Martin Mars Petition

[Glacier]

18,000 people have signed the petition. That would be 18,000 self-appointed aerial fire fighting experts who actually know NOTHING about aerial fire fighting. The old petition game. Overwhelming numbers of ignorant knee-jerk reactionaries. Hopefully the government doesn't cave in just to be popular.

[KL3-Something]

Ya I heard the guy spearheading the petition on AM1150 earlier today. He doesn't have a clue and you can tell that he is pushing this based almost solely on nostalgia.

[gman313]

It is an extremely cool aircraft. My Grandpa helped build it!

But nostalgia and cool does not mean cost effective and most efficient.

It probably does make more sense to have the 4 smaller skimmers, both financially and strategically for fighting fires, which is why I did not sign the petition.

But again - a very cool aircraft!! Cant imagine what it costs per hour to fly, especially with only 1 left.

[my5cents]

I'm thinking of petitioning the city of Kelowna to return Bernard to dirt, wooden raised sidewalks and hitching rails, that would be really cool.

I love the Martin Mars, but huge crew for maintenance, takes a crew of 4 to fly it. Sorry, I think it's place is in a museum.

[Donald G]

I wonder how many of the 18,000 people who signed the petition would be willing to put up any money to support their financially ridiculous desire to force the taxpayers to continue supporting a completely out of date machine?

[Rwede]

Just wait, Bill VanderScalm will be looking for petition donations any day now.

[GordonH]

Hell of a water bomber, nothing comes close to its payload.

Its getting old and operating costs are only going up, retire this plane to museum.

Yes, it was very welcomed in Kelowna during Okanagan Mountain fire.

[my5cents]

Hell of a water bomber, nothing comes close to its payload.

Its getting old and operating costs are only going up, retire this plane to museum.

Yes, it was very welcomed in Kelowna during Okanagan Mountain fire.

Yes, however I've heard that the scoopers can dump more liters over a period of time than the MM can. I have a one hour video of the MM working a fire down south, I think Mexico. They took semi truck loads of parts and equipment to service the plane, plus a mobile floating dock to service and fuel the plane.

Even the cockpit/crew area of the MM is huge, so you can see why it wouldn't take long for the cost to be up there.

[goatboy]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AzQK1t6SWZg

[wanderingman]

18,000 people have signed the petition. That would be 18,000 self-appointed aerial fire fighting experts who actually know NOTHING about aerial fire fighting. The old petition game. Overwhelming numbers of ignorant knee-jerk reactionaries. Hopefully the government doesn't cave in just to be popular.

really??

new plane delivers 8195 litres in 19 minutes mars delivers 19000 litres in 19 minutes
I see the new design and its agility(can access 1000 mores lakes than mars can)
I think we need both units

[Glacier]

really??

new plane delivers 8195 litres in 19 minutes mars delivers 19000 litres in 19 minutes
I see the new design and its agility(can access 1000 mores lakes than mars can)
I think we need both units

It's not needed. You can run two of the new plans for a 1/3 of the cost of the Mars. Plus, there's only 1 Mars left anyway.

[Dizzy1]

The Martin Mars is awesome, and there is nothing wrong with nostalgia, which unfortunately comes at a very steep price.

As impressive as it is, now this would be my dream job ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaUDs48h2ns

[LoneWolf_53]

18,000 people have signed the petition. That would be 18,000 self-appointed aerial fire fighting experts who actually know NOTHING about aerial fire fighting. The old petition game. Overwhelming numbers of ignorant knee-jerk reactionaries. Hopefully the government doesn't cave in just to be popular.

really??

new plane delivers 8195 litres in 19 minutes mars delivers 19000 litres in 19 minutes
I see the new design and its agility(can access 1000 mores lakes than mars can)
I think we need both units

The new plane also does double duty by carrying fire retardant at the same time from what I read, plus they are more agile.

Nostalgia alone isn't a good enough reason to fritter away tax dollars, even if 18,000 clueless people think so. Besides which some folk will sign darn near anything, particularly if the information presented is skewed in such a manner as to appeal to the kneejerk nostalgic sector, which this did bang on.

You'd think that one pass by the Martin Mars would have magically put out the Scotty Creek fire, if one were to buy into the hype.

It's an antique and it's heyday has gone by.

[my5cents]

I think the best plane for the job is the Fire Boss, but the numbers quoted by the government are all over the map, mixing apples with pears, strangely all errors in favor of the Fire Boss.

I've seen the government state the MM has a 19,000 liter capacity, they go on to say that's 5000 gallons.

If you do the math, in this country we measure liquid in Imperial gallons or liters, 19,000 liters is 4179 gallons.

Most of the reliable literature for the MM state that it carries 6000 gallons = 27,276 liters.

The government says the Fire Boss carries 3025 Liters and says that is "800 gallons." 3025 liters is 665 Imperial Gallons.

The government is saying the MM has a "19 minute round trip" and the Fire Boss has a "7 minute round trip" (I have no idea how you can give a time for a round trip when you don't know which lake and the location of the fire).

So a fair comparison of capacity is Fire Boss - 665 gallons Martin Mars - 6000 gallons, so the MM carries just under 10 times the water.

The MM is old, it take a lot of time and money to keep it running, it has a crew of 4. It's not the best overall plane in general.

I think the lies from the government were overkill. Accurate numbers and calculations of same has never been the Liberals strong suit, and neither has truth.

[Dizzy1]

If only I had the money Bill Gates does ... I'd by the Mars and turn it into my own private flying yacht :)