV parking,” so it seems that having an RV is not an isolated occurrence.

How many folks out there were told that the RV they just spent a good deal of money on cannot be parked on private property? How many prospective home buyers were informed of this city bylaw when they viewed that home with “plenty of RV parking?”

There are virtually no available RV storage spaces in the city, so one wonders what would happen if a complaint was made to every owner of an RV that was over the 5,500-kg limit?

All it takes is one complaint from one person and your RV will have to be moved or you will be levied a fine for every day that the RV remains on your property.

So, although it is spring and many RVers are looking forward to packing up their units and hitting the road to relax and enjoy the beauty of our province in their home away from home, perhaps they had better spend it trying to find a place to store that unit before they are faced with a visit from a city bylaw officer.

Or, perhaps what all owners should be doing is sending a message to our city council that this is a bylaw that is outdated and needs to be changed to reflect current RV ownership and needs.

Brenda Carr, Kelowna


Conversely other people don't want these eyesores parked adjacently, blocking the sun, and filling up the neighbourhood. Same with boats and trailers, junkers, projects, cars on blocks,campers, 8 vehicles to a house, 4 motorbikes parked on the street, etc.

If you want all that fully depreciated junk on show go buy an acreage.
"Why does everyone in Kelowna act like they're in Hollywood"

A hermit; a recluse; one of the Okanagan "hill people"

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby 713mace » Oct 26th, 2017, 8:48 am

Landm Huh?!?! Can you summarize this into one short sentence?
Yes simply I can. City Hall won't be truly happy unless they can put up Mario's Towing Signs on every post on Kuiper's Trailerpark property fence line.
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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby 713mace » Oct 26th, 2017, 9:35 am

To do list today..

1. File BCHRT complaint against Kelowna City Mayor and it's Gold-Bricking Councilors.
2. Spray paint Mayor Bahahahaasran's Face with colour tone 'Gold-Brick.'
3. Listen to Snak the Ripper's 'Built like this'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms3-RyjAgR4
4. Then repeat steps recommending to others to do the exact same.

Check~!!!
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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby khutchi » Oct 26th, 2017, 11:15 am

713mace wrote:To do list today..

1. File BCHRT complaint against Kelowna City Mayor and it's Gold-Bricking Councilors.
2. Spray paint Mayor Bahahahaasran's Face with colour tone 'Gold-Brick.'
3. Listen to Snak the Ripper's 'Built like this'. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ms3-RyjAgR4
4. Then repeat steps recommending to others to do the exact same.

Check~!!!


Mace Is straight up going back to the tar and feather days. Kicking it like it's 1774... :chicken:

Have fun in jail :smt045
"History is like a slingshot... the more you go back, the further you'll go."

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby artistwithaflare » Oct 26th, 2017, 11:30 am

lightspeed wrote:
Padre wrote:Kelowna needs to update RV bylaw

Brenda Carr Apr 5, 2017 0

Editor:

Did you know that our fair city has a bylaw that prohibits any RV over 5,500 kilograms from being parked anywhere on your private property? Since this bylaw (Zoning Bylaw 8000, Section 4.3.7(b)) was enacted years ago, the size of the average RV has increased, as has the population that have such vehicles.

You can drive through almost any neighbourhood today and find RVs of every kind parked on nearly every property.

Even real estate ads boast of properties within our city limits that have “room for all your toys” or “RV parking,” so it seems that having an RV is not an isolated occurrence.

How many folks out there were told that the RV they just spent a good deal of money on cannot be parked on private property? How many prospective home buyers were informed of this city bylaw when they viewed that home with “plenty of RV parking?”

There are virtually no available RV storage spaces in the city, so one wonders what would happen if a complaint was made to every owner of an RV that was over the 5,500-kg limit?

All it takes is one complaint from one person and your RV will have to be moved or you will be levied a fine for every day that the RV remains on your property.

So, although it is spring and many RVers are looking forward to packing up their units and hitting the road to relax and enjoy the beauty of our province in their home away from home, perhaps they had better spend it trying to find a place to store that unit before they are faced with a visit from a city bylaw officer.

Or, perhaps what all owners should be doing is sending a message to our city council that this is a bylaw that is outdated and needs to be changed to reflect current RV ownership and needs.

Brenda Carr, Kelowna


Conversely other people don't want these eyesores parked adjacently, blocking the sun, and filling up the neighbourhood. Same with boats and trailers, junkers, projects, cars on blocks,campers, 8 vehicles to a house, 4 motorbikes parked on the street, etc.

If you want all that fully depreciated junk on show go buy an acreage.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
:200: Quote: Conversely other people don't want these eyesores parked adjacently, blocking the sun, and filling up the neighbourhood. Same with boats and trailers, junkers, projects, cars on blocks,campers, 8 vehicles to a house, 4 motorbikes parked on the street, etc.

If you want all that fully depreciated junk on show go buy an acreage.[/quote] :-X

IT MUST BE A HORRIBLE EXISTENCE FOR ANYONE WHO IS BOTHERED BY SOMEONE ELSES BELONGINGS OR APPEARANCE.
''One's mans junk is another mans treasure!'' :up:

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby WalterWhite » Oct 26th, 2017, 8:26 pm

Well this has ended up as whole page of drivel. Here's a thought for you unhappy campers - put the blame on your slumlord that knowingly and intentionally flouted the law that has resulted in you being in the predicament you are. Laws are laws - and just because someone decides to completely ignore those laws, does not automatically mean those laws now need to be changed. Cal thumbed his nose at obtaining the required permits and now - finally - is facing consequences for his actions. No one forced him to do any of the acts he committed in constructing that so-called park without permits and completely ignoring existing bylaws.

What isn't being brought into the equation, is the fact there are at least 3 other very successful RV parks in the S.E. Kelowna area that function very well within these same bylaws that Cal took upon himself to completely ignore. You got scammed by a slumlord - that's not the city's, or anyone else's fault - that responsibility lies square on Cal's shoulders. Make him pay to find your alternative accommodation - he's the one that put you all in the mess you now find yourselves in. Hard cheese.

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby Scrobins94 » Oct 27th, 2017, 1:17 am

^This guy. :1422:

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Re: Back again: Illegal RV Parks on ALR

Postby wanderer » Oct 27th, 2017, 10:52 am

First off this post is not directed at any particular owner of ALR land.

IMO RV Parks should never have been allowed on land in Kelowna that is designated agriculture. It's a Pandora's box I believe the city is now trying to close. Many farms have pieces of land that are not arable, often there are other agricultural uses for it such as barns, sheds, storage, parking of equipment, etc. NOT RV Parks. If you don't feel you can't survive on agriculture land you should never have bought in to it. If you inherited it then sell it and use the proceeds to buy something you can make money on within your skill set. There are many types of agriculture, in this case it sounds like keeping cattle on that piece of land in the summer was the best alternative for keeping it as agriculture, there are agriculture uses if you are imaginative and skilled enough. RV Parks on agriculture land should never have been allowed by the city in the first place. Wasn't it a city counselor who developed the first one? Many of these RV Parks on agriculture land have had work done making it irrevocably non arable ... permanent septic or sewer lines, rock crush and asphalt grindings for fill, etc. To remediate the land so it again has some semblance of arability is claimed to be cost restrictive, of course after the fact of work being done destroying the land. At times it seems these things have been done with the very intent to make it non arable. Many speculators have used these methods to get their land out of the ALR, and in the past the city may have been complicit. My impression is they are trying to change that.

If land is designated agriculture, if it is in the ALR, then people who purchase it have to know this and believe it will stay this way. Do not purchase agriculture land if you ultimately have some other agenda for it. Do not speculate that down the road you will be able to develop it. Do not cry in the future that the value of the land is devalued because of the ALR and you can't sell it to a developer, you knew that you were buying agriculture land in the first place. This has happened too many times in this city, and in this province. Unlike the prairies BC's arable land is limited by mountains, this is the reason we should be protecting all ALR land. Agriculture land in our city is a benefit to the sustainability and prosperity of our city, it's time people realized this.

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