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The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 2nd, 2013, 5:45 pm

    flamingfingers wrote:
    Longfellow he ain't but the gist is clear.

Yes, the NDP adherents definitely believe the Liberals are dead and the election is already won. And yet, I note that in the latest poll the Liberals have climbed to within ten points. The NDP is confident but I wonder about overconfidence. This election might not be the cakewalk that many expect. Once Dix starts speaking and actually articulating policy things may change and if he clams up because he expects a coronation that might be problematic too. Yes, the NDP will likely win but it's not over until the fat lady sings.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby steven lloyd » Feb 2nd, 2013, 6:04 pm

While the desperate attempts of the NDP bashers to try and portray Dix as something more to be feared than four more years of Liberal malfeasance is really not much more than a solid source of ironic humour, I can pretty much guarantee you there is about a 100% chance that the next BC government will be either Liberal or NDP. Personally, I’m not going to lose any sleep over this as either outcome will be a sad joke. Either way we are going to get the government we deserve.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 2nd, 2013, 6:20 pm

    steven lloyd wrote:While the desperate attempts of the NDP bashers to try and portray Dix as something more to be feared than four more years of Liberal malfeasance is really not much more than a solid source of ironic humour, I can pretty much guarantee you there is about a 100% chance that the next BC government will be either Liberal or NDP. Personally, I’m not going to lose any sleep over this as either outcome will be a sad joke. Either way we will get the government we deserve.
In fairness, Steven, many of us on here don't like what the NDP did last time they governed and we don't think that the party's policies will be good for the province. You can call that bashing if you like but I just think it's pointing out past failings and the likelihood of future failings. If you're referring to the forged memo affair or the Glen Clark deckgate affair those are a matter of public record. In Dix's case he was guilty of misconduct and as a consequence resigned in disgrace while in the case of Glen Clark he was found not guilty of a crime but certainly guilty of poor judgment. Mentioning any or all of the above I don't see as bashing. Bashing would be more like trying to find malfeasance in every single action that the government takes or making petty references to the premier's appearance - that sort of thing.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby steven lloyd » Feb 2nd, 2013, 6:34 pm

Urbane wrote: In fairness, Steven, many of us on here don't like what the NDP did last time they governed and we don't think that the party's policies will be good for the province. You can call that bashing if you like but I just think it's pointing out past failings and the likelihood of future failings.

I’m not disputing that Urbane, and yes past behaviour can predict future behaviour – almost as well as present behaviour can be used to predict ongoing behaviour. In fact, this is the big white elephant currently taking a dump in the living room that you apologists have blinded yourselves to through your partisanship. Some will then quickly parry with the old “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument, and that is also true. However, ignoring and/or making excuses for current and ongoing wrong-doing isn’t right either. That’s simply an example of failure in logic. Again, it doesn’t matter. Either way we are going to get the government we deserve, and as long as we continue to support the perpetuation of the status quo we will continue to get the governments we deserve. If there is no change then there is no change.
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Re: the glenn clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby logicalview » Feb 2nd, 2013, 9:42 pm

Alvis wrote:So awful they left a huge budget surplus that Gordo quickely dissolved into his own pocket and sent BC tumbling down the toilet, eh?


You are right. The 1990's NDP were just super awesome. It was just my imagination that they were uncerimoniously punted 77-2, leaving just Joy McFailure and Jenny Kwanumist as the last surviving tumours of the cancer that was the NDP government.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 2nd, 2013, 10:09 pm

    steven lloyd wrote:I’m not disputing that Urbane, and yes past behaviour can predict future behaviour – almost as well as present behaviour can be used to predict ongoing behaviour. In fact, this is the big white elephant currently taking a dump in the living room that you apologists have blinded yourselves to through your partisanship. Some will then quickly parry with the old “two wrongs don’t make a right” argument, and that is also true. However, ignoring and/or making excuses for current and ongoing wrong-doing isn’t right either. That’s simply an example of failure in logic. Again, it doesn’t matter. Either way we are going to get the government we deserve, and as long as we continue to support the perpetuation of the status quo we will continue to get the governments we deserve. If there is no change then there is no change.
And yet you've told me that you couldn't imagine ever voting Liberal in the future. Well, that's the way I feel about the NDP. You seem to want people who are opposed to the policies of the NDP and aghast at their malfeasance when in office last to overlook all of that and vote for them anyway in order to defeat the Liberals while simultaneously saying that you wouldn't ever vote Liberal to help defeat a malfeasant NDP. Carry on though.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby ticat900 » Feb 2nd, 2013, 11:12 pm

recent sign I saw on a septic pumping truck
I have a truck full of politicans and their promises!
Look at Gordon Campbell what disgrace this POS was and look at Glen Clark
same thing.Liberal or NDP we always end up with self serving liars and cheats in the BC government
U cant blame one party or the other.Look at the idiot the school teachers have leading them
What about the re##*bleep* Mike harcourt or Dave Barret or joyce MCfailure. to name but a few
Look at the scandal ICBC has had over the years.all political ALL
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Jo » Feb 3rd, 2013, 12:40 pm

Posts removed.

If you feel the need to be hysterical and childish with your comments, take it to the Political Arena. This is the the forum for it.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby steven lloyd » Feb 3rd, 2013, 1:26 pm

Urbane wrote: You seem to want people who are opposed to the policies of the NDP and aghast at their malfeasance when in office last to overlook all of that and vote for them anyway in order to defeat the Liberals while simultaneously saying that you wouldn't ever vote Liberal to help defeat a malfeasant NDP. Carry on though.

I want people to start voting corrupt and malfeasant governments out of power instead of back into power. Nowhere did I ever say I wouldn't ever vote Liberal to help defeat a malfeasant NDP government. Nice try though. Take off your partisanship shades and you may read better. If the NDP were in power right now and had used $6,000,000 of my tax money to pay off convicted criminals to obstruct Court process, had provided the Courts with subpoenaed documents that had been completely redacted and were continuing to throw millions more in my tax dollars to their lawyers to fight coming clean with us, had earmarked billions more in my tax dollars to be paid out to their selected friends in “contractual obligations” over the next couple decades for overpriced power and were using my own tax dollars to lie to me about what a great job they were doing I would vote to remove them as well - even if the best chance of doing that meant voting for a Liberal while knowing their government’s past record of reckless fiscal mismanagement. I know you’re very comfortable with the perpetuation of the status quo and continual re-election of governments we deserve. I’m not. Carry on though.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 3rd, 2013, 3:42 pm

    steven lloyd wrote:I want people to start voting corrupt and malfeasant governments out of power instead of back into power. Nowhere did I ever say I wouldn't ever vote Liberal to help defeat a malfeasant NDP government. Nice try though. Take off your partisanship shades and you may read better. If the NDP were in power right now and had used $6,000,000 of my tax money to pay off convicted criminals to obstruct Court process, had provided the Courts with subpoenaed documents that had been completely redacted and were continuing to throw millions more in my tax dollars to their lawyers to fight coming clean with us, had earmarked billions more in my tax dollars to be paid out to their selected friends in “contractual obligations” over the next couple decades for overpriced power and were using my own tax dollars to lie to me about what a great job they were doing I would vote to remove them as well - even if the best chance of doing that meant voting for a Liberal while knowing their government’s past record of reckless fiscal mismanagement. I know you’re very comfortable with the perpetuation of the status quo and continual re-election of governments we deserve. I’m not. Carry on though.
Well, you've forgotten that comment about never intending to vote Liberal in the future but I remember it.

The Glen Clark deck-gate affair, sad as it was, paled in comparison to what his government did to the province. I do understand the emotional response and often distorted view of this government and it makes people forget UBCO, the new medical school here, the Bennett Bridge etc.

The NDP left us with a serious shortage of doctors and nurses and this government certainly deserves credit for trying to rectify that situation.

We are in debt but would be in less debt if we hadn't just forfeited over $1 billion to the feds. But Adrian Dix and the NDP, as well as many posters on here, were in favour of us doing just that. And now they complain about the debt. Democracy in action! We not only get the government we deserve but we get the debt that we deserve as well!
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby steven lloyd » Feb 3rd, 2013, 4:00 pm

Urbane wrote: Well, you've forgotten that comment about never intending to vote Liberal in the future but I remember it.

No, I didn’t forget that. Indeed I said I would never vote for this Liberal government that is in power now. They need to be removed. If I had to vote for another Liberal government in the future to get rid of another corrupt and malfeasant government that was in power I would. What is critically important is that we start voting these corrupt governments out of power instead of just back into power again.

Urbane wrote: We not only get the government we deserve but we get the debt that we deserve as well!

Yes, and if there is no change there never will be change. Carry on

It’s game time :smt039
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby flamingfingers » Feb 3rd, 2013, 4:26 pm

Although this thread is getting waayyy off course, I just want to comment that the HST has been with us for 2 years and 8 months as of April 1, 2013, garnering the government $820 million per month x 34 months. Seems like a cool couple billion plus to me... has it helped them to 'balance their budget'??
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 3rd, 2013, 5:23 pm

    flamingfingers wrote:Although this thread is getting waayyy off course, I just want to comment that the HST has been with us for 2 years and 8 months as of April 1, 2013, garnering the government $820 million per month x 34 months. Seems like a cool couple billion plus to me... has it helped them to 'balance their budget'??
As stated a zillion times previously the Campbell government did balance the books a couple years after taking office to the chagrin of the NDP who claimed that Campbell was "obsessed" with doing so. Then came the 2008 global meltdown that no government saw coming and we had to run up debt again. And if we hadn't been forced to pay back that $1 billion plus to the feds it would make balancing the books now a lot easier.

Back on topic - Glen Clark used very poor judgment in the deck-gate affair and even NDP Attorney General Ujjal Dosanjh insisted that Clark resign. Which he did. The fact that he wasn't found guilty of a crime doesn't absolve him from that poor judgment and he was in fact right to resign.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Alvis » Feb 3rd, 2013, 6:05 pm

Urbane wrote:The NDP left us with a serious shortage of doctors and nurses and this government certainly deserves credit for trying to rectify that situation.

Back on topic - Glen Clark used very poor judgment in the deck-gate affair and even NDP Attorney General Ujjal Dosanjh insisted that Clark resign. Which he did. The fact that he wasn't found guilty of a crime doesn't absolve him from that poor judgment and he was in fact right to resign

By slashing wages and closing beds? Really?
I hope you are being satirical.

Second thought, I suppose if you have a shortage of hospital staff the best way to rectify that situation is have less beds to staff.

So Clark was innocent but still guilty? That is warped.
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Re: The Glenn Clark affair--politically motivated?

Postby Urbane » Feb 3rd, 2013, 6:07 pm

Here we go with more re-writing of history. Just say things over and over again and try to get people to believe it. Yes, the NDP cut the number of spaces in medical schools for doctors and nurses. Yes we had a doctor and nursing shortage. Yes, we now have UBCO medical school and the situation is being resolved. I thought the topic of this thread was the Glen Clark deck-gate affair though.
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