Christy abandons BC first

[twobits]

Sounds eerily like 'the right to work (for less)' movement down south:

And your comments eerily sound like a mantra from a dinosaur organized labour model. That would be "give up nothing. Ignore that your employer is bleeding red. Do not co-operate under any circumstance". That worked really well for Electro Motive.
It is high time that more labour organizations recognized that their expectations must be tied to the well being and profitability of the employer. They need to be ready to bleed with the employer when the employer bleeds, and structure their expectations for fruit when the employer can harvest. It is really such a simple symbiotic relationship that old labour seems to be unable to grasp. And you flame are a classic example of old labour principles.
Even the CAW is light years ahead of people like you.

[mexi cali]

Personally, whoever is the most qualified to get the job done within the parameters of the contract regardless of where they are from should be hired.

Start with BC applicants and move on from there.

[fluffy]

It is high time that more labour organizations recognized that their expectations must be tied to the well being and profitability of the employer. They need to be ready to bleed with the employer when the employer bleeds, and structure their expectations for fruit when the employer can harvest. It is really such a simple symbiotic relationship that old labour seems to be unable to grasp.

There has been talk for years that union labour was at risk of pricing themselves out of the market, that talk may soon prove to be somewhat prophetic. I might not be the best person to comment on this, for the past couple of years I've worked an unskilled job in the oilsands that grosses six digits, and that was near the bottom of the financial pecking order. Those with any sort of trade certification were doing much better than I. I like the money, but some of the politics leave a nasty taste in one's mouth, and my right-of-center personal outlooks have always had me feeling that these wage levels weren't sustainable when money got tight.

My concern with the CLAC complaints are more around the allegations of reduced quality of working conditions. The money thing was long overdue for a "correction", but the idea of writing contracts that remove rights granted under federal and provincial labour laws is a slippery slope. Good employee/employer relations, the "symbiotic relationship" you mention, operates under the assumption that both sides of the relationship are acting honestly and ethically, that an employee is willing to put in the time and effort to perform with a high degree of productivity, and that the employer is willing to compensate them appropriately. That would be the way labour relations work in heaven, but we all know that there are employees who deliberately under-perform just as there are employers who expect performance over and above what can be considered reasonable. It's already questionable as to where CLAC sits in that scale, but admittedly a lot of those complaints are coming from the more traditional trade unions.

I think I'm going to make a point of seeking out some people who have actually worked on CLAC controlled jobs and see what the feeling is there.

[flamingfingers]

Fluffy wrote:

My concern with the CLAC complaints are more around the allegations of reduced quality of working conditions. The money thing was long overdue for a "correction", but the idea of writing contracts that remove rights granted under federal and provincial labour laws is a slippery slope.

This is the crux of the matter.

A fair and honest employer has no fear that its woirkers will unionize. There are numerous examples that prove this to be true. However, there are considerably more employers who have no compunction in shafting their employees.

CLAC to me sounds like a 'union for the employer'.

[Donald G]

To flamingfingers ...

Since you used the term "CLAC sounds to me like ..." I have to assume that you have no personal knowledge regarding CLAC.

I would be interested in hearing from people who have actually worked on the same job site or within CLAC itself before drawing any conclusions.

[flamingfingers]

*removed*

[Hurtlander]

To flamingfingers ...

Since you used the term "CLAC sounds to me like ..." I have to assume that you have no personal knowledge regarding CLAC.

I would be interested in hearing from people who have actually worked on the same job site or within CLACK itself before drawing any conclusions.

Christian Labour Association of Canada...there isn't any K.
I have worked on job sites along side CLAC members, but there isn't any point mentioning my personal observations because you've already drawn your personal conclusion.

[Donald G]

To Hurtlander ...

Although "you've already drawn your personal conclusion" about what I think of CLAC, I would still like to hear your opinion as to what you thought of it from an "one the job" perspective. Since I know nothing about CLAC other than what I have read ...

[Hurtlander]

To Hurtlander ...

Although "you've already drawn your personal conclusion" about what I think of CLAC, I would still like to hear your opinion as to what you thought of it from an "one the job" perspective. Since I know nothing about CLAC other than what I have read ...

CLAC is nothing more than a legal loophole to get non-Union workers onto a union job site. One example I have is a reasonably large family owned trucking company that signed on with CLAC so they could get their trucks and drivers onto the union controlled loading docks. The family not only owns the trucks and the company, they also hold all the key union positions...they got to "negotiate" and sign their own contract. Their drivers are no better off than non-union employees that get to pay union dues to their employer, it's a terrific scam....

[GEW]

After seeing some of the dismal performance of some of BC Hydro's workforce, I'm not surprised they went with CLAC. I'm not a CLAC fan either, but Hydro's Union membership has forgotten that you still owe your employer an honest day's work.
I have observed many CLAC sites as well, The workers were all well paid and most from BC. You can't guarantee an all BC workforce on a project the size of site C.

[Donald G]

To Hurtlander ...

Could it be that the Union rules were too restrictive and forced non union drivers to resort to CLAC in order to get access to "closed shop" Union work sites ??

[Ka-El]

In a statement this week, the BC Fed says Premier Christy Clark has abandoned a “B.C. First” policy on jobs in awarding a $1.75-billion project for the controversial Site C hydroelectric dam.

The project, the single largest construction project in B.C. history, has been touted to create as many as 1,500 jobs at peak construction, with no guarantee that the jobs created will go to British Columbians.

“Christy Clark has chosen an ironic moment, just before the holidays, to let B.C. workers know they won’t be in line for jobs in this huge project,” said BC Fed president Irene Lanzinger.

“Her holiday message is corporations come before the needs of workers.”

In announcing the contract yesterday, BC Hydro spokesperson David Conway explained there is no guarantee that these jobs will go to B.C. workers due to existing commitments with Alberta and Saskatchewan.

This despite comments made by Conway in September that “we are taking steps to ensure British Columbians are first in line to work on Site C.”

“This government doesn’t understand that when B.C. citizens are paying for a project we expect to maximize the return to the community. That means ensuring any jobs created go first to BC workers,” added Lanzinger.

“The premier needs to step in immediately and ensure that BC Hydro and its contractors put British Columbians to work first and provide important apprenticeship opportunities.”

http://www.castanet.net/news/BC/154695/ ... rs-ignored

[Donald G]

Complaining about artisans from other provinces coming over to BC and working on the Site 6 dam is a blatant example of "what is mine is mine and what is yours is mine too".

Has Alberta or Saskatchewan refused to let BC trades people work in the very lucrative oil patch for the last 20 years ?? Have BC trades people been prohibited from working in the construction market in other provinces ??

IMO the Unions want to create the "scarcity" needed to jack the pay scales up significantly like they did on the very similar Revelstoke Dam project.

Unions are of benefit until they get greedy and then they become a parasitic liability.

[Donald G]

“This government doesn’t understand that when B.C. citizens are paying for a project we expect to maximize the return to the community. That means ensuring any jobs created go first to BC workers,” added Lanzinger.

“The premier needs to step in immediately and ensure that BC Hydro and its contractors put British Columbians to work first and provide important apprenticeship opportunities.”

It seems that the BC Unions are trying to adopt a selfish and greedy "what's mine is mine and what's yours is mine" approach to the upcoming Site 6 dam project.

They seem to have completely forgotten that they have been working in all of the other provinces in the oil and construction industries for the last 20 years.

IMO it is nothing but a calculated effort to try to bring about a trades shortage and justify huge raises for BC Trades people similar to what was done during the similar Revelstoke dam project.

[fluffy]

Why is the BC Fed taking aim at Premier Clark for Davis Conway's mistake ?

In my opinion Ms. Lazinger can go get stuffed. In essence she is advocating putting the Premier against the wall for not breaking an existing inter-provincial agreement that has been a significant benefit to a lot of BC residents. BC tradespeople are not being blocked from Site C jobs, they are simply in competition for those jobs with tradespeople from Alberta and Saskatchewan. If their qualifications are up to standard then their chances are as good as anyone else.

It is becoming all too common for people to try and manipulate public opinion by skirting relevant facts and trying to make an issue into a high emotion situation. The people playing this game know all too well that an emotionally charged perspective often trumps objective reason. Cheap tactics that reflect badly on the people represented by such unethical blowhards. I'm a union member myself but when I see crap like this it pisses me off. What kind of audience is she playing to that she thinks the juvenile nature of these tactics is going to go unnoticed ?
[/rant]