The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Glacier » Jan 23rd, 2018, 10:08 am

Often times I've read that Kelowna is the 9th busiest airport in Canada, and sometimes, I've read 10th busiest.

This is #FakeNews. Kelowna has never in Canadian history been one of the 10 busiest airports in Canada.

Now, 20-something years ago, it was the same size as Penticton and Kamloops, and is now more than double both of those airports combined today, so maybe it will become the 9th or 10th largest in Canada in the coming years, but the media never lets the facts get in the way of a good story, so it invents a top 10 status years before it becomes a reality.

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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Jhunter199 » Jan 23rd, 2018, 10:31 am

http://theprovince.com/business/by-the- ... -in-canada


Perhaps you are looking at number of aircraft annually where Kelowna isn't even on most top 20 lists,
but if your going by annual passengers they are in the 9-11 range the last few years.
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Even Steven » Jan 23rd, 2018, 11:01 am

Jhunter199 wrote:Perhaps you are looking at number of aircraft annually where Kelowna isn't even on most top 20 lists,
but if your going by annual passengers they are in the 9-11 range the last few years.


I think that just means Kelowna airport does hardly anything but passenger flights. All other airports on top of passenger flights also service a whole plethora of flights starting from private, transport, freight, courier, etc. Kelowna doesn't have much of it, but they do move a lot of passengers.

Still doesn't mean it's "one of the busiest"
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby RVThereYet » Jan 23rd, 2018, 12:00 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... _in_Canada

According to Wiki, in any category they deem important enough to measure, YLW has only been in the top 10 once in the past few years, and that was in 2010 for passenger traffic (1,365,113). Other than that it shows up pretty consistently in 11th place for passenger movement behind YYJ (Victoria). YLW made the top 20 by freight category a couple of times since 2010, but never landed (pun intended) a top 20 in total aircraft movement.
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Glacier » Jan 23rd, 2018, 12:10 pm

Jhunter199 wrote:http://theprovince.com/business/by-the-numbers-kelowna-airport-cracks-top-10-busiest-in-canada


Perhaps you are looking at number of aircraft annually where Kelowna isn't even on most top 20 lists,
but if your going by annual passengers they are in the 9-11 range the last few years.

Or maybe I wasn't going back far enough Kelowna was the 10th busiest airport 8 years ago in 2010, but since then it's been the 11th to 13th busiest. The article you posted explicitly states that Kelowna was the 10th busiest in 2013, and that's simply not true.

2016 numbers (number of passengers):

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 44,335,198
2) Vancouver International Airport = 22,288,926
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 16,589,067
4) Calgary International Airport = 15,680,616
5) Edmonton International Airport = 7,523,864
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,743,091
7) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 4,015,200
8) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,908,799
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,700,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,856,421
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,732,113

2015:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 41,036,847
2) Vancouver International Airport = 20,315,978
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 15,517,382
4) Calgary International Airport = 15,475,759
5) Edmonton International Airport = 7,981,076
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,656,360
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,702,705
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,778,035
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,500,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,710,825
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,593,606

2014:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 38,571,961
2) Vancouver International Airport = 19,358,203
3) Calgary International Airport = 15,261,108
4) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 14,840,067
5) Edmonton International Airport = 8,240,161
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,616,448
7) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,669,797
8) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,663,039
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,400,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,650,904
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,602,899

2013:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 36,109,469
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,971,883
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 14,095,182
4) Calgary International Airport = 14,316,074
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,983,229
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,578,591
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,585,864
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,483,898
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,300,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,556,960
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,503,288

2012:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 34,912,029
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,596,901
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 13,809,820
4) Calgary International Airport = 13,641,339
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,676,857
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,685,956
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,605,701
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,538,175
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,300,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,506,212
11) St. John's International Airport = 1,450,000
12) Québec City Jean Lesage International Airport = 1,342,840
13) Kelowna International Airport = 1,440,952

2011:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 33,435,277
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,032,780
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 13,668,829
4) Calgary International Airport = 12,770,988
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,277,137
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,624,626
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,594,164
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,389,237
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 1,550,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,499,792
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,390,187

2010:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 31,936,098
2) Vancouver International Airport = 16,778,774
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 12,971,229
4) Calgary International Airport = 12,630,695
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,089,099
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,473,894
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,508,153
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,369,974
9) Victoria International Airport = 1,514,713
10) Kelowna International Airport = 1,391,807
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Jhunter199 » Jan 23rd, 2018, 12:50 pm

Glacier wrote:
Jhunter199 wrote:http://theprovince.com/business/by-the-numbers-kelowna-airport-cracks-top-10-busiest-in-canada


Perhaps you are looking at number of aircraft annually where Kelowna isn't even on most top 20 lists,
but if your going by annual passengers they are in the 9-11 range the last few years.

Or maybe I wasn't going back far enough Kelowna was the 10th busiest airport 8 years ago in 2010, but since then it's been the 11th to 13th busiest. The article you posted explicitly states that Kelowna was the 10th busiest in 2013, and that's simply not true.

2016 numbers (number of passengers):

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 44,335,198
2) Vancouver International Airport = 22,288,926
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 16,589,067
4) Calgary International Airport = 15,680,616
5) Edmonton International Airport = 7,523,864
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,743,091
7) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 4,015,200
8) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,908,799
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,700,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,856,421
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,732,113

2015:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 41,036,847
2) Vancouver International Airport = 20,315,978
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 15,517,382
4) Calgary International Airport = 15,475,759
5) Edmonton International Airport = 7,981,076
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,656,360
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,702,705
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,778,035
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,500,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,710,825
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,593,606

2014:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 38,571,961
2) Vancouver International Airport = 19,358,203
3) Calgary International Airport = 15,261,108
4) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 14,840,067
5) Edmonton International Airport = 8,240,161
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,616,448
7) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,669,797
8) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,663,039
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,400,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,650,904
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,602,899

2013:

1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 36,109,469
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,971,883
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 14,095,182
4) Calgary International Airport = 14,316,074
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,983,229
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,578,591
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,585,864
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,483,898
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,300,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,556,960
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,503,288

2012:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 34,912,029
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,596,901
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 13,809,820
4) Calgary International Airport = 13,641,339
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,676,857
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,685,956
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,605,701
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,538,175
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 2,300,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,506,212
11) St. John's International Airport = 1,450,000
12) Québec City Jean Lesage International Airport = 1,342,840
13) Kelowna International Airport = 1,440,952

2011:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 33,435,277
2) Vancouver International Airport = 17,032,780
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 13,668,829
4) Calgary International Airport = 12,770,988
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,277,137
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,624,626
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,594,164
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,389,237
9) Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport = 1,550,000
10) Victoria International Airport = 1,499,792
11) Kelowna International Airport = 1,390,187

2010:
1) Toronto Pearson International Airport = 31,936,098
2) Vancouver International Airport = 16,778,774
3) Montréal–Pierre Elliott Trudeau International Airport = 12,971,229
4) Calgary International Airport = 12,630,695
5) Edmonton International Airport = 6,089,099
6) Ottawa Macdonald–Cartier International Airport = 4,473,894
7) Halifax Stanfield International Airport = 3,508,153
8) Winnipeg James Armstrong Richardson International Airport = 3,369,974
9) Victoria International Airport = 1,514,713
10) Kelowna International Airport = 1,391,807


I've seen many different figures published by many different people, can I ask where these figures came from?
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Glacier » Jan 23rd, 2018, 12:59 pm

Jhunter199 wrote:I've seen many different figures published by many different people, can I ask where these figures came from?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... _in_Canada
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Woodenhead » Jan 23rd, 2018, 6:24 pm

single lane airport

#fakethread
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Jhunter199 » Jan 23rd, 2018, 6:28 pm

Glacier wrote:
Jhunter199 wrote:I've seen many different figures published by many different people, can I ask where these figures came from?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... _in_Canada


I don't know how accurate Wikipedia's information is...

http://www5.statcan.gc.ca/olc-cel/olc?O ... en&Limit=1

Try Stat Canada, I would trust it more than a site that can be edited by anyone whenever they want to and have been asking for donations to keep their site alive.

The numbers I seen from Stats Canada

2010 1,364,496 10th busiest for passengers
2011 1,355,975 10th busiest for passengers
2012 1,409,799 12 busiest for passengers
2013 1,589,476 9th busiest for passengers
2014 1,607,991 10th busiest for passengers
2015 1,550,649 10th busiest for passengers
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Omnitheo » Jan 23rd, 2018, 6:36 pm

Jhunter199 wrote:
I don't know how accurate Wikipedia's information is...

http://www5.statcan.gc.ca/olc-cel/olc?O ... en&Limit=1

Try Stat Canada, I would trust it more than a site that can be edited by anyone whenever they want to and have been asking for donations to keep their site alive.


Good gods. Wikipedia references all of their information. No differently than any encyclopedia. It drives me nuts when people say this nonesense when there are literally tags next to every piece of information showing exactly where it comes from.

The kelowna airport info on there sources directly to
https://ylw.kelowna.ca/business/facts-statistics
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Jhunter199 » Jan 23rd, 2018, 6:44 pm

Omnitheo wrote:
Jhunter199 wrote:
I don't know how accurate Wikipedia's information is...

http://www5.statcan.gc.ca/olc-cel/olc?O ... en&Limit=1

Try Stat Canada, I would trust it more than a site that can be edited by anyone whenever they want to and have been asking for donations to keep their site alive.


Good gods. Wikipedia references all of their information. No differently than any encyclopedia. It drives me nuts when people say this nonesense when there are literally tags next to every piece of information showing exactly where it comes from.

The kelowna airport info on there sources directly to
https://ylw.kelowna.ca/business/facts-statistics


Fair enough, but still their numbers are off on a few years... So that leads me to ask again where did those numbers come from. Yes Wikipedia references all info, but how accurate are all their references? If they're so bang on like an encyclopedia then why will no credible educational institute or publisher allow info from them?
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Dizzy1 » Jan 23rd, 2018, 10:02 pm

Glacier wrote:Often times I've read that Kelowna is the 9th busiest airport in Canada, and sometimes, I've read 10th busiest.

This is #FakeNews. Kelowna has never in Canadian history been one of the 10 busiest airports in Canada.

Hold on a bit there cowboy, the thing is that the pax numbers between certain airports such as YLW, YYJ, YQB is that their yearly traffic stats are so close that they literally change from month to month, one being number 10 one month and then number 11 the next month, etc. So the fact is that YLW does reach the top 10 from time to time at various points in time over the year. The same goes with YYC and YUL, there is always a constant debate in aviation forums about which one is truly number 3.

Glacier wrote:Now, 20-something years ago, it was the same size as Penticton and Kamloops, and is now more than double both of those airports combined today, so maybe it will become the 9th or 10th largest in Canada in the coming years, but the media never lets the facts get in the way of a good story, so it invents a top 10 status years before it becomes a reality.

Your assumption is way off, YLW has been much busier in terms of pax movements than YYF and YKA a lot longer then 20 years ago.
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby GenesisGT » Jan 23rd, 2018, 10:37 pm

Looking around at different statistics at different websites I did notice that some times Billy Bishop Toronto City Airport is not included, and this shows up in news articles about passenger loads. City Airport is busier then Kelowna.

Such as this article noting Kelowna as number ten, but not including Toronto City Airport

It may come as a surprise, but Kelowna’s is the 10th busiest airport in Canada, according to figures from 2013 — and it’s gaining on No. 9. Ahead of Kelowna are Toronto (Pearson), Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal (Trudeau), Edmonton, Ottawa, Halifax, Winnipeg and Victoria. It’s also the third-busiest airport in B.C., behind Vancouver and Victoria.


Why Toronto City is not included your guess is good as any.

http://theprovince.com/business/by-the-numbers-kelowna-airport-cracks-top-10-busiest-in-canada
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Woodenhead » Jan 24th, 2018, 12:43 pm

Omnitheo wrote:Good gods. Wikipedia references all of their information. No differently than any encyclopedia. It drives me nuts when people say this nonsense when there are literally tags next to every piece of information showing exactly where it comes from.


You're right. :130: Caveat: Wiki doesn't auto-update information in real-time. It relies on us humans to do that. Which is why the source listings are so important - best practice is to follow the links oneself, and validate.

This is a funny thread (esp. the title); it's really not important. I'm more concerned about beer tax lobbying, quite honestly.
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Re: The Kelowna Airport and the #FakeNewsMedia

Postby Glacier » Jan 30th, 2018, 11:10 am

Those lists tend to not list the Calgary/Springbank Airport and the Montréal-Mirabel International Airport even though they are both much busier than Kelowna in terms of plane traffic, but they aren't counted because they don't have any commercial flights.

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