Mounties Accused of Rape

[Treblehook]

100% right on with your last post KL-3. Factual and in no way exagerated. "It is what it is" as they say these days. Fortunately, or unfortunately [depending on where you stand] few people are ever exposed to the realities of which you speak. If some of those uninformed people, who are so quick to criticize and condemn, had a little more specific knowledge of what really occurs, perhaps they would be less inclined to pre-judge these complaints. A lot of dedicated members of the RCMP make meaningful contributions to these remote communities, day in and day out. They would be appalled, angered and highly motivated to purge their ranks of any fellow officers who would do such dispicable acts as have been complained of in this instance. They sure as hell wouldn't be seeking revenge against victims of sexual assaults or death threats. The members who provide policing to these remote communities [almost without exception] enjoy the work, even though it means sacrifices on their part and on the part of their families. Many residents of communities like those being discussed, admire and appreciate the efforts of the officers who police and provide other services to their communities. As in all locales, there are always those who are on the other side of the fence, who don't like the police. In recent times, the voices of the latter seem to take priority in the media, etc and the silent majority remain just that.. silent. Bitching, complaining and overly dramatized allegations of police abuses make much more sensational press! That is today's reality.

[Snman]

^^^^^^^^^ Ditto ^^^^^^^^^ You tell em KL-3.

[cutter7]

I don't know if it is true that the complaints come from 5 out of 10 communities visited or not, however none of the complaints have been investigated and substantiated, so they really don't mean anything yet do they. Were it otherwise, God forbid that anyone should be falsely accused of anything. Right thinking people [in this country] adhere to the notion of "innocent until proven guilty", a very simple, but valued, concept.[/quote]

all a person has to do is read the article, Researchers spent five weeks in 10 northern B.C. towns last summer and conducted 87 interviews with 42 indigenous women and eight indigenous girls from age 15 to 60.

The most serious allegation involved a woman who told researchers that she was raped and threatened with death by four RCMP officers after she was abused in a remote location.

and yes,, it does say allegations. 5 out of 10 communities have made these allegations that is pretty alarming

[Fancy]

And if those allegations aren't true, that too would be alarming.

[Treblehook]

Precisely and there is a hell of a lot of difference between an uninvestigated allegation and one substantiated through legitimate investigation. It doesn't make one iota of difference if the allegations are made in one location or in more than one... particularly in circumstances such as these current ones come from. If there ever was a situation where it would be prudent and wise to await the results of the investigation, this is it.

[diggerdick]

These allegations obviously have to be proven. But the culture of fear and trust Makes that very difficult to do When any RCMP members Is involved.

Just remember,There have been many cases just lately involving RCMP That the average citizen would just be baffled about ,And believe it certainly could not be true.

Back in the 1980s, there was a judge up in Prince George That preyed on young native girls that were in his court. And he got away with it on the city streets Under the eyes of the RCMP For many years.

It's a very well documented case , And the RCMP complicity in the matter Was whitewashed to protect the system. But I'll guarantee you they knew about it And looked the other way.

These people have good reason not to trust.

[Ken7]

cutter7"

all a person has to do is read the article, Researchers spent five weeks in 10 northern B.C. towns last summer and conducted 87 interviews with 42 indigenous women and eight indigenous girls from age 15 to 60.

The most serious allegation involved a woman who told researchers that she was raped and threatened with death by four RCMP officers after she was abused in a remote location.

and yes,, it does say allegations. 5 out of 10 communities have made these allegations that is pretty alarming.

It would be very interesting to see what the questions asked were.

It is sometimes not what is asked although how it is asked. Sexual assault is a very difficult topic to investigate. In some cases leading questions give false answers.

You don't have to go to far back although a very well known case out of Saskatchewan was Martinsville. Untrained Police officers in the area of child abuse were asking children from a daycare if they had been sexually assaulted. Three police officers and one past Chief of Police were wrongly accused.

I am not saying there is not some truth to the allegations as there may be although having untrained people asking questions, sometimes gives false and untrue results.

If the numbers are correct and factual, I'd be alarmed too.

[Treblehook]

Ken7. Your point is pretty much what I have been alluding to. The credibility of the results of investigative efforts such as launched by these NY Human Rights people, can be questionable to say the least. What questions were asked; how were the questions phrased and framed; what discussion occurred before the questions were asked; what consequences or compensation might occur as redress for people who claim to have been victimized, etc, etc. There are far too many variables that can and do effect the outcome of interviews of this nature. To suggest that all of the residents of these remote communities, live in total fear of the RCMP members who provide policing to them, is ludicrous. Anyone who subscribes to that belief has little or no knowledge of those remote places, their inhabitants or the interpersonal dynamics that are at play. Knowledge of life in remote aboriginal communities that is based primarily on media stories is not sufficient to understand anything of what's going on.

[Donald G]

It is a good thing that making unsubstantiated and unproven allegations against a person or group of people is not a breach of criminal law or many of the people making their unsubstantiated comments would soon be on the inside looking out. The cops may be guilty. The cops may be completely innocent. NO PROOF HAS BEEN OFFERED TO DATE. Those ruled by emotion are at the shallow end of the gene pool. Medical science testing strongly suggests that those ruled predominantly by the emotional part of the brain rather than the intellectual part of the brain are so disposed due to a multi-generational delay in the evolution of their brains.

[Donald G]

These allegations by the phantom people of the NY Human Rights remind me of what has taken place a number of times in the past where ALLEGATIONS AGAINST THE RCMP THAT LATER PROVED COMPLETELY FALSE were hyped in the press for a number of weeks, months and in some cases years.

Some years back a young RCMP member in Alexis Creek was accused of beating an elderly native gentleman to death. The intensity of the allegations destroyed his career and caused him to leave the RCMP due to illness. A few years later the deceased persons wife, on her death bed, admitted to having herself run over him with her car and repeated a completely false story given her by the leaders of the Red Power Movement who were active in Canada at the time. For months the same Red Power movement alleged that the young native killed execution style near Wounded Knee had been murdered "in cold blood" by the FBI. The real murderer was later found to be a past member of the Red Power movement who had moved to Vancouver. Similarly, a young native male killed at a roadblock near Cache Creek was said to have been shot by a police officer but later proven to have been shot with a firearm found in the native encampment.

Mr Eby of the BCCLA has become notorious for giving later unsubstantiated allegations about the police to the Vancouver Sun and Province. Particularly reprehensible was the allegation that a VPD officer had been video taped shooting a homeless person without justification. Like almost all of Mr Eby's allegation against the police the information proved false as did a number of similar allegations made by him in his trip through Northern BC about a year ago. The fact that he has run for election in a provincial by-election and lost should not be overlooked.

The police are not perfect but when we expect them to stand in the front lines and maintain order in our society (REGARDLESS OF THE TWISTED PEOPLE WITH WHOM THEY HAVE TO DEAL) the least we can do is take allegations for what they are worth and recognize that many people who make such allegations have their own selfish agenda ... and it ain't to uncover the truth. Time and honest Canadians, including most police officers, do that.

[diggerdick]

Sadly,There's been way too many proven Allegations of police misconduct and abuse

For the general public, to openly deny This happening. The RCMP have brought this upon themselves With their holier than thou know it all attitude.

Many Canadian citizens, are simply not shocked By any allegations now.

[Fancy]

Sadly,There's been way too many proven Allegations of police misconduct and abuse

For the general public, to openly deny This happening. The RCMP have brought this upon themselves With their holier than thou know it all attitude.

Many Canadian citizens, are simply not shocked By any allegations now.

Consider Canadian citizens are including RCMP members that include family and friends. Look to their leadership before throwing the whole works under the bus.

[Donald G]

To diggerdick ...

Have you personally ever met or talked to even one of the NY 'experts' that are alleged to have uncovered this mass wrongdoing by the RCMP in northern B.C.? ... information that no Canadian living in the areas seems to have run across? Do you know what actual evidence there is to support even one of the allegations? Do you know who has possession of that evidence? Or whether there is any intent to process the evidence? Have you ever lived in a Northern B.C. town for any length of time and personally witnessed the relationship between the towns people and the police, especially Fort St James, Tatche, Fort Ware and/or Ingenika? I am having serious trouble relating your unsupported allegations to what I have personally seen and experienced in each of those towns.

[cutter7]

To diggerdick ...

Have you personally ever met or talked to even one of the NY 'experts' that are alleged to have uncovered this mass wrongdoing by the RCMP in northern B.C.? ... information that no Canadian living in the areas seems to have run across? Do you know what actual evidence there is to support even one of the allegations? Do you know who has possession of that evidence? Or whether there is any intent to process the evidence? Have you ever lived in a Northern B.C. town for any length of time and personally witnessed the relationship between the towns people and the police, especially Fort St James, Tatche, Fort Ware and/or Ingenika? I am having serious trouble relating your unsupported allegations to what I have personally seen and experienced in each of those towns.

Where do you come up with the statement that " information that no canadian living in the areas seems to have run across?

are you suggesting that an american group made up these accusations?

I grew up in northern bc and I have no problem believing these allegations... I also note that one of our many rcmp contributors who has experience working in the north had experienced derogatory comments and mistrust just because of the uniform he was wearing.

[Snman]

Who cares what some watchdog group of imbeciles from NY thinks anyway? What business is it of theirs? How 'bout they deal with NY issues and keep their hypocritical yank noses out of ours.

edited for spelling