Kelowna declares war on cars.

Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby JLives » Nov 27th, 2017, 11:45 pm

The HOV lane is just another lane. I haven't really noticed a difference in traffic flow.
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby dirtybiker » Nov 28th, 2017, 12:13 am

Jflem1983 wrote:Without cars. We have no need for roads.


Ya, OK....

Guess the Transport of 99.99% of everything you consume and expel are a non-requirement
for you ?

Good luck with that.

Less non commercial (personal) vehicles on the roadways would be a good start to a more efficient
Transport and Distribution System.

Personal Cons; It would be a real thorn to plenty of personal outings.
>>>>>>> Pros; It would sure make my bringing of goods to the ungrateful masses so much more efficient
and cost effective for them.

Well, getting rid of several lights, add a couple over-passes, oh...and get rid of a whack of really crappy
drivers, and really crappy vehicles and get them on to different modes..

Ya fine....\I'm in.
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 28th, 2017, 4:11 am

dirtybiker wrote:
Jflem1983 wrote:Without cars. We have no need for roads.


Ya, OK....

Guess the Transport of 99.99% of everything you consume and expel are a non-requirement
for you ?

Good luck with that.

Less non commercial (personal) vehicles on the roadways would be a good start to a more efficient
Transport and Distribution System.

Personal Cons; It would be a real thorn to plenty of personal outings.
>>>>>>> Pros; It would sure make my bringing of goods to the ungrateful masses so much more efficient
and cost effective for them.

Well, getting rid of several lights, add a couple over-passes, oh...and get rid of a whack of really crappy
drivers, and really crappy vehicles and get them on to different modes..

Ya fine....\I'm in.


Take away the automobile. We are just hunter gatherers. Praying for rain. Automobile is basically what sets man apart from apes.

If u really want to pay more. U are always invited to volunteer a check to Basran for his crusade against the people . Id keep that quiet if it were me though.
Now they want to take our guns away . That would be just fine. Take em away from the criminals first . Ill gladly give u mine. "Charlie Daniels"

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby alanjh595 » Nov 28th, 2017, 5:38 am

This is certainly giving new life to home delivery from Walmart and Costco. Have you ever seen a lawyer or city council member wearing a suit and carrying his briefcase on a bicycle or on a bus? How would all those golfers get to the golf course on a bike?

Forget about getting a warm pizza delivery. What about the Mom that has 3 kids at 2 different schools with soccer practice and ballet class at 3:30?
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby spooker » Nov 28th, 2017, 7:03 am

lesliepaul wrote:I knew we'd only have to wait a few minutes before you tell us all how you manage your world. I am not going to slam you for "making it work" in what it is you believe in. The vast, vast, vast majority of people cannot duplicate what you brag about incessantly and in the real world change to be like you is not in the cards. I wonder if your circle of friends are on the same page as you? I am thinking get-togethers are fairly thin if preaching and bragging about your lifestyle over others is number 1.


Actually my circle of friends gets bigger all the time ... I joined the carshare in it's infancy and I was one in 50 ... now I'm only one in over 400 ... the number of bikes I see participate in Bike To Work Week grows each year ...

Personally I'm not asking the "vast, vast, vast majority" to change ... I'm realistic enough to know that won't happen ... but so many make claims of things that are "impossible" and I refute that ... as the mode share of active transportation goes up we get closer to a tipping point ...

No, I've seen enough opinions here in the forums to know that I'm not talking to many like-minded people ... it probably talks about the masochist in me that I keep trying ... but people are getting fed up with our current situation ... and they are looking for other solutions ...

Are you expecting Kelowna to stay it's car-loving self while the rest of the world changes around us? Will that keep you happy?
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 28th, 2017, 7:21 am

spooker wrote:
lesliepaul wrote:I knew we'd only have to wait a few minutes before you tell us all how you manage your world. I am not going to slam you for "making it work" in what it is you believe in. The vast, vast, vast majority of people cannot duplicate what you brag about incessantly and in the real world change to be like you is not in the cards. I wonder if your circle of friends are on the same page as you? I am thinking get-togethers are fairly thin if preaching and bragging about your lifestyle over others is number 1.


Actually my circle of friends gets bigger all the time ... I joined the carshare in it's infancy and I was one in 50 ... now I'm only one in over 400 ... the number of bikes I see participate in Bike To Work Week grows each year ...

Personally I'm not asking the "vast, vast, vast majority" to change ... I'm realistic enough to know that won't happen ... but so many make claims of things that are "impossible" and I refute that ... as the mode share of active transportation goes up we get closer to a tipping point ...

No, I've seen enough opinions here in the forums to know that I'm not talking to many like-minded people ... it probably talks about the masochist in me that I keep trying ... but people are getting fed up with our current situation ... and they are looking for other solutions ...

Are you expecting Kelowna to stay it's car-loving self while the rest of the world changes around us? Will that keep you happy?



I think the city needs to change itself physically before any major attitude or paradigm shift. The way it is now. All the jobs are located on the outskirts of town . For the most part well away from most peoples homes.

For me riding a bike to get around . I dont know if i could. I would happily try it once though.
I know in my case. I work out of town and a vehicle is 100 percent needed every time.

I do sorta envy those that do not have to drive 50000km a year
Now they want to take our guns away . That would be just fine. Take em away from the criminals first . Ill gladly give u mine. "Charlie Daniels"

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby AlienSoldier » Nov 28th, 2017, 8:31 am

What many people who use vehicles fail to realise is that transit helps to reduce traffic and thus help those who NEED a vehicle. Yes you are paying additional taxes to fix transit, but that is because it was never really invested in. For it to become a viable solution you have to invest in it first, then the benefits will be seen by those who use transit and those who require a vehicle to move around the City.

The current status quo will not work for a growing City like Kelowna, the highway cannot be ever expanded, building another bridge will only reduce traffic until more houses are built in West Kelowna.

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby Omnitheo » Nov 28th, 2017, 9:08 am

Wow this thread. So many things to address.

Someone just mentioned Nelson and Mission.
I was in Nelson last week for work. Once I got into town I didn’t set foot in my vehicle until I left town. It’s a very lovely town to walk through, and I walked to and from work, to and from dinner, and all around town. Up the hills to the parks. Nelson is a city of hills, but they have staircases everywhere. Makes it easy to get up those hills if need be. I’m in Mission next week. I will likely be doing the same.

I will agree that kelowna transit is far from perfect. To say that the buses are empty and unused though is simply wrong. I took the buses for 15 years. For 5 of these I owned a vehicle but still rarely used it in favour of the bus. I eventually stopped using the bus however when it became too unreliable. Bus drivers would frequently rush by my stop 5-10 minutes ahead of schedule. And when the buses are half an hour or more apart, this could result in be being late for work. This unfortunately happened so frequently that I was eventually forced to abandon transit. Additionally the stops were at the base of a hill resulting in a 20 min walk to and from the closest stop. Kelowna does need better transit options. Our transit system needs to join the 21st century. In cities outside BC I can order an Uber or Lyft and see where the vehicle is on an app on my phone. Perhaps it’s time to equip the buses in this way? Would also maybe discourage the buses from rushing through their route so they’re early to a timed stop and have time for a smoke break.

Highway through town...this comes up often. Realistically though nearly all highway traffic is local. Studies showed that for bridge traffic, less than 6% is through traffic that doesn’t originate from the Central Okanagan. In essence, you can ignore the 97 markers and just treat it as Harvey Ave and its really just another major road in town. Furthermore, adding extra lanes to Harvey will NOT reduce traffic. It will only increase it. I know it’s diffiult to understand, but adding lanes to roads and adding new roads does not alleviate traffic problems, it only adds to this. This is urban planning 101. The solution to traffic congestion is never new roads. It’s to provide alternatives to roads and to eliminate the need for everyone to use those roads (more urban centres, increased density etc).

HOV lanes. The only problem with these is the utter lack of adherence. I would love to see these ones actually enforced by the police. As it is now, virtually nobody in these lanes has additional passengers. This defeats the entire purpose. Negates the incentive to carpool, and leaves this lane busier than it should be and this harder to merge through to turn off the highway. Honestly if the police need to reach their ticket quota for the month, they should just set up shop at Spall and Harvey and watch all the vehicles using this lane with no additional occupants, and remaining in it for several city blocks without using it to turn.these lanes are excellent in cities that properly manager then. When they go unenforced though they are pointless.
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby Jflem1983 » Nov 28th, 2017, 9:28 am

Id agree with most of this. I am curios what routes u were riding. The only bus i see with people on it is the 97. The 1 bus used to be busy when kss was downtown at school hours. Other than that. I see a lot of empty seats.
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby techrtr » Nov 28th, 2017, 9:34 am

Several years ago there was a study that said there were more cars per capita in Kelowna than any other city in BC. Wonder if that's still true.

With all this talk about reducing emissions, why is it that I still keep seeing @$$hats driving around in diesel trucks, rolling coal?
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby Froskii » Nov 28th, 2017, 9:47 am

What about us people that drive our cars for a living. We have no choice but to drive to work i need my car for my job. How would these changes affect me?? Not in a good way it would just drive me farther into poverty. How about some huge tax breaks for people that use there vehicles for work if they purchase electric instead?? Start giving incentives to go green instead of punishing the people who can't afford to go green or need a car for work.

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby AlienSoldier » Nov 28th, 2017, 10:06 am

Froskii wrote:What about us people that drive our cars for a living. We have no choice but to drive to work i need my car for my job. How would these changes affect me?? Not in a good way it would just drive me farther into poverty. How about some huge tax breaks for people that use there vehicles for work if they purchase electric instead?? Start giving incentives to go green instead of punishing the people who can't afford to go green or need a car for work.


If alternative transportation can be provided and people start using it, it might be a net benefit for you. It would allow for less traffic therefore less stop and go and reduced gas consumption.

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby AlienSoldier » Nov 28th, 2017, 10:08 am

Jflem1983 wrote:Id agree with most of this. I am curios what routes u were riding. The only bus i see with people on it is the 97. The 1 bus used to be busy when kss was downtown at school hours. Other than that. I see a lot of empty seats.


I've always heard that Kelowna Transit is private, it might be a good idea to revisit the contract. Similar to the Skytrain if its written in favour of the private company you could be compensating them for the reduced riders which means they still make there money and its in their best interest to only run on high revenue area's while reducing other areas. Currently SNC gets money from the government when Skytrain ridership numbers don't match up to the estimates provided under their contract.

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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby spooker » Nov 28th, 2017, 10:31 am

techrtr wrote:With all this talk about reducing emissions, why is it that I still keep seeing @$$hats driving around in diesel trucks, rolling coal?


As one of those with a diesel truck, since switching from gasoline I have seen my driving decrease because it makes me think about it more ... it's not pretty I admit but I'm in the same boat as a lot of people and have to live within my means ...

Froskii wrote:What about us people that drive our cars for a living. We have no choice but to drive to work i need my car for my job. How would these changes affect me?? Not in a good way it would just drive me farther into poverty. How about some huge tax breaks for people that use there vehicles for work if they purchase electric instead?? Start giving incentives to go green instead of punishing the people who can't afford to go green or need a car for work.


Are you able to claim the mileage you do for work on your taxes? Or can you expense your gas expenses to the business? Things like what was discussed in the article are more targeted at the "convenience" driver, for people that have the need to use their vehicle for work there are avenues that do not directly dig into your wallet.

Yes, more does need to be done to get electric out there ... slowly we're seeing charging stations get installed in more places ... would be interesting to dig up some current cost/km comparison of gas vs bchydro vs fortis ...
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Re: Kelowna declares war on cars.

Postby techrtr » Nov 28th, 2017, 11:09 am

spooker wrote:
techrtr wrote:With all this talk about reducing emissions, why is it that I still keep seeing @$$hats driving around in diesel trucks, rolling coal?


As one of those with a diesel truck, since switching from gasoline I have seen my driving decrease because it makes me think about it more ... it's not pretty I admit but I'm in the same boat as a lot of people and have to live within my means ...

Froskii wrote:What about us people that drive our cars for a living. We have no choice but to drive to work i need my car for my job. How would these changes affect me?? Not in a good way it would just drive me farther into poverty. How about some huge tax breaks for people that use there vehicles for work if they purchase electric instead?? Start giving incentives to go green instead of punishing the people who can't afford to go green or need a car for work.


Are you able to claim the mileage you do for work on your taxes? Or can you expense your gas expenses to the business? Things like what was discussed in the article are more targeted at the "convenience" driver, for people that have the need to use their vehicle for work there are avenues that do not directly dig into your wallet.

Yes, more does need to be done to get electric out there ... slowly we're seeing charging stations get installed in more places ... would be interesting to dig up some current cost/km comparison of gas vs bchydro vs fortis ...


I have a diesel truck too but I don't drive around rolling coal and deliberately creating even more pollution than I have to.

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