Saturday, October 25th8.6°C
23888
23083

Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

South Okanagan topics including Summerland, Naramata, Penticton, Okanagan Falls, Oliver, Osoyoos, and Keremeos.

Moderators: oneh2obabe, Triple 6, Jo, ferri

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby DblDwn11 » Oct 2nd, 2012, 1:39 pm

I have to agree with Deepthroat here....I wasn't fully up to speed on the whole election issue in Summerland. After reading what was posted here, I think it is shameful to try and hijack an election without disclosing who you are.

I compare this situation to a similar group in Kelowna that decided to back a slate of candidates during the last municipal election. The difference here was that they disclosed who they were, why they felt the way they did and who they were backing. The residents of Kelowna then got to choose which point of view and vision for Kelowna that they agreed with.

It's scary to see American style politics enter in to Canada with PACS (Political Action Committees's) I guess it's unavoidable to a certain degree but the least we can expect is full disclosure.

If you're anti-abortion, say so. If you're against gay marriage, say so. If you think the government should relax taxes on the upper class at the expense of programs to help the middle class, say so. If you want to cut benefits to seniors and the un-employed, say so. If you think angels are real, say so.

Don't hide behind a newspaper ad.
DblDwn11
Fledgling
 
Posts: 128
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 5 posts
Joined: Oct 11th, 2011, 1:14 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 2nd, 2012, 9:39 pm

The ads in the Summerland paper did not attempt to hide Mr Ziebarths 'beliefs' on same sex marriage or any of the other things you mention. You have taken in incident in Summerland and imbelished it with your own assumptions that Ziebarth was somehow making personal statements on his beliefs (but hiding his identity). His ads targeted a small group of people that were representing themselves as being members of 'Smart Growth' but were actually intent on controlling all growth in Summerland. His ads had nothing to do with religion, same sex marriage or anything else of that nature. His ads were directed at the 'Smart Growth' slate only. Anyhow, he obviously should have signed his own name to those ads (his mistake was thinking that it would be funny to pose as an Association) ... with that said, twisting his intent in to some kind of personal statment on abortion/marriage/religion etc. is really unfair. There was not even a hint of Right Wing Religious sentiment in those ads.

Despite all of the debate, I'm sure that you can rest easy. It is unlikely that Ziebarth will win. We will most likely have a Liberal MLA that you feel comfortable supporting. I just hope that our new Liberal MLA will have something going for them besides being able to avoid all scandal and/or preceived scandal.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 7:51 am

I had stimulating discussion with a friend the other day regarding the search for Mr. Barisoff's replacement in particular, and BC politics in general. I expressed my disdain for the current model of Canadian politics in a couple of aspects, first that it tends to require someone proficient in "backroom" navigation in order for them to effectively represent their constituents, and second that the concerns of those constituents traditionally take second place to party policy. My friend agreed, an effective MLA knows people and has the connections to get problems dealt with. There is a degree of proficiency required in manipulating political connections towards attainment of goal, and it's a fact that much of this skill is not spent on particularly selfless endeavours. More later, I've got places to be right now.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 3rd, 2012, 8:48 am

I can't disagree with any of your comments Fluffy. It is indeed the way politics work. We also need to be mindful ... that those that are working 'against' the Liberal party will want our most 'milk toast' candidate to win. I think that the NDP would see someone like Ziebarth as a bigger threat than they would see some of the other candidates. He may be right of center ... but his job would be to further the Liberal policies. Something tells me that he would be effective.
Last edited by glassmaster on Oct 3rd, 2012, 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 9:34 am

I often think that someone like Mr. Ziebarth who is obviously quite savvy in the ways of the political world would be an good choice from the point of passionately representing his electorate, but at the same time he runs the risk of being branded a renegade if the needs of his constituents don't align with party policy. On the other hand, when I look at someone like Dick Cannings who is looking to carry the NDP torch into the provincial election who I know to be a highly earnest and ethical person, my first thought is to wonder how he will fare in the company of people cut from an entirely different bolt of cloth, people who are in a majority in politics and basically lay out the rulebook when it comes instigating change. I think our political scene needs more of the latter type and I can see them standing up in the legislature delivering the heartfelt and relevant plea for change. But that's the wishful thinking fluffy who could be the next poster boy for naive. I know that the big part of what goes down on the floor of the legislature is window dressing, and that it's the backroom wheeling and dealing that spells how the vote is going to go.

A juicy little tidbit I picked up was that the entire Penticton Vees team, staunchly supported by Mayor Dan Ashton in all aspects, have very recently joined the Liberal party and will be voting in the upcoming race for the local Liberal candidate.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 3rd, 2012, 11:57 am

-fluffy- wrote:A juicy little tidbit I picked up was that the entire Penticton Vees team, staunchly supported by Mayor Dan Ashton in all aspects, have very recently joined the Liberal party and will be voting in the upcoming race for the local Liberal candidate.



Makes sense to me.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby southy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 1:27 pm

And Fluffy you will be voting for Dan Ashton because ..........
southy
Generalissimo Postalot
 
Posts: 901
Likes: 67 posts
Liked in: 145 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2010, 4:14 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby Assumed » Oct 3rd, 2012, 3:25 pm

Lot of talk about the men in the race. I would not be that surprised if Janice Perrino wins this horse race.
Assumed
 
Posts: 33
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post
Joined: Feb 7th, 2012, 3:23 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 5:11 pm

southy wrote:And Fluffy you will be voting for Dan Ashton because ..........


At this stage of the game I don't get a vote, Liberal party members only.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 5:16 pm

glassmaster wrote:Makes sense to me.


Of course it does, and I'm sure the Vees will all vote their conscience despite any implied pressure to support Mr. Ashton. This just goes to what I said about backroom savvy. There are many who may see such a move as an attempt to stack the deck.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 3rd, 2012, 6:18 pm

Come on Fluffy, they all try to 'stack the deck' ... that is politics. They all recruit. All of the parties try to gain the interest of younger people. NDP does it .... they all do it. The Liberals will try to encourage young people to become Liberals ... and the NDP will try to encourage young people to become NDP. As you said in another post, 'Pot, meet kettle'.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 3rd, 2012, 7:02 pm

Precisely my point. The person most likely to land job would be the one who is most proficient in navigating the ethical wasteland that is politics.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 3rd, 2012, 9:53 pm

Pretty much. Most people (at a certain level of maturity) make the decision regarding which political party they feel most comfortable supporting. It becomes (as much) about stopping the party they dislike .... as it is about supporting the one they prefer. There are very few people that agree with everything that a particular party stands for (even if they are members of that party) ... so you end up with people that are 'left of center' or 'right of center'. It is the far left and far right that concern me.

My focus is economy and economic development ... so I would support those politicians that would promote meaningful progress. Stagnation doesn't sit well with me. I liked Ziebarth because he was obviously fighting against 'no growth'. If he has some right wing beliefs that I don't support ... I can accept our differences (and still support him), because he is closer to 'what I believe' is important.

The Liberals are the closest thing to a balance ... they have adopted some things from the Left and from the Right .... and seem to have a genuine interest in economic development (without the extemes of the far left or the far right). When it comes to choosing a Liberal MLA ... I would hope that the person (whoever that may be) will be aware enough to navigate their way through the nasty business of politics.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby fluffy » Oct 4th, 2012, 6:53 am

I hear you and agree for the most part, I just don't like it. It's a personal thing I suppose, my idealistic streak at odds with the realistic side of things. It's my feeling that the sort of people we really need in Victoria, honest and ethical and genuinely concerned with the needs f their constituents, are a rare breed. And those who do manage to find their way into office are effectively bound and gagged by party policy and/or the actual nature of politics itself.
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15550
Likes: 17 posts
Liked in: 983 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: Tea party politics invading the South Okanagan

Postby glassmaster » Oct 4th, 2012, 7:31 am

-fluffy- wrote:I hear you and agree for the most part, I just don't like it. It's a personal thing I suppose, my idealistic streak at odds with the realistic side of things. It's my feeling that the sort of people we really need in Victoria, honest and ethical and genuinely concerned with the needs f their constituents, are a rare breed. And those who do manage to find their way into office are effectively bound and gagged by party policy and/or the actual nature of politics itself.



It is difficult, but I have to believe that people can (for the most part) be honest and ethical ... but not back down on on their party policies. In other words, be able to fight against rhetoric. I realize that is where it can get nasty and lines get crossed ... but sometimes it takes that to accomplish things. There will always be those folks (from the extreme left or the extreme right who will try to push their beliefs on the rest of us) ... if we don't have strong leadership to counteract those extremes ... we are hooped. Those that are on the fringe (far left/far right) are not afraid to use dishonest or unethical ways of furthering their beliefs. When that happens ... and a community becomes at risk ... you just have to hope that the leadership is prepared to deal with it. All to often, leadership will not lead, they will sit back and hope that the community members take on the fight ... because, they are afraid of losing votes. I have always been drawn to leadership that is a little outspoken ... leadership that isn't afraid of standing up to the extremists in a community. Of course, that kind leader, is who the extremists hate. They would much rater deal with someone who doesn't take action.
glassmaster
Übergod
 
Posts: 1023
Likes: 9 posts
Liked in: 2 posts
Joined: Jan 19th, 2010, 10:58 am

PreviousNext

Return to Penticton / South Okanagan

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests