17 drunk driving cases tossed because of police.

[zzontar]

To Trigger69 ...

I agree with any number of your comments regarding drining and driving and the right of society to remove such people from the road using any reasonable means given them. Those commenting who can not accurately determine their own MAXIMUM alcohol content without being tested by the police should not be driving after drinking. Any normally intelligent person who can count up to 100 can easily determine their BTA reading by knowing their sex, their weight, the accurate amount consumed, the class of liquor consumed and the time period over which the beverage is consumed.

Even if you followed a chart and were below the limit, there are factors like residual mouth alcohol or blowing into the ASD a number of times consecutively that will give a falsely high reading. This shouldn't happen with a cop who knows proper procedure, but not all of them do.

[goatboy]

.... blowing into the ASD a number of times consecutively that will give a falsely high reading. This shouldn't happen with a cop who knows proper procedure, but not all of them do.

This is not true.

[simnut]

TO simnut ...

The point of the matter is the same regardless of who was taken off the road for drinking and driving. Drinking and driving is dangerous and contributes to the death of about 1,250 innocent mothers, fathers and children each year across Canada.

I totally agree!

Arguing over whether an identified drinking driver should be actually found to have been drinking and driving or not ......

Read what you just said! You don't care if the driver is legally found guilty of drinking and driving......wow! Our whole legal society regarding ANY "charge" or "allegation" is based on being FOUND guilty...not just accused!

This is my last post regarding the point under discussion.

You are missing my point entirely! I am NOT against nailing every legally impaired driver to the wall......take their license away for life!!!!! But there are times...like when the BAC levels are in the grey area or close to the FAIL and WARN levels, that extra care has to be taken , and when procedure isn't followed.....or in a case when a "bad" cop just screws you up.......we citizens NEED proper avenues of appeal.....protection. As much as YOU want protection on the highway from drunks, citizens (well some) want protection from falsely made accusations!

[zzontar]

If you have residual mouth alcohol that causes you to blow over, blowing consecutively will still give a falsely high reading and without a 15 minute waiting period, it would be impossible to tell if the mouth alcohol was the cause, yet you would be charged for the falsely high reading because you had to blow consecutively.

[zzontar]

Even diabetes or not eating much can give a falsely high reading which most people including the cops wouldn't think of taking into account.

[Trigger69]

Even diabetes or not eating much can give a falsely high reading which most people including the cops wouldn't think of taking into account.

Keep making excuses...

[KL3-Something]

Even diabetes or not eating much can give a falsely high reading which most people including the cops wouldn't think of taking into account.

Wrong. Where DO you get your information from anyway?

[twobits]

Wrong. Where DO you get your information from anyway?

From a respected website. I would be interested in your response to their claims that breathalizers detect methyls in the breath of diabetics and thus falsly read that alcohol is present.

http://www.diabeteshealth.com/read/2006 ... -diabetes/


DUI or Diabetes?
By Lawrence Taylor, JD
Sep 1, 2006

Are You at Risk of being falsely accused?


Was that person arrested for drunk driving truly under the influence of alcohol—or could it be that he was simply a diabetic having a low? The similarity in symptoms caused by alcohol intoxication and low blood glucose levels is striking and commonly leads to easy—but false—conclusions by law enforcement officers.

Diabetes is a very common disease in America. Fifteen to 20 percent of all drivers on the road are diabetics. The reactions of a person in the early stages of a low blood glucose attack include dizziness, blurred vision, slurred speech, weakness, loss of coordination and confusion. Coincidentally, these are the symptoms and signs that the patrol officer is looking for in a person who is driving under the influence of alcohol. And the officer’s observations are quickly followed by a failing performance on DUI field sobriety tests.

But a Breathalyzer Will Clear a Diabetic, Right?

Wrong.

Ignoring for the moment the inherent inaccuracy of these breath-alcohol machines, most suffer from a little-known design defect—they do not actually measure the alcohol in the blood. Rather, they use infrared beams of light. The light beams are absorbed by any chemical compound in the breath sample (including ethyl alcohol) that contains the “methyl group” in its molecular structure. The more absorption, the higher the blood-alcohol reading. The machine is programmed to assume that the compound is “probably” alcohol.

Unfortunately, thousands of compounds containing the methyl group can register as alcohol. One of these is acetone. And a well-documented byproduct of hyperglycemia is a state called ketoacidosis, which causes the production of acetones in the breath. In other words, the Breathalyzer will read significant levels of alcohol on a diabetic’s breath, where in fact there may be little or none at all.

Scientific Research Sides With Diabetic Drivers

In the September 2003 issue of Medical and Toxicological Information Review, John Arnold, MD, in a scientific article entitled “Hypoglycemia: Driving Under the Influence,” reports that:

Hypoglycemia (abnormally low levels of blood glucose) is frequently seen in connection with driving error on this nation’s roads and highways, including accidents with personal and material damage. Even more frequently are unjustified DUIs or DWIs stemming from hypoglycemic symptoms that can closely mimic those of a drunk driver.

Actually, you don’t even need to be a diabetic to display hypoglycemic-induced symptoms of intoxication. Perfectly normal, healthy individuals can experience temporary conditions of low blood glucose after consuming small amounts of alcohol, resulting in exaggerated but false symptoms of intoxication. Fasting glycemia can exist if a person has not eaten in 24 hours or has been on a low-carbohydrate diet. Production of glucose in the liver is stopped while the alcohol is broken down. Result: The blood glucose level will drop, affecting the central nervous system—and producing symptoms of a person who is under the influence of alcohol.

More Education on Diabetes Needed By the Law

Undoubtedly, thousands of diabetics have been falsely accused—and convicted—of drunk driving in the past because of nothing more than a physiological condition. Law enforcement, prosecutors and defense attorneys need to become educated about the false symptoms and breath readings associated with this condition.
- See more at: http://www.diabeteshealth.com/read/2006 ... Wtknh.dpuf

[zzontar]

Thanks for the unbiased link twobits, here's another one from the manual of an ASD:

http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/breathal ... manual.pdf

6. Conditions that increase the amount of ketones on the breath, such as
diabetes and low caloric intake, may cause a false positive test.

As KL-3 did not know this , it's proof right there that not all cops realize this and might not take it into consideration and cheerleaders will always be there saying excuses, excuses.

[Trigger69]

As KL-3 did not know this , it's proof right there that not all cops realize this and might not take it into consideration and cheerleaders will always be there saying excuses, excuses.

Cheerleaders? Do you actually read what you write and digest it before you post it. I would hazard to say that is a no. The days of people drinking and driving and getting away with it are over zzontar face it. Your posts are nothing more than excuses and this public forum is your way trying to make what you may or may not have done right. Well I dont buy it. Yes the ASD's may not be perfect but what you are forgetting is the ASD is not the end all/be all when it comes to determining if the person behind the wheel is drunk. Its a tool that cops have that can aid in this determination nothing more. You make it sound like a cop pulls someone over randomly and says "hey lets give this guy and ASD". This is not the case. There are many observations that go along with the breath demand not to mention the converstions had with the driver. Open your eyes and stop looking at this issue from the side of being a cop/govt hater because your attitude is shinning thru for all to see.

[zzontar]

Cheerleaders? Do you actually read what you write and digest it before you post it. I would hazard to say that is a no. The days of people drinking and driving and getting away with it are over zzontar face it. Your posts are nothing more than excuses and this public forum is your way trying to make what you may or may not have done right. Well I dont buy it. Yes the ASD's may not be perfect but what you are forgetting is the ASD is not the end all/be all when it comes to determining if the person behind the wheel is drunk. Its a tool that cops have that can aid in this determination nothing more. You make it sound like a cop pulls someone over randomly and says "hey lets give this guy and ASD". This is not the case. There are many observations that go along with the breath demand not to mention the converstions had with the driver. Open your eyes and stop looking at this issue from the side of being a cop/govt hater because your attitude is shinning thru for all to see.

I stated facts which you say are excuses, I believe all facts should be taken into account, you don't. You're right about other observations though, like absolutely no sign of impairment, spotless record, the driver offering to do a roadside sobriety check, the cop letting the driver move his car after pulling his license... hey, wait a minute, those didn't make a difference either!

[zzontar]

Yes the ASD's may not be perfect but what you are forgetting is the ASD is not the end all/be all when it comes to determining if the person behind the wheel is drunk.

Actually, it can be an end all when there's a faulty appeal system and one can't afford to go to the supreme court and one ends up unemployed because of a blemish on their abstract and they end up drawing from the system when they'd rather be putting into it.
The ASD's are not perfect, neither are the cops. Too bad that can leave an innocent person in the gutter, but it's not you, so continue on with your cheerleading.

[Trigger69]

Actually, it can be an end all when there's a faulty appeal system and one can't afford to go to the supreme court and one ends up unemployed because of a blemish on their abstract and they end up drawing from the system when they'd rather be putting into it.
The ASD's are not perfect, neither are the cops. Too bad that can leave an innocent person in the gutter, but it's not you, so continue on with your cheerleading.

All true but maybe you should just take some responsibility for your actions and realize it was you that drove drunk...no?

[abbyrugby]

From a respected website. I would be interested in your response to their claims that breathalizers detect methyls in the breath of diabetics and thus falsly read that alcohol is present.

http://www.diabeteshealth.com/read/2006 ... -diabetes/

ZING!

[zzontar]

All true but maybe you should just take some responsibility for your actions and realize it was you that drove drunk...no?

I don't believe anyone should have to accept responsibility when not only are they not drunk but not over the limit (do you really think cops let drunks move their car after taking their license away?). You yourself admitted ASD's are not perfect and it's apparent not all cops know everything they're supposed to, so how could you possibly believe it's impossible for anyone to be wrongly charged?