Friday, July 25th11.1°C
21452

MLA Travel Expenses

South Okanagan topics including Summerland, Naramata, Penticton, Okanagan Falls, Oliver, Osoyoos, and Keremeos.

Moderators: oneh2obabe, Jo, ferri, Triple 6

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby fluffy » Nov 1st, 2012, 10:50 am

grammafreddy wrote:I hope you aren't holding your breath waiting for that.


If he chooses to dance around the question that would pretty much be an answer in itself, wouldn't it?
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15350
Likes: 14 posts
Liked in: 805 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby XT225 » Nov 1st, 2012, 10:52 am

grammafreddy wrote:
-fluffy- wrote:Following the Auditor General's release yesterday of MLA's travel expenses, Bill Berisoff was unavailable for comment. Seeing that he placed highest among Okanagan MLAs, and second highest overall in the province, I'm sure a detailed report will be forthcoming at his earliest convenience.


I hope you aren't holding your breath waiting for that.


"Transparency" at its finest. Ya, right! Don't expect anything to be forthcoming and the new MLA come May 2013 will likely be just as transparent as Billy was/is. Remember the glass doors in some doctors and dentists offices? I believe they were called "Opaque" glass...you could kinda see thru them but couldnt ever figure out exactly what was behind the door. :dyinglaughing:
XT225
Übergod
 
Posts: 1547
Likes: 350 posts
Liked in: 163 posts
Joined: Jun 2nd, 2009, 4:37 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Assumed » Nov 1st, 2012, 10:55 am

46000 dollars for six months. That makes me ill. If he flew back to his riding every week to stay a few days, at $500 per round trip, it works out to $13000 for six months. 46000 is a tad much.

I guess it is of no concern as this is considered a safe seat by the Liberals, right?????
Assumed
 
Posts: 33
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post
Joined: Feb 7th, 2012, 3:23 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby grammafreddy » Nov 1st, 2012, 11:03 am

-fluffy- wrote:
Among elected officials, gov't employees and contractors dealing with the gov't, there is an air of "deep pockets" when it come to pubic funds. The idea of public responsibility is no longer associated with public funds. I would not expect things like first class travel and five star hotels to appear on gov't expense claims, nor would I expect to see claims for travel to accomplish something that could be easily done at a distance with any of the myriad of electronic media available today. Treat tax-payer money like it belongs to the taxpayer.


Having been on the other side of the government fence, I can tell you there is intense pressure on newly elected people to conform to the way the upper echelon conduct their behind-the-scene affairs nor the ways they spend the public's money on themselves. An innocent starry-eyed newcomer says they will not take bribes, will not spend lavishly, will vote as the people want, will be loyal to the electorate, etc, etc.

In reality what happens is the newcomers go to "school" and are told how things are and how they will be. The old boys network does not want to lower their standards and they make sure any new people with common sense and ideals are dealt with swiftly - or they are shunned and they are harassed - and their motions for change go nowhere. The top circle is a closed circle and the only way to effect change is to be part of that circle. People with ideals and stars in their eyes don't get let into that circle and they become useless as representatives of the people who elected them. All the yelling and screaming is ignored or ridiculed - from inside the circle and by others outside the circle who want the approval of the circle so they can get in.

Politicians at all levels sell their souls. If they don't, they are not in politics long.

And before the independent chimes in about how that is the beauty of being an independent - HA! Dream on. if you want info, you won't get it. If you want numbers, you won't get them. If you want someone from the circle or their staff to talk to you, you won't get it. You will wait a long, long time before you receive what you need to inform yourself and make decisions based on fact rather than inside circle secrets. You will stand up and yell but no one in government will hear you. Without a party to support you, you are a nobody to everybody else and their empire-building staff.
__________________________________________________________________________________________
We are a generation of idiots - smart phones and dumb people.

You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
User avatar
grammafreddy
Chief Sh*t Disturber
 
Posts: 28551
Likes: 2199 posts
Liked in: 775 posts
Joined: Mar 17th, 2007, 10:52 am

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Captain Awesome » Nov 1st, 2012, 11:13 am

trueindependent wrote:Lets be clear, I am NOT jumping on the bandwagon


Of course you're jumping on a bandwagon, that's what most sleazy politicians do. Here's how it works:

Step 1: Find out what people are pissed off about
Step 2: Promise you will be different
Step 3: Collect brownie points

See how it matches your style? May I suggest a few more hot topics so you can claim to be different when you get in?
- Raising taxes
- MLA's pensions
- Raising crime
- Something about rich people

Of course you have to travel and YES I would travel cheap, like I would if it was my money instead of yours. It's easy for politicians to spend like "crazy" on elaborate travel when it's coming out of your wallet. When I travel for business I don't eat Lobster and caviar because my company is paying, nor do I eat KD. I eat like I normally would, nor do I stay in the penthouse. Is that a concept so far out there that its incomprehensible? Treat tax-payer money like it's your own.


Here's another sleazy thing politicians do when they're after brownie points - make promises.

Let's see, you have NO IDEA what the expenses were and whether or nor they were legitimate, though you start claiming that individuals in questions stay in penthouses and eat caviar because it was tax payers money. You don't know what the expenses covered, where they stayed, and what they ate - but it's all about playing on emotions for you, you don't really care. You just want to be different, and promise to be different. And here you are promising it with a sleazy smile - of course I will travel cheap! You'll never see expenses like this from me! You don't even know what you're promising, you just want to promise to win brownie points.

How would an honest politicians do things? Well, he wouldn't promise anything without doing research. He would obtain the expense reports and provide it for review to his possible constituents. He would suggest making changes based on actual facts and information.

But you didn't do any of that. You went after easy emotional brownie points. Good job, truesleazy.
Sarcasm is like a good game of chess. Most people don't know how to play chess.
User avatar
Captain Awesome
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 22575
Likes: 2 posts
Liked in: 1287 posts
Joined: Jul 22nd, 2008, 5:06 pm
Location: The United Colonies of The Lizard People

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby krocky » Nov 1st, 2012, 11:33 am

Spoken like a true Liberal.. and from someone who calls themself captain "AWESOME" to boot..
krocky
Board Meister
 
Posts: 411
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post
Joined: Oct 28th, 2012, 4:53 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Rockitman » Nov 1st, 2012, 12:05 pm

grammafreddy wrote:
Politicians at all levels sell their souls. If they don't, they are not in politics long.

Thank you for sharing a perspective from the other side of the fence. Most of us that haven’t been there “suspect” much of this is the case from what we have read but hearing it from someone who has been there is helpful. Although the proof is often in the pudding.

I would like to, once again, share this excerpt from a currently sitting Independent MLA.
Working Independently Posted on October 26, 2012 by RSMLA Administrator (Bob Simpson MLA)
After almost two years as an Independent MLA I still get asked if Independents can make their voices heard and if the constituency is well served by someone who is not a part of the political party system.
It’s a fair question.

Even though most people believe political parties undermine our representative democracy by exercising too much control over their elected members and limiting the ability of MLAs to truly represent their constituents, many people still feel they need to vote for a member of a political party in order to get things done in their riding.

As an Independent outside the petty partisanship that has infused BC’s politics, what I find is different about my conversations with our region’s senior bureaucracy (and with ministers, for that matter) is that they are more open, honest and productive. In part, this is because the civil servants and ministers know that my only agenda is to serve my constituents; I’m not trying to “play” them for the benefit of a particular political brand. Consequently, I find I can better serve the people of my constituency than my colleagues who are restricted by the party system.

What I hear over and over like a broken record is the Political system in BC is broken but we can’t fix it so let’s just do nothing different and maybe that will help. I believe that we at least try SOMETHING..!! Don’t forget that most people (especially the Liberals) thought the anti HST initiative would go no where also, look how that ended up.

If voting for an independent is NOT the answer then what is, STATUS QUO..?? You tell me!
Rockitman
 
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby fluffy » Nov 1st, 2012, 12:27 pm

Cap'n A, how do you feel an un-sleazy politician should act?
quick - report this post to a mod
User avatar
fluffy
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15350
Likes: 14 posts
Liked in: 805 posts
Joined: Jun 1st, 2006, 5:42 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Captain Awesome » Nov 1st, 2012, 12:44 pm

-fluffy- wrote:Cap'n A, how do you feel an un-sleazy politician should act?


Well, I kind have included it in my post:

How would an honest politicians do things? Well, he wouldn't promise anything without doing research. He would obtain the expense reports and provide it for review to his possible constituents. He would suggest making changes based on actual facts and information.
Sarcasm is like a good game of chess. Most people don't know how to play chess.
User avatar
Captain Awesome
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 22575
Likes: 2 posts
Liked in: 1287 posts
Joined: Jul 22nd, 2008, 5:06 pm
Location: The United Colonies of The Lizard People

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Rockitman » Nov 1st, 2012, 12:55 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:But you didn't do any of that. You went after easy emotional brownie points. Good job, truesleazy.


Although I don't appreciate the name calling I can appreciate some of what you are saying. But lets set the record straight I did not accuse anyone of staying in penthouses and eating caviar because it was tax payers money. I stated that I did not do that while travelling on my companies dime. That is a fact, not a promise and you can draw any inference from that that you like.

However, after painting everyone interested in trying to make a difference with the same "sleazy politician" brush, you did provide some positive input:
Captain Awesome wrote:How would an honest politicians do things? Well, he wouldn't promise anything without doing research. He would obtain the expense reports and provide it for review to his possible constituents. He would suggest making changes based on actual facts and information.


So, good on you for that!!
Rockitman
 
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby grammafreddy » Nov 1st, 2012, 12:56 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:
trueindependent wrote:Lets be clear, I am NOT jumping on the bandwagon


Of course you're jumping on a bandwagon, that's what most sleazy politicians do. Here's how it works:

Step 1: Find out what people are pissed off about
Step 2: Promise you will be different
Step 3: Collect brownie points

See how it matches your style? May I suggest a few more hot topics so you can claim to be different when you get in?
- Raising taxes
- MLA's pensions
- Raising crime
- Something about rich people

Of course you have to travel and YES I would travel cheap, like I would if it was my money instead of yours. It's easy for politicians to spend like "crazy" on elaborate travel when it's coming out of your wallet. When I travel for business I don't eat Lobster and caviar because my company is paying, nor do I eat KD. I eat like I normally would, nor do I stay in the penthouse. Is that a concept so far out there that its incomprehensible? Treat tax-payer money like it's your own.


Here's another sleazy thing politicians do when they're after brownie points - make promises.

Let's see, you have NO IDEA what the expenses were and whether or nor they were legitimate, though you start claiming that individuals in questions stay in penthouses and eat caviar because it was tax payers money. You don't know what the expenses covered, where they stayed, and what they ate - but it's all about playing on emotions for you, you don't really care. You just want to be different, and promise to be different. And here you are promising it with a sleazy smile - of course I will travel cheap! You'll never see expenses like this from me! You don't even know what you're promising, you just want to promise to win brownie points.

How would an honest politicians do things? Well, he wouldn't promise anything without doing research. He would obtain the expense reports and provide it for review to his possible constituents. He would suggest making changes based on actual facts and information.

But you didn't do any of that. You went after easy emotional brownie points. Good job, truesleazy.


:thewave: :rate10: :thewave:
__________________________________________________________________________________________
We are a generation of idiots - smart phones and dumb people.

You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.
User avatar
grammafreddy
Chief Sh*t Disturber
 
Posts: 28551
Likes: 2199 posts
Liked in: 775 posts
Joined: Mar 17th, 2007, 10:52 am

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Rockitman » Nov 1st, 2012, 1:12 pm

So grammafreddy agrees with Captain awesome, no surprise there. (but I do like the wave, cute!)

At least the "Captain" offered some positive suggestions while grammafreddy, who claims to have been there, criticizes both the party system AND the possibility of electing an independent. In other words there is no answer so why bother to try.

If it ain't broke don't fix it, just complain.. and IF it is broke, well, still don't fix it, just complain more. Right Gramma..??
Rockitman
 
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Rockitman » Nov 1st, 2012, 1:33 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:How would an honest politicians do things? Well, he wouldn't promise anything without doing research. He would obtain the expense reports and provide it for review to his possible constituents. He would suggest making changes based on actual facts and information.


If we did what you suggest and IF we found that some of the spending was frivolous, what then. Would you still support the Liberals and look the other way as has been done in the past. Also, if an independent candidate were to be the one to point out these expenditures during a campaign does that not still look like they are an "opportunist" or jumping on the band wagon, as you put it.

In your opinion, hypothetically speaking, how do we stop this from happening "ASSUMING" after cold hard proof is found that it is?? Especially if someone who says they won't do that, is only looking for brownie points and can't be trusted.
Rockitman
 
Likes: 0 post
Liked in: 0 post

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby Glacier » Nov 1st, 2012, 1:38 pm

I notice that no one has commented on how low Chrispy Clark's expenses were. I guess it's not news until it's bad?
"If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants."
User avatar
Glacier
Buddha of the Board
 
Posts: 15924
Likes: 284 posts
Liked in: 992 posts
Joined: Jul 6th, 2008, 10:41 pm

Re: MLA Travel Expenses

Postby CTF » Nov 1st, 2012, 1:41 pm

I thought GrammaFreddy did make some good points that are likely true. I listen to CKNW via the internet and an NPA councillor on the City of Vancouver (who is basically an independent given the Vision Vancouver majority ) was on recently and he also said many of the same things as Gramma Freddy said. I was actually a tad shocked that a councillor could be so shut out and it made me thankful that we don’t have a party system at the municipal level. God help us if we ever do.

So yes, I think an independent may be free to say whatever they want without party discipline applying but good luck getting that grant to build a new road or swimming pool or whatever else. Generally most independents tend to be people who are not team players which is in part how they become independents in the first place because no other party actually wants them

I wish “true independent” luck in his quest.
CTF
 
Posts: 95
Likes: 2 posts
Liked in: 10 posts
Joined: Sep 21st, 2012, 11:58 am

PreviousNext

Return to Penticton / South Okanagan

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests