Library adds security

Re: Library adds security

Postby bjsilent » Nov 25th, 2017, 11:36 am

momma2a.sage wrote:Shame on you all for thinking this way. Typical way of Kelowna citizen thinking. Its not the concern for these people that they have a difficult life, but rather that they are unsightly for the town or this odd belief held that they will harm people.

Have you any idea what it is like to be in their shoes? Sure we all struggle, but did you ever stop to wonder what made their lives take that direction? Many of them have gone through experiences in their lives that we could not even compare to, and not for fault of their own, they got involved with drugs to help cure the pain that afflicts/d them. Not all of us are able to afford the ability to live comfortably these days, even the average individual. People who get involved with drugs have an extremely difficult life and there are NOT as many resources as one would think that there are, and the ones that would be helpful to them.... cost money!

Another misconception is that these people are dangerous. Sure, they may do the things as you said above (roaming the computers, using Wifi at Tim Hortons, etc.), but does that make them a person of whom you should be afraid of? How often do you hear in the news "homeless people are becoming violent" in Kelowna? You do hear, however, many stories of average citizens living in this town who are killing each other (friends, spouses, etc.). For instance, the man who killed his girlfriend in the trailer park a few years back.

So my point is, take a moment to think about what you are typing on here and what it would be like if your life had taken a different route because of circumstances that were not under your control.



I say F'em,useless wastes of skin and stop giving them handouts!!!

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Re: Library adds security

Postby momma2a.sage » Nov 25th, 2017, 11:38 am

bjsilent wrote:
momma2a.sage wrote:Shame on you all for thinking this way. Typical way of Kelowna citizen thinking. Its not the concern for these people that they have a difficult life, but rather that they are unsightly for the town or this odd belief held that they will harm people.

Have you any idea what it is like to be in their shoes? Sure we all struggle, but did you ever stop to wonder what made their lives take that direction? Many of them have gone through experiences in their lives that we could not even compare to, and not for fault of their own, they got involved with drugs to help cure the pain that afflicts/d them. Not all of us are able to afford the ability to live comfortably these days, even the average individual. People who get involved with drugs have an extremely difficult life and there are NOT as many resources as one would think that there are, and the ones that would be helpful to them.... cost money!

Another misconception is that these people are dangerous. Sure, they may do the things as you said above (roaming the computers, using Wifi at Tim Hortons, etc.), but does that make them a person of whom you should be afraid of? How often do you hear in the news "homeless people are becoming violent" in Kelowna? You do hear, however, many stories of average citizens living in this town who are killing each other (friends, spouses, etc.). For instance, the man who killed his girlfriend in the trailer park a few years back.

So my point is, take a moment to think about what you are typing on here and what it would be like if your life had taken a different route because of circumstances that were not under your control.



I say F'em,useless wastes of skin and stop giving them handouts!!!


Useless wastes of skin hey? That is somebodies child that you are speaking about. I'd like to know which handouts you think that they are receiving, because as far as I know (I am a Psychology student), there are few, if any available.
Sickening that people think this way.
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Re: Library adds security

Postby bjsilent » Nov 25th, 2017, 3:52 pm

They need to move the KGM

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Re: Library adds security

Postby KelownaCrackinCrew » Nov 25th, 2017, 4:01 pm

A friend of mine wrote this about our local Kelowna library few years back. It's called: "Tom" and the Heavenly Down-and-Outers

I have visited the downtown public library a hundred times, but only on occasion have I marveled at the interesting scenarios that play out there. Most days I just walk in and trawl the bookshelves listlessly or with intent, hungry for something to read during my unproductive week. Today is a bit different. Today is one of those days when I'm especially in the mood to people-watch, imaginatively filling in the blanks of other people's lives while skirting around my own.

In most cities, I've realized, the library, like other government provisions: public hospitals and transport; draws out the best and worst in people. Including me -and often humorously so. On entering I immediately take a detour to my left to pass the small community of homeless men all with varying stages (and styles) of facial hair. They congregate sporadically at the tables and couches of the magazine section. I wonder why there are so many of them. Then I remember you need a fixed personal address in order to borrow anything at the library: because of this, many probably finish their reading here.
I see one man relating an animated incident to his friends. His leathery features have lit up with excitement. Through his smile I see his teeth are going bad like the rot between a picket fence. Most of the other down-and-outers are reading day-old newspapers. Others are sleeping with their heads nesting in the crook of an arm or leaning back with mouths wide open. Baseball caps and threadbare jackets rest on chairs. It seems this is one of the only place where they will not be turned away and thus can unburden themselves.
This is where, at least to me, the homeless seamlessly transform into individuals with habits rather than faceless figures loitering on any corner. By the faint, sweet smell I can tell there's a few guys drinking hard liquor in thermoses. I chuckle to myself when I think how scared any librarian would be to approach the sneaky perps. I envy the solidarity of this whole group. This is something 'normal' people bustling in society never have; and yet these men and few women from its shadows exude it so warmly. What I see in them isn't the grace of poverty, but the decadence of their contentment.

At a far table I spot a regular, he's a guy whom I'll call "Tom." Old-fashioned reading glasses sit squarely on his face while dishevelled hair runs down his neck from beneath his deerhunter. Sitting at a table hunched over what looks like a novel, he obsessively twirls the thick grey of his goatee which is tamed along its length by two rubber bands before moving on to his whiskers. He looks like some aristocrat who's lost everything -including his mind. When he eventually looks up from his reading and ritualistic beard-stroking, I can't help but notice the sudden expression on his face as if he's just returned from far, deep thought to the here-and-now. His trip has obviously pleased him, he smiles as he studies faces around the room. I wish I knew what he was reading, what he liked to read; or better yet his own life story.

I've seen Tom around town from afar smoking his gooseneck pipe or whizzing by on his bicycle. Today though, is the closest I've observed his unassuming yet fascinating nature: king of the street nomads. As I sit around I realize that this section of the library, with its thin scent of newsprint, sweat, and rolled tobacco; has fallen silent save for the turning of pages and the heavy breathing of old men. This library scene has become a window into the poignant immediacy of homelessness. Where most other people merely come to borrow books they read in the loneliness of their sitting rooms; this crowd has found a haven to celebrate little victories over the sadness and slowness of life.

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Re: Library adds security

Postby bjsilent » Nov 25th, 2017, 4:13 pm

Must have been an unusual day cause usually the transients are causing problems all throughout the library on a daily basis,whether it be fighting with each other,shooting up in the bathrooms,stealing books and dvd's and all around being a pain in the :swear: They are constantly being kicked out of there for their disruptive behaviour and harassing people outside the entrance doors for change and or cigarettes.They shouldn't be allowed in the library as far as i am concerned.

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Re: Library adds security

Postby FreeRights » Nov 25th, 2017, 4:35 pm

I agree that a lot of them cause issues, but barring "the homeless" (in general) from the library is discrimination. Barring specific troublemakers, on the other hand, no problem there.

What I find amusing is that your libraries didn't have security previously? I mean, its no wonder that you have a history of issues when there's nobody on site who's duty it is to prevent and directly address these issues.
Come quickly Jesus, we're barely holding on.
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Re: Library adds security

Postby normaM » Nov 25th, 2017, 4:58 pm

If there is no place for them to go when the shelters get them up then a Drop In Centre ( a co- op with workers, etc) could be a viable option. I've noticed DT has several more street people that usual.. pity for them, the shop owners, restuarants and people who want to be DT without getting hit up for money and cigarettes. I don't begrudge as I figure if I can spend like I do a few smokes not going to break the Bank. As for when they ask for money for food I have offered to get them something from Bread Co or Starbucks. Only one guy ever asked for a coffee.
Back home the Boyle street co - op had great success, could work here. OF course they stay central because all the services they use are central. Problem just going to get worse.
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Re: Library adds security

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 25th, 2017, 5:03 pm

Some of these people cause zero problems for anyone.

I gave a poor fella 5 bucks last night at arbys. Felt bad for him with his cart. Its getting cold.


Its strange though. Some i will not help.
The ones who stand in the middle of the road on medians. They get nothing from me. Young guys my age get nothing as well ..

I try to lend a hand to the older folks.
Now they want to take our guns away . That would be just fine. Take em away from the criminals first . Ill gladly give u mine. "Charlie Daniels"

You have got to stand for something . Or you will fall for anything "Aaron Tippin"

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Re: Library adds security

Postby bjsilent » Nov 25th, 2017, 6:51 pm

Jflem1983 wrote:Some of these people cause zero problems for anyone.

I gave a poor fella 5 bucks last night at arbys. Felt bad for him with his cart. Its getting cold.


Its strange though. Some i will not help.
The ones who stand in the middle of the road on medians. They get nothing from me. Young guys my age get nothing as well ..

I try to lend a hand to the older folks.


Most ( about 95% ) i wouldn't give a squirt of :swear: for!!!
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Re: Library adds security

Postby momma2a.sage » Nov 26th, 2017, 2:27 pm

bjsilent wrote:
Jflem1983 wrote:Some of these people cause zero problems for anyone.

I gave a poor fella 5 bucks last night at arbys. Felt bad for him with his cart. Its getting cold.


Its strange though. Some i will not help.
The ones who stand in the middle of the road on medians. They get nothing from me. Young guys my age get nothing as well ..

I try to lend a hand to the older folks.


Most ( about 95% ) i wouldn't give a squirt of :swear: for!!!


Well, I truly feel pity for your way of thinking. I'm sure that if you were going through difficult times in your life (e.g., financially, emotionally, etc.) that some people would come to your aid. Many of these people do not have family to fight for/with them and they end up giving up.

I have spoken with many homeless individuals and gotten to know them on a personal level, and this is the case with many of them. Sure, there are ones out there that truly are terrible human beings and do not deserve an inch of support, but regardless we are still all human beings that have our own story to tell.
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Re: Library adds security

Postby cuba108 » Nov 26th, 2017, 8:42 pm

I'm all for helping the homeless and folks with drug and mental problems. I would have no trouble paying a few more dollars in taxes for increased services. However I do resent them entering yards, homes and stealing anything in sight. I also believe you can be a street person without leaving your trash, needles etc.in public places strown all over the area. All the parks and streets have bins for this, you do not need to be well off to retain a sense of decency and dignity.I leave my cans and bottles in a container in the alley and have regular "clients" that although have mental and drug issues continue to be hard working citizens of society, as opposed to the BMX backpackers who work the nightshift stealing in the Capri area.

.

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Re: Library adds security

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 26th, 2017, 8:51 pm

cuba108 wrote:I'm all for helping the homeless and folks with drug and mental problems. I would have no trouble paying a few more dollars in taxes for increased services. However I do resent them entering yards, homes and stealing anything in sight. I also believe you can be a street person without leaving your trash, needles etc.in public places strown all over the area. All the parks and streets have bins for this, you do not need to be well off to retain a sense of decency and dignity.I leave my cans and bottles in a container in the alley and have regular "clients" that although have mental and drug issues continue to be hard working citizens of society, as opposed to the BMX backpackers who work the nightshift stealing in the Capri area.

.


Years ago. I had a court date. 9 am. I was early. So i bought a ham and cheese croisant at bread co. Went and sat by the clock tower . I watched an older homeless lady pick up all the trash. Out of the small park i was seated in eating. . I felt like she was doing a good service. As she was picking up garbage not bottles. So i gave her 5 bucks. I hope she got a hot coffee for the money. No need to condemn them all. Some are really good people. Others not so much.
Now they want to take our guns away . That would be just fine. Take em away from the criminals first . Ill gladly give u mine. "Charlie Daniels"

You have got to stand for something . Or you will fall for anything "Aaron Tippin"
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Re: Library adds security

Postby FreeRights » Nov 26th, 2017, 9:40 pm

bjsilent wrote:Most ( about 95% ) i wouldn't give a squirt of :swear: for!!!

I find it interesting that you don't want to be prejudged as a bi person in another thread, yet here you're prejudging homeless people.
Come quickly Jesus, we're barely holding on.

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Re: Library adds security

Postby momma2a.sage » Nov 26th, 2017, 11:37 pm

cuba108 wrote:I'm all for helping the homeless and folks with drug and mental problems. I would have no trouble paying a few more dollars in taxes for increased services. However I do resent them entering yards, homes and stealing anything in sight. I also believe you can be a street person without leaving your trash, needles etc.in public places strown all over the area. All the parks and streets have bins for this, you do not need to be well off to retain a sense of decency and dignity.I leave my cans and bottles in a container in the alley and have regular "clients" that although have mental and drug issues continue to be hard working citizens of society, as opposed to the BMX backpackers who work the nightshift stealing in the Capri area.

.


Although I agree with you that stealing and vandalizing is not something that one should be doing, many of them cannot help this. This is all driven by need to use various drugs they have become addicted to. A part of their brain is controlling their reward center (motivations) and I think a lot of people believe that they DO have some control over this, when really they actually have close to zero control. This goes for the unsanitary conditions (needle dropping, trash, etc.), it is a disease in which cannot be cured of them unless they learn to gain the strength back in those parts of their brain.

Funny thing is, I have lived here for over 10 years and have only (maybe) once seen a needle laying around. EVERYBODY leaves trash everywhere, it is not for people to discriminate over the homeless of this problem. I see losers drop garbage, cigarettes, etc., every day in this town out of their ritzy vehicles.
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Re: Library adds security

Postby bjsilent » Nov 27th, 2017, 9:25 am

FreeRights..... I never claimed to be prejudged,the transients and homeless have turned many areas of Kelowna into a :swear: hole!!!! Take a walk downtown and speak with the business owners and then you'll see how frustrated they are with them.They need to relocate the homeless shelter on Leon Ave away from the downtown core and away from Capri mall area and so forth.Will this solve the problem,probably not yet it will make a huge impact to the downtown core.I feel embarrassed for the tourists when they come off the bridge and turn left at the lights then mistakenly right onto Leon Ave.Have you seen Leon Ave lately? People laying all over the place,shopping carts full of :cuss: everywhere,looks like a *bleep* war zone and it's embarrassing for our city.No i'm not saying that they should be out of sight and out of mind but c'mon the homeless shelter needs to clean that mess up,i work close to there and the cops along with city workers are constantly along that stretch of road arresting people and cleaning up the mess and within a few hours its right back to looking like a dump!!!!

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