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Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby flamingfingers » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:28 pm

By the way, it's too bad that some on here haven't been as critical of the NDP as I have of the Liberals. Many on the "they can do nothing right" bandwagon are also on the "Dix can do nothing wrong" bandwagon.


I can't for the life of me remember when Dix was EVER premier of the province or had any real power to execute policy during the NDPs term. It's like saying Paul Taylor, Mike McDonald, Ken Bossenkool or Dan Doyle have made policy decisions and directed the ChristyLiberals these past couple of years. (And while I am not too sure about Paul Taylor or Mike McDonald who has been resurrected again! We certainly know that Ken Bossenkool's actions were far, far more serious than backdating a memo to file). We simply do not know at this point in time whether Dix can do anything 'right' or if he will do anything 'wrong'. I for one believe that the Liberals deserve to be banished to the cold Arctic hinterlands. Forever.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Urbane » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:34 pm

    flamingfingers wrote:
    I can't for the life of me remember when Dix was EVER premier of the province or had any real power to execute policy during the NDPs term. It's like saying Paul Taylor, Mike McDonald, Ken Bossenkool or Dan Doyle have made policy decisions and directed the ChristyLiberals these past couple of years. (And while I am not too sure about Paul Taylor or Mike McDonald who has been resurrected again! We certainly know that Ken Bossenkool's actions were far, far more serious than backdating a memo to file). We simply do not know at this point in time whether Dix can do anything 'right' or if he will do anything 'wrong'. I for one believe that the Liberals deserve to be banished to the cold Arctic hinterlands. Forever.
Dix was Chief of Staff in the last NDP government before he resigned in disgrace and others on his current team were there in the 1990's as well. It would be foolish only to evaluate the current government without evaluating the party that wants to replace them. That just wouldn't make any sense at all, particularly since we have lots of info to go on with both the NDP and the Liberals.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Urbane » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:39 pm

I do acknowledge that some posters on here prefer the "have not" province status although I don't completely understand why. As for me I prefer the "have" status so yes, I do actually believe what I write. The Liberals have been gaffe-prone and have made lots of mistakes but they've also done a lot of things right. Our economy is certainly in better shape than the economy that the NDP left us with. When they only won 2 seats (and barely winning those) out of 79 they weren't being rewarded for giving us a great economy. On the contrary! Rewriting history may be fun but it's not useful.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Urbane » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:45 pm

I'm not rationalizing or making excuses for the Liberals. They've been gaffe-prone and have made plenty of mistakes. As I've said many times previously they don't deserve to be reelected. However, the only other option out there is a bad one. Really bad and I refuse to support that option. While it's fun to equate not supporting the NDP with loving everything that the Liberals have done it's totally inaccurate. Carry on though.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby flamingfingers » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:49 pm

Dix was Chief of Staff in the last NDP government before he resigned in disgrace


And did not Ken Bossenkool 'resign in disgrace'.. and are not the major players in the Liberal party the same? You want to slice and dice to the Liberal party advantage.

And FYI, transfer payments to BC were only made in 1999, while transfer payments to BC were made in 2001, 2003, 2004, 2005 AND 2006. Seems that under the Libs we have been a 'have not' province far more often than under the NDP. Funny that facts get in the way of your ideology..
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Urbane » Jan 30th, 2013, 7:55 pm

    flamingfingers wrote:
    And did not Ken Bossenkool 'resign in disgrace'.. and are not the major players in the Liberal party the same? You want to slice and dice to the Liberal party advantage.

    To remind you of the obvious Bossenkool is not running in the coming election with the hope of being Premier. Dix is. Big difference.

    And FYI, transfer payments to BC were only made in 1999, while transfer payments to BC were made in 2001, 2003, 2004, 2005 AND 2006. Seems that under the Libs we have been a 'have not' province far more often than under the NDP. Funny that facts get in the way of your ideology..

    It always takes time to turn an economy around and the Liberals did in fact turn it around. After a few years they got the budget balanced and that lasted until the 2008 economic meltdown that you claim everyone in the world saw coming except for this government but that's not true of course. Anyway, I know that you were living half a world away but the NDP really did make a mess of things. That 77-2 was certainly indicative of how people felt.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby steven lloyd » Jan 30th, 2013, 8:03 pm

Urbane wrote: I'm not rationalizing or making excuses for the Liberals. They've been gaffe-prone and have made plenty of mistakes. As I've said many times previously they don't deserve to be re-elected. However, the only other option out there is a bad one. Really bad and I refuse to support that option.

Fair enough, and on which choice is worse (and the importance of not simply continuing to support the perpetuation the status quo and the recurrent re-election of governments we deserve) we’ll always continue to disagree. I’m willing to bet that in four years from now, no matter which party is elected to power in May, yours and my life will be essentially unchanged (except for each being four years older and I being four years closer to re-entering the private sector and slowing down, maybe moving south). We will still, as a province have the extra billions in debt incurred under this Liberal government and we will still be saddled with the billions in contractual obligations made to their selected friends. If it is the Liberals in power then we will still be being bedazzled by the smoke and mirror show including the fairytale of having the lowest personal income tax – combined with the highest cost of living. Some will even still consider them to be “the free enterprise party” committed to “open government”. If it is the NDP, perhaps the picture will be more real. Maybe not - but maybe. If it is the Liberals then we will have sent the message that accountability by government is not important to us, we don’t care about being lied to, and please – please waste some more of our money in whatever frivolous manner you wish. If it is the NDP and they fall along the same path then we can get rid of them in four years, but at least we will have started sending the message that we demand more from our governments. Or we could send the message that we don’t care at all. I accept that is your choice. Carry on.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby logicalview » Jan 30th, 2013, 8:08 pm

Handing the government over to the NDP and then being surprised when they run the economy into the ground is like handing an alcoholic a bottle of Tequila and then being shocked an hour later when the bottle is empty. Unfortunately handing the government over to anyone with a massive majority and a weak opposition also leads to arrogance and corruption. We are truly in a mugs game with the two options before us. Anyone who thinks that the NDP Isn't capable of doing mass damage in 4 years is truly naive, but the other option isn't much better either.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Urbane » Jan 30th, 2013, 8:13 pm

    logicalview wrote:Handing the government over to the NDP and then being surprised when they run the economy into the ground is like handing an alcoholic a bottle of Tequila and then being shocked an hour later when the bottle is empty. Unfortunately handing the government over to anyone with a massive majority and a weak opposition also leads to arrogance and corruption. We are truly in a mugs game with the two options before us. Anyone who thinks that the NDP Isn't capable of doing mass damage in 4 years is truly naive, but the other option isn't much better either.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Veovis » Jan 30th, 2013, 8:43 pm

Not a bad argument, perhaps a minority government for a couple years of NDP lead where the liberals allow them to show people one way or the other . If the liberals are the truly better option, they can force and election and find out, if the NDP are doing a decent job the Libs can continue along or face what occurred federally.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby LoneWolf_53 » Jan 30th, 2013, 9:11 pm

steven lloyd wrote: If it is the NDP and they fall along the same path then we can get rid of them in four years, but at least we will have started sending the message that we demand more from our governments. Or we could send the message that we don’t care at all. I accept that is your choice. Carry on.


Am I missing something Steven, or hasn't that approach been tried a number of times in BC?

Personally given the options we have, I'd say a minority government would be best, just not with NDP at the helm.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby steven lloyd » Jan 30th, 2013, 10:56 pm

:bump:
Last edited by steven lloyd on Jan 31st, 2013, 8:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby steven lloyd » Jan 30th, 2013, 11:00 pm

LoneWolf_53 wrote: Personally given the options we have, I'd say a minority government would be best, ...

That would probably be the best. How do you see that happenning?
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby LoneWolf_53 » Jan 30th, 2013, 11:53 pm

People not allowing emotion to get the better of them might be a good start. If the Liberals get pounded like the NDP did it won't fix anything, just give the other side unlimited power.

On the other hand if level heads prevail, it's a given that the Liberals have lost support, and perhaps enough to keep them out of power, but if the fates have mercy, maybe they can retain enough to keep the NDP from getting too big for their britches.

I think it's tough to predict what the outcome will be, with the Conservatives part of the mix, and there's a ways to go yet before election time.
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Re: Court denies Auditor General access to BC Rail documents

Postby Jo » Jan 31st, 2013, 7:16 am

I've removed a number of posts that were far better suited to the Political Arena. You have an ENTIRE FORUM at your disposal for personal insults and outlandish overstatements about political parties. Keep this area civilized, as the posts now show.
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