Castanet

Poindexter wrote:

Queen K wrote:On this we can agree, the multi-generational welfare syndrome has got to be broken in the chain of access to education. Welfare leaves nothing in terms of disposable income towards an education fund. College fund? University fund? Trades School fund? I would almost guarantee no one on welfare can break the educational chain for their children very easily.

I'd like to hear from people who did it.

A good long term study called the The Abecedarian Project found that early childhood education was key in breaking the "cycle of poverty" you're describing.

http://abc.fpg.unc.edu/

Totally, of course it is. And people on welfare have got to have their kids motivated to get off of welfare, they have to set their children up to WANT to get off of it, but through education how else?

Technology is set to replace a large number of jobs. Just because some new jobs will be created, doesn’t mean that there will be the same amount of jobs.

Look at horses. How many are in use today vs 100 years ago? It’s not because horses all got lazy and stopped walking. They just aren’t needed in the same numbers as vehicles, farming equipment etc has mostly replaced them.

Anyone who thinks we are immune to replacement by machines is fooling themselves. Everything from long haul trucking, to accounting to diagnosing and treating illness, to surgery, to music production to customer service is at risk of being replaced with automation.

You are not the unique snowflake you think you are, and chances are you could be easily replaced by a machine that can actually do your job better than you.

In the way we’ve seen smart phones proliferate across the globe and change computing and communications over the last decade, we will be seeing a similar mass paradigm shift over the next decade in regards to automation.

The Green Barbarian wrote:Expected by whom? Really stupid people?

LiamHaddock wrote:http://www.businessinsider.com/elon-musk-universal-basic-income-2017-2
A link/article with some quotes from Elon musk on the issue. Worth a read imo.

The economic forecasts for the next several decades don't bode well for the American worker. In March, President Barack Obama warned Congress about the looming threat of job loss, based on several reports that found that as much as 50% of jobs could be replaced by robots by 2030.

Several links in that same article above. I have seen many articles expecting 30% or more global job loses. I hope I m wrong but things aren't looking good.

Omnitheo wrote:Technology is set to replace a large number of jobs. Just because some new jobs will be created, doesn’t mean that there will be the same amount of jobs.

Look at horses. How many are in use today vs 100 years ago? It’s not because horses all got lazy and stopped walking. They just aren’t needed in the same numbers as vehicles, farming equipment etc has mostly replaced them.

Anyone who thinks we are immune to replacement by machines is fooling themselves. Everything from long haul trucking, to accounting to diagnosing and treating illness, to surgery, to music production to customer service is at risk of being replaced with automation.

You are not the unique snowflake you think you are, and chances are you could be easily replaced by a machine that can actually do your job better than you.

In the way we’ve seen smart phones proliferate across the globe and change computing and communications over the last decade, we will be seeing a similar mass paradigm shift over the next decade in regards to automation.

People aren't horses. New jobs that you haven't thought about will crop up just as they did in the past. Automation does not mean fewer jobs. It never has and never will. It means some jobs will go away, but other jobs will take its place. At one time a large segment of the population worked as farmers. Today, it's 2%.

So we have more automation than ever before and yet more people than ever before working (women joining the workforce has increased the number of people working by a significant margin). There's no reason other than fearmongering and conservative "oh no, change is bad" thinking to come to the conclusion vast numbers of people will be out of work.

Glacier wrote:New jobs that you haven't thought about will crop up

^^ lol!
Not sure if Glacier's use of the word "crop" was intentional but either way it fits.

Poindexter wrote:^^ lol!
Not sure if Glacier's use of the word "crop" was intentional but either way it fits.

He's not far off from the truth; be careful before you mock.

Plenty of jobs have been created from technology advancements. Before the age of automation there were no jobs in TVs, cell phones, computers, 3D printers, 3D scanners, renewable energy solutions, etc. As advancements are made, our standard of living will go up and this change in standard of living will demand more jobs. Look at a modern home to a home that is 100 years old. Notice the addition of so many new tools; microwaves, furnaces! The future will see more people with more advanced equipment in their homes, think smart technology, robot vacuums, google home and new things which aren't invented yet.

Sparki55 wrote:

Poindexter wrote:^^ lol!
Not sure if Glacier's use of the word "crop" was intentional but either way it fits.

He's not far off from the truth; be careful before you mock.

Plenty of jobs have been created from technology advancements. Before the age of automation there were no jobs in TVs, cell phones, computers, 3D printers, 3D scanners, renewable energy solutions, etc. As advancements are made, our standard of living will go up and this change in standard of living will demand more jobs. Look at a modern home to a home that is 100 years old. Notice the addition of so many new tools; microwaves, furnaces! The future will see more people with more advanced equipment in their homes, think smart technology, robot vacuums, google home and new things which aren't invented yet.

And think robots who repair all of these, who build the house, who are better and smarter a their jobs than the majority of people who do repetitive tasks. Hell, they may even be smarter than people overall.
Here is an easy introduction to the problem/opportunity which despite it's cute animation is actually more serious than most:

An older but still relevant video:

We will be replaced by machines in pretty much every job we do and we will not be able to invent worthwhile jobs, which only humans can do, fast enough to not only replace the jobs lost but also add new jobs to meet the growing population. People keep denying it, but I have yet to find anyone who has any real understanding of the situation as an expert who thinks this will not come to pass in some fashion. The only thing experts seem to disagree on is the time scale.

That first video eplains it well...

...and just to explain my post, if you take "crops" literally it does point to a "growing" industry, that is until misguided government officials like our's in West Kelowna shut them down.

Verum you beat me to posting those.

New jobs do pop up, but not in the quantity to replace jobs taken by automation. All those fast food workers are not going to instead become software programmers. Taxi drivers web designers. Fruit pickers electronic technicians.

Many of the emerging jobs require considerably more education than the jobs that are being replaced by automation. Generally new industries are far more efficient than the old industries they replace, requiring fewer employees as well. Look at new Amazon jobs created vs the number of sears and other retailer jobs lost.

Verum nailed it. It's just a matter of time, not if. It's a different ball game when tech has allowed machines to do everything a human can do, only better, and also autonomously. This is a paradigm shift in the making. Every argument against it is nothing more than Russell's Teapot and cherry picked historical trends which don't hold up or tell the whole story.

Sparki55 wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/aug/17/technology-created-more-jobs-than-destroyed-140-years-data-census

580% increase in teaching and educational support assistants
183% increase in welfare, housing, youth and community workers
168% increase in care workers and home carers

The very jobs that many posters here refer to as being wasteful government funded drains on society.

Indeed as technology has replaced most manual labor, people have gone onto different careers. Society has shifted from being feudal and agrarian to capitalistic. However as those capitalist jobs are replaced by robots, it seems the new growing job sector is in “socialist” careers.

why is it that leftist posters are always so negative about the future? Is it that they are just such giant wimps who always discount the abilities of those smarter and less lazy than they are? It just seems to be such a distinctive line - "we're all going to die and be homeless because of technology!!!" - say the lazy backward Leftists. "We're all going to be fine" say the people who depend on their own wits and intelligence.

In the end, we were always fine, and this has been going on for centuries.

Huh, here i guess i just wasted most of my life working and looking after me and my lot. Could have had the guberment look after me.