Another ICBC rate increase

[my5cents]

Government Needs To Take Hands Out Of ICBC, Hydro Till

By The Editor on May 22, 2016
not acceptable
By Jordan Bateman, BC CTF. Some things in B.C. politics are as cliché as Lululemon-wearing Vancouverites sipping lattes in a rainstorm.

For example, opposition parties always rail against massive dividend payments flowing from ICBC and BC Hydro into government coffers. Then those parties form government and continue to tap those crown corporations for as much dough as possible.

This year, BC Hydro is set to hand over $545 million to the B.C. government; ICBC will contribute another $257 million. At the same time, both corporations expect to raise rates, causing B.C. residents hardship as they try to make ends meet.

There's a lot of misinformation, and some well thought out correct information in this forum.

It's too bad that, someone who one would have thought would be correct is NOT.

Bateman stating that the government is taking a lot of money from ICBC is completely correct HOWEVER, the statement that ICBC is then raising the rates is VERY misleading.

ICBC is broken into many parts. For insurance there are two. Mandatory and Optional.

Mandatory is the first $200,000 liability coverage that we all have to have on our vehicles to operate them on the road. That area is the area that is loosing money and requires an increase.

The government is taking the millions from the optional area. That's the area that you DON'T have to buy from ICBC. If you don't like the government taking your car insurance money and putting it into general revenue, then buy your optional coverage from private insurance. Plain and simple.

Of course if the cost of ICBC optional and private optional are close to the same amount, which for most of us it is, you are choosing to have your money go into the profits of a private insurance company instead of into your own government. Choice is yours.

The government required ICBC to be broken into these two parts so that private insurance could never say that ICBC was artificially lowering the rates of it's optional coverage to better compete with private. By law ICBC can't use any profits from the either side to supplement the other.

I totally agree that the Liberals are hiding taxes. High user fees, MSP costs, taking money from Hydro and ICBC, to name a few, and then having the gall to say "BC has low taxes".

[Atomoa]

ICBC will no longer insure cars worth over 150K.

About time we as a society stopped paying out for those claims on luxury cars that are more than likely driven poorly.

[my5cents]

ICBC will no longer insure cars worth over 150K.

About time we as a society stopped paying out for those claims on luxury cars that are more than likely driven poorly.

Again an over simplification by the media. ICBC "won't sell coverage", that means, Optional Own Damage Coverage. Since we know that ICBC by law has to sell everyone in BC Public Liability Coverage.

BUT, if you screw up and hit one, your liability coverage will be paying to fix one.

It's a very good move, in my opinion. MANY private insurance companies refuse to sell coverage to high end vehicles as well. Generally most of these vehicle are leased or purchased with the assistance of a loan. No own damage insurance, no lease or loan, thus no flashy car. Oh well.

[LTD]

what an absolute joke now they're segregating people for owning a nice vehicle that more than likely will have less chance of a claim than a hundred thousand dollar pickup this is a blatant attempt at diverting attention from a rate increase plain and simple

[Atomoa]

what an absolute joke now they're segregating people for owning a nice vehicle that more than likely will have less chance of a claim

Why are red sports cars more expensive to insure again? I forget.

If it's one thing I've learned about people with super cars while living in Kelowna, it's that they are all responsible people who respect the rules of society and the road. They are humble people who think the rules definitely apply to them.

[my5cents]

what an absolute joke now they're segregating people for owning a nice vehicle that more than likely will have less chance of a claim than a hundred thousand dollar pickup this is a blatant attempt at diverting attention from a rate increase plain and simple

Well the rate increase has NOTHING to do with Own Damage Coverage and that is what they will not be selling to owners of vehicles that cost over $150,000.

"Nice vehicle" ? you can get a lot of vehicle for under $150 G's

Those "nice vehicles" are purchased by the guys with problems, problems like "small hands".

The increase, ICBC is asking for is caused by liability claims that are covered by the first $200,000 of liability coverage each of us has on our vehicles.

You want to stop the increases, do what Quebec has done. No Fault insurance. Make car insurance like WCB claims. You get wage loss and medical, you don't get Tort payments. Pain and suffering, loss of enjoyment of life. etc etc.

Some have a threshold where if the claim is catastrophic then No Fault kicks out. But for the regular fender bender, or rear ender, suck it up cupcake. We would see a reduction in rates vs an increase.

Lawyer would cry like babies.

If you look at a graph of when the liability payments for ICBC started their sharp increase ? It's the minute lawyers were allowed to advertise.

We've all heard them. "I got hit and I'm going to shove it to ICBC, I've got a great lawyer and I'm going to get a bundle".

Well that person is the reason we are all continually going to pay higher premiums.

The "ICBC" he is going to get a bundle from is US.

[my5cents]

Why are red sports cars more expensive to insure again? I forget.

If it's one thing I've learned about people with super cars while living in Kelowna, it's that they are all responsible people who respect the rules of society and the road. They are humble people who think the rules definitely apply to them.

You forgot the part about them only driving to church on Sundays in them ?

[ken531a]

The key word here is monopoly.
Whenever you have a monopoly you have mismanagement for the simple fact that the people have no other choice.

When I go in to get my insurance , I comment on how I'm getting tired of the government using ICBC as a form of false taxation. And the people behind the desk are astonished by my accusations. LOL

You have to ask yourself where is the tipping point. At what point do even the most satisfied customers start to revolt.

[my5cents]

The key word here is monopoly.
Whenever you have a monopoly you have mismanagement for the simple fact that the people have no other choice.

When I go in to get my insurance , I comment on how I'm getting tired of the government using ICBC as a form of false taxation. And the people behind the desk are astonished by my accusations. LOL

You have to ask yourself where is the tipping point. At what point do even the most satisfied customers start to revolt.

First you say "monopoly" then you say "I'm getting tired of the government using ICBC as a form of false taxation"

The monopoly part of your insurance is not touched by the government.

The part that is taken (and I don't agree with it either) by the government is from the optional part. You don't have to buy optional from ICBC you can buy it anywhere.

I buy my optional from private, none of my insurance dollars go to the Liberal "taxation plan".

Most of us have several millions of dollars of liability coverage, plus own damage (collision) and comprehensive (fire, theft, vandalism). I only buy $200,000 worth of liability coverage from ICBC, that's the minimum mandatory I can buy from ICBC. The rest, several million in liability, own damage and comprehensive from private.

[ken531a]

The monopoly part of your insurance is not touched by the government.
I would like to see real proof of that.
If that was true basic coverage would not continually go up

[rookie314]

If ICBC had to cater to their customers to survive, like private companies do, they would be out of business in a week.

[my5cents]

The monopoly part of your insurance is not touched by the government.
I would like to see real proof of that.
If that was true basic coverage would not continually go up

What makes you think that "if it was true that the monopoly part of ICBC insurance can not be given to the government", that then basic coverage would not continually go up ?

What part of our car insurance do you think is the least profitable ? The first $200,000 liability.

If Car A hits Car B, what happens with insurance ?
If Car A has own damage insurance (optional coverage), he might not, he might have it with ICBC, or with private, that insurance after the deductible will fix Car A.
Car A's liability coverage with ICBC (mandatory) will pay for Car B and will pay for anyone injured in Car A or Car B with the exception of the driver of Car A. So in that simple two car accident the bulk of the payments come out of mandatory coverage.
When you hear that the court gave a large settlement to someone, that comes from mandatory.

Oh and the law ?

It comes from the Insurance Corporation Act

http://www.bclaws.ca/civix/document/id/ ... #section26

Section 26 (3) The corporation must, in relation to each payment it is directed to make under subsection (2), comply with that direction as follows:
(a) the payment must be paid out of the optional capital available;

Optional capital available is defined in Section 26(1)
"optional capital available" means the capital available in relation to the corporation's optional vehicle insurance business;

[my5cents]

If ICBC had to cater to their customers to survive, like private companies do, they would be out of business in a week.

Cater to their customers like they did when I was a young fellow ? Refuse to sell me insurance, just because of my age ?

Then we go back to the old "Assigned Risk" plan, insurance companies at whatever price are forced to sell to high risk drivers, and they defined that. At that time it was any male who was under 25. The risk was less if the young male was married.

Age discrimination, sex discrimination, marital status discrimination.

After a few years of having no claims my insurance company would sell me own damage coverage, because initially all they would sell me was basic liability.

I bought a new car, a 1969 Cortina. It was broken into, the insurance company had to pay for a no draft window and one 8 track tape. So after me paying the deductible, the insurance company was out ? 50 bucks ? Then I got a letter from them, your comprehensive coverage is cancelled.

Cater ?

Phone up a private insurance company and tell them you just bought your 19 year old son a Mustang for his birthday and you want to know how much additional liability, and own damage coverage will cost for him with them. How much ? Likely the answer ? Zero, they won't sell it to him.

ICBC still sells A LOT of optional coverage, why ? Maybe for some it's a better price than private.

[farq]

It's seems like this change and allowing high end users to purchase private insurance in BC might be the loophole everyone is waiting for. The BC gov't cannot only allow private insurance for rich people with expensive cars, that would be discriminatory based on income, and counter to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. If they allow private insurance to some, they have to allow it to everyone...

[my5cents]

It's seems like this change and allowing high end users to purchase private insurance in BC might be the loophole everyone is waiting for. The BC gov't cannot only allow private insurance for rich people with expensive cars, that would be discriminatory based on income, and counter to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. If they allow private insurance to some, they have to allow it to everyone...

What are you talking about ??????????????????

"allowing high end users to purchase private insurance"

ICBC isn't "allowing" the high end user to buy private, the high end user and you could always buy private insurance, just not the first $200,000. That will still be the case. Still the high end user MUST purchase minimum Public Liability Insurance from ICBC (the first $200,000)

Nothing has changed EXCEPT ICBC won't sell OPTIONAL coverage to cover an exotic vehicle worth over $150,000.

You, who doesn't own a high end vehicle can buy all the private insurance you want EXCEPT the first $200,000 liability insurance. You, unlike the owner of a $150,000 vehicle can buy your OPTIONAL coverage from ICBC or PRIVATE. The exotic vehicle owner can only but the OPTIONAL from private.

There's no loop hole, nothing has changed except ICBC won't sell option coverage to owners of vehicles that are worth over $150,000.

The basic insurance ($200,000 public liability coverage) that we all are required by law to buy is available and mandatory for every vehicle, cheap ones and exotic.

The one thing that seems very clear is that the average British Columbian (and apparently, average news reporter) has no clue how insurance works and as a result form opinions based on misconceptions.

I can see how you were mislead. Our "fantastic" media either have no clue or can't fit the full truth into their 30 second news piece about ICBC "not selling insurance to owners of vehicles over $150,000". They (ICBC) is talking about own damage, the optional portion of ICBC insurance. Not all the insurance on those high end vehicles. But I guess the actual story couldn't fit into 30 seconds.