No trial for CPR-stopping cop?

[A_Britishcolumbian]

so what is missing from this story for it to make a lick of sense? what would be the point of making the person stop cpr?

No charges will be laid against a Mountie in Langley who told a civilian to stop trying to resuscitate a dying man.

The civilian complained to the RCMP and the Independent Investigations Office determined that the officer might have committed an offence.

The BC Crown prosecutor's office says it happened last September when a man crashed his vehicle because of a medical event and a person on the scene started CPR.

The office says when the RCMP officer arrived, he checked the driver's pulse and, because he thought the man was breathing, he ordered the person to stop CPR.

Firefighters arrived and could not find a pulse and so started CPR again; despite numerous medical interventions, the man died in hospital.

The prosecutor's office says charges will not be laid because there's no substantial likelihood that the officer involved would be convicted.

http://www.castanet.net/news/BC/115955/ ... opping-cop

[A_Britishcolumbian]

the 20 to 90 seconds sounds very suspicious, with emts seconds from the scene, why would the rcmp member not leave the decision to the emts?

METRO VANCOUVER -- A Langley RCMP officer will not be charged with impeding an attempt to save a life, after stopping a civilian from performing CPR on a dying man.

The Independent Investigations Office (IIO) said the officer believed the man was responding to CPR during the Sept. 22 incident in Langley City.

The incident took place just after 3 p.m., when an Abbotsford man suffered a medical emergency while driving off the 203rd Street Overpass. He turned east on 62nd Aveneu, then veered through the westbound lanes and crashed into a building.

Civilians ran to help the man and call 911, and at the instruction of the emergency operator, they pulled the man from the vehicle.

At about 3:15 p.m., a civilian witness began administering CPR, according to the IIO report on the incident.

The man was a level two first aid attendant and was operating on the directions of the emergency operator to continue until help arrived.

Shortly after CPR began, an RCMP officer arrived and checked the victim's neck for a pulse. He also checked the driver's breathing by placing a hand over the victim's face.

The driver appeared to be breathing, and the Mountie told the civilian to stop performing CPR.

The civilian and RCMP officer disagreed, and after an argument, the civilian stopped.

For between 20 and 90 seconds, the man was without CPR support, until firefighters pulling up to the scene took over medical care. They found the man had no pulse and again began CPR.

The victim was airlifted to hospital, and despite the work by the civilian, firefighters, paramedics, and doctors at the hospital, he was pronounced dead in hospital at 4:41 p.m., according to the IIO report.

A civilian complained to the RCMP about the incident, and the investigation was handed over to the IIO.

The office said there was no chance of conviction. The officer had been instructed in his first aid courses that CPR should be continued until one of several criteria are met, including that the patient begins to respond or until medical help takes over.

"The available evidence indicates that the officer believed the driver was breathing and that first responders were arriving on scene when he instructed the civilian to stop CPR," said the IIO report.

http://www.vancouversun.com/news/charge ... story.html

[GenesisGT]

You can read the Crown decision for not following through with charges here. The officer believed the patient had responded to the CPR and according to his first aid training CPR could be halted when the patient responds, also the firefighters were on scene to continue any medical assistance needed.


http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CEEQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ag.gov.bc.ca%2Fprosecution-service%2Fmedia-statements%2Fpdf%2F14-11-IIO-Case-Media-Clear-Statement.pdf&ei=RimEU4z8OoHxoATu1oKgDg&usg=AFQjCNGJTw34Jau6IczTEOZJpHErMSybhA&bvm=bv.67720277,d.cGU

[A_Britishcolumbian]

i think folks 'round here might say the cop got off on a technicality, and i can see that. from your source...

The available evidence is capable of establishing that the officer impeded or attempted to
prevent the civilian from continuing his efforts to administer CPR to the driver. However, this is
not the end of the enquiry for the purpose of charge assessment. The question remains
whether, on the available evidence, the Crown could prove that the officer did not have
“reasonable cause” to prevent or impede the civilian from continuing with CPR. To acquit on the
basis of “reasonable cause”, a judge or jury would only need to have a reasonable doubt about
whether “reasonable cause” existed. The officer would not have to prove, on the evidence, that
it did exist.

The available evidence indicates that the officer believed the driver was breathing and that first
responders were arriving on scene when he instructed the civilian to stop CPR. As the driver
was believed to be breathing, the officer may have understood him to be “beginning to respond”
which, from the officer’s training, is a basis for discontinuing CPR.

what i am asking, is given the very close proximity of an obviously superior authority, the emts/firefighters, why would the rcmp member not err on the side of caution and let cpr continue for the additional few seconds until they made the call?

[simnut]

i think folks 'round here might say the cop got off on a technicality, and i can see that. from your source...



what i am asking, is given the very close proximity of an obviously superior authority, the emts/firefighters, why would the rcmp member not err on the side of caution and let cpr continue for the additional few seconds until they made the call?

Why would you keep giving CPR to a person that has responded and doesn't require it??????????? Duh.........

[Smurf]

I believe there is also a theory that you never continue or do CPR when a victim is breathing on their own. You can do more harm by breaking/working against their natural rhythm. That is why you also never practice CPR on a person. At least this is what I was taught. Once they are breathing on their own you stop immediately and monitor.

[Oxl3y]

CPR is more of an organ preserving measure than a life saving one, if you require it and there is no aed around your chances aren't good. If the officer thought the patient had responded he definitely made the right call in stopping the cpr.

[wanderingman]

CPR is more of an organ preserving measure than a life saving one, if you require it and there is no aed around your chances aren't good. If the officer thought the patient had responded he definitely made the right call in stopping the cpr.

I doubt the Call made by the COP was correct.Why did the attending medical experts restart it(cpr) and why was there this long entailed enquire if in fact the the cop was 100% correct which by looks of all material available to read indicates the cop was incorrect(wrong)

[mexi cali]

because he thought the man was breathing, he ordered the person to stop CPR.

That's why. The answer to your question is in your post.

[mexi cali]

There are several types of respirations that are not considered "breathing" according to what I have read and the officer may have noted one of these forms of inhalations and believed that the patient had started breathing on their own when they in fact had not.

Cop made a judgement call based on their experience and unfortunately in this case, they were wrong.

There is no indication however that even if the Good Sam had continued CPR that the patient would have survived.

An excerpt by Gordon A. Ewy M.D.

More than half the patients in cardiac arrest gasp. Gasping has been described as snoring, gurgling, moaning, snorting, agonal or labored breathing. However, bystanders often misinterpret gasping and other unusual vocal sounds as breathing and do not call 9-1-1 or begin lifesaving chest compressions quickly enough

[Liquidnails]

In this case I don't see what charges against the officer would accomplish.

[Smurf]

It's a hard call. We have to assume that after a full investigation, he did the appropriate thing. There will always be two sides to the story but even doctors and nurses can make a mistake. It is seldom black and white and he did what he thought was best. I have done CPR a few times with both failure and success and you always try to do what you believe is right at the moment. I'm just happy I didn't have to make this decision because it is no fun.

No one knows for sure that the patient wasn't breathing on their own and quit again in the 90 or so seconds they say they waited. It is very important to monitor them closely. No one will ever know for sure. We worked on and off for over an hour on the road in our private ambulance from the work site on a fellow worker. When we got to the hospital emergency he was semi- conscious. Hospital staff took over, he stopped breathing on the way in and they never revived him. We never even considered they did something wrong, it was just a sad ending. If it had have been a nurse or a doctor that said to stop would we even be talking about this.

[BelieveNothing]

It strikes me as ironic that people think the RCMP should not be required to be mental health professionals, but here it would seem that the RCMP take it upon themselves to be medical professionals.

Strange that.

The rcmp officer should have allowed the first responder to continue with his course of action.

Cops seem to always think they know best.

Proof is in the puddin!

[Amarow121]

It's also possible that the initial CPR was successful, and that the patient did a) regain a pulse or b) always had a pulse. In which case the RCMP officer was correct in stopping CPR.

It's also possible that the patient lost that pulse, and that on re-evaluation by the Fire Department (as I understand they arrived next) that the patient was pulseless again. In which case, restarting CPR was the correct call.

A patient's condition can change, and it can change quickly. I wouldn't be so quick to judge on this case.

[Catz]

That is very correct.

You do NOT do CPR if the patient is breathing and has a pulse.
If they have a pulse, but no breathing, they you do the breathing only.
Why the hell would you do CPR on someone that has a pulse and is breathing?
If they respond to the CPR, you stand back, and continuously reassess ..the condition can change for many reasons.