Site C

[Urban Cowboy]

Explain meaning full way. Hunting grounds are just a way of complaining, how many hunt for food now ?

Exactly. Whatever game they have available there to hunt will still be there just in a bit different location. It's not as though the deer are going to stand in place and drown as the water rises. If anything their fishing should be even better.

If history is any indicator it's just a typical money grab strategy.

[Gilchy]

https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/documents/corporate/regulatory-planning-documents/integrated-resource-plans/current-plan/irp-summary.pdf

Peak capacity is a key issue. Peak demand is indeed a difficult thing to fully forecast.

When you consider the conservation efforts that have been made, everything from LED bulbs to high efficiency appliances, better insulation standards etc., it is remarkable that BC hit a new peak demand record.

Over the period of a year, demand fluctuates significantly, but you need power (like now with the cold weather) - it needs to be there (otherwise you get brownouts etc.). That means that you need considerably more total demand capacity that when annualized, will look at first glance to be well in excess of annual sales.

The NDP and others choosing to oppose site C are playing on the fact that most of the public do not think about that peak demand/capacity issue. They therefore can fall prey to political chicanery by the NDP that can truthfully show that BC Hydro can annually produce much more power than BC consumes in total over a year, while ignoring peak capacity.

The problem with that is that lack of electricity during peak demand is not an inconvenience, it can even threaten lives.

IF, for example, we exceed the peak capacity of our water supply system, then the short term effect is to have watering restrictions. A brown lawn is not a critical thing.

IF, however, we exceed the peak capacity of the electrical supply system, it is most likely to result in serious harm to people's lives and/or livelihoods. If we did not have enough electricity to meet the peak demand during the recent period (with its new record), then people would experience lack of heat or industries would have been required to shut down. Lack of heat in these cold temperatures can be life threatening, and shutting down industries would result in no pay cheques. Neither of those are acceptable, and running to close to average demand when a peak record occurs could result in both.

In the future, as EVs penetrate further into the automotive market, we can expect peak demand surges that are even heavier. People come home from work, plug in their Prius Prime, and fire up the stove, the lights, the heating, the coffee maker, the TV etc. etc. all around the same time.

That's where the "green" political chicanery peddled by some self-serving politicians falls apart. I find it annoying because they are deliberately ignoring the reality of the situation.

This is a great point. Looking at total annual usage, and not peak demands, would be like looking at Kelowna's average annual temperature of 15 degrees (or whatever), and deciding that a snow jacket and boots are unnecessary as the average temperature is well above zero. When it gets cold (like the last month or so), you're sure glad to have the jacket. Same with electrical generation capacity.

[maryjane48]

what makes you think bc hydro isnt fudging the numbers ? they did say we dont need a dam for 40 years then all of a sudden changed that . right around when clark took over . hmmmmmm .

[maryjane48]

The Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency decided Monday not to take further enforcement action against B.C. Hydro for sediment problems last year at the $9-billion Site C dam project.

Nicolas Courville, the agency’s senior enforcement officer, said in a letter to Hydro that he believes the provincial Crown corporation has taken the necessary steps to ensure that “erosion and sediment control contingency supplies” are stocked at three sites — the Moberly River construction bridge, the right bank drainage tunnel, and the right bank coffer dam.

Hydro had faced the prospect of a federal order and summary fines of up to $200,000 on first offence and $400,000 on subsequent offences if the environmental problems had remained unaddressed at the construction site on the Peace River near Fort St. John.

Courville discovered the non-compliance issues between Nov. 29 and Dec. 2.

Hydro wrote the federal agency Thursday to express concern about the findings and said that it had “implemented measures to return into compliance.”

didn't they say same thing about mount polley , everything good to go . bc hydro skirts the law but if any of us miss a bc hydro bill will they say well just skip the bill and do better job next time? lol

[maryjane48]

Premier Christy Clark announces the Site C dam will go ahead in May of 2016.PNG / VANCOUVER SUN
Environmental compliance on construction of B.C. Hydro’s $9-billion Site C dam has been so poor that repeated and ongoing violations related to sediment control and erosion have harmed water quality and fish habitat, provincial inspection documents reveal. yea thats real green killing off where fish live

“Continued non-compliance with these requirements has caused adverse effects to water quality and fish habitat as a result of the transport of sediments” to the Peace and Moberly river systems, the Environmental Assessment Office documents conclude. “B.C. Hydro has previously been issued three warnings and an order in regards to erosion and sediment control on the Site C project.”

The Crown corporation’s failure to heed multiple warnings about the situation prompted a high-level meeting with Hydro and EAO officials in Victoria to bring the megaproject into compliance.

The EAO “inspection record” documents detail problems such as: large faces of exposed soil leading into a ravine with little or no effort to stop erosion; extremely turbid water; sediment from landslides dumped directly into the Moberly River; sediment fences that don’t work; construction of a causeway over the Moberly River with no culverts or drainage structures in the flood channels; sediments entering the Peace River because of a washed-out culvert; significant ditch erosion.

Hydro deputy CEO Chris O’Riley, who participated in that meeting, said Tuesday he is not going to blame the numerous contractors who work on the Site C site for the problems.
who is at fault? hillary clinton?


based on this alone i see the scoc having something to say and i believe clark and company wont like it

[hobbyguy]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/british-columbia/site-c-inspections-find-issues-during-hydroelectric-projects-construction/article33465803/

"In one order, the EAO says B.C. Hydro recently built an access road – called the Portage Mountain access road – but didn’t conduct surveys or install “amphibian mitigation structures” as required under its certificate."

"The other order, also dated Dec. 22, found BC Hydro was not meeting a condition that requires water quality in potentially affected wells to be monitored twice a year, for a period of 10 years, from the outset of construction"

"BC Hydro says its well-monitoring efforts date back to early 2015, when it placed ads in local papers asking interested well owners to participate.

“No responses were received, so BC Hydro decided to conduct groundwater sampling that would be representative of the water quality of surrounding wells,” Mr. Fitzsimmons said.

Sampling took place in June, September and December of 2015, but the EAO found those steps insufficient and that B.C. Hydro needed to do more to contact well owners."

These are NOT the kinds of issues that the SCOC rules on.

Nor are these kinds of issues unusual in any construction project. In some cases it is just sub-contractors misunderstanding.

[maryjane48]

they will consider how bc hydro conducted itself and if the bc libs have looked the other way on enviromental issues . in muskrat falls they did rule on mercury contamination that you said couldnt happen , so its best be prudent because blindly rushing forward is never the best course to take

[hobbyguy]

Actually no, the worst approach is to ignore the facts and hard realities.

The primary realities that opponents of site C are choosing to ignore:

1. site C will generate the most energy at the lowest environmental cost, and lowest $ cost
2. In order to displace fossil fuels the ideal option is to provide a replacement that is practical, and cost beneficial. The only feasible replacement is electricity at the lowest possible cost, and lots of it.
3. Claiming that future technologies will be better and cheaper is neither verifiable nor realistic. They may be, they may not be. Yes indeed somebody might invent a matter to energy transmutation device in 2150 - or 2200 or ? But the current trajectory is inadequate to expect sufficient impact to make an appreciable difference in our generations. In other words, it is just sticking your head in the sand and procrastinating. Current and short term forecastable options says the best hope for a significant difference is EVs. EVs will require lots of electricity at reasonable costs to be effective. We need to advance that technology and its adoption as fast as possible.

All the rest of the "stuff" thrown out there by opponents of site C is politically motivated, $$$ motivated (e.g. overstated efficiencies and cost benefits of PV panels by sellers of PV panels), or the result of orthodoxies that fail to incorporate the sum of facts available (and that usually rolls back to making $$).

[maryjane48]

and you are choosing to ignore the 2 bands directly affected . and your choosing to lie about a dam being green and this one has already skirted the law as my link clearly showed . and now that clark approved a pipeline when one of the conditions can never be met , i think the scoc is going to say something your not going to like .

[hobbyguy]

To the best of my knowledge, there are no direct effects on the indigenous communities except that indigenous businesses have been given roughly 50% of the sole source contracts that have been let so far for site C.

There are no listed active indigenous settlements in the directly affected area.

The two indigenous groups involved in the legal actions I am aware of are the West Moberly Band (population 207) and the Prophet River Band (population 249). The Prophet River Band is located way up by Fort Nelson, many many miles from site C.
The West Moberly Band is located on Moberly Lake way over by Chetwynd.

You will have to excuse me MJ, but the distance of these bands from site C leaves me with the impression that they are either making trouble just because they can, or are opportunistically after $$$.

[maryjane48]

“BC Hydro said, ‘We’re building our dam, we’re taking your house and do you want to sign now or later,’” Esther Pedersen said of British Columbia Hydro and Power Authority, known as BC Hydro, the provincial utility corporation behind the project. Her family will be forced off their land across the river from the dam project construction site. BC Hydro said over half of the Pedersens’ 160-acre property, including their home, lies within an area that could become unstable because of the dam reservoir. “They drew a straight line across our property just like a plane dropping bombs,” Ms. Pedersen said.

[Smurf]

You do realize that it happens all the time, when building roads or whatever. It is even happening on the new rail trail in the Okanagan. People are paid market value, I believe usually a bit on the high end. I'm sure most people never feel that they are paid enough for their loss, but it does stop people from asking and forcing a ridiculous price.

I'm not saying that I agree totally with it either but it is part of progress, good or bad.

$286,500 is not enough
Wayne Moore - Nov 16, 2016 / 5:00 am | Story

The District of Lake Country denies it owes Oyama resident Colin Day anything more for property expropriated for construction of the Okanagan Rail Trail.

The denial comes from court documents filed in BC Supreme Court earlier this month, in response to a suit filed by Day Oct. 14.

Day is suing the district after it used its power of expropriation, after an agreement between the two sides could not be reached.

Day, a former Kelowna city councillor, purchased the portion of CN Rail line which runs through his property through a first-right-of-refusal provision after the rail line became defunct.

The nearly 50 kilometre track was purchased by jurisdictions in the Central and North Okanagan for construction of a multi-use trail.

Day is suing the District of Lake Country for what he calls 'fair market value' for the lands expropriated, injurious and severance damages, disturbance damages plus costs, interest and penalty interest.

The district paid Day $286,500 for the strip of land running about 740 feet long and 20 metres wide, plus $7,000 for mitigative measures.

In its filing with the BC Supreme Court, the district refutes specific dates made in Day's claim concerning contemplation of zoning of the corridor, transfer of the former rail corridor and when expropriation was contemplated.

It also states part of the compensation paid was for mitigation measures such as installation of a security fence and planting of a cedar privacy hedge.

It further states the public trail will be a positive amenity and has not 'injuriously affected, or lowered the value of the adjacent residential properties.'

And, that monies paid to Day fully compensates for the value of the land and the cost of mitigative measure to alleviate any potential affect of development of the multi-use trail.

A court date has not been set.

[hobbyguy]

Expropriation of lands for the good of all has been a part of reality for a long time. It happened to my family many years ago. Yes, it uproots and changes your life some, but at the same time it benefits many others. And, lol, if you make a bit of stink you can make some money as well.

[madmudder]

Isn't Site C all about supplying free power to the Chinese national LNG company to convert natural gas to lng? I understand it takes a massive amount of electricity to do so. Our politicians are such a push over that we will give our resources away royalty free for the first twenty years. Way to go BC Libs.

[maryjane48]

hobby your family isnt first nations . the idea of just taking native land wont fly anynore .