B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby rustled » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:00 pm

Osoyoos_Familyof4 wrote:Also, parents can choose to opt it if any of the health classes if they feel information isn't appropriate for their children

I remember how "included" the kids in my primary school whose parents had them opt out of singing the anthem and God Save the Queen felt.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Osoyoos_Familyof4 » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:04 pm

I am more than "married to a teacher", I also have an MA in education and although I am not working for a school district, I still have plenty of other things I do as a sub-contractor from time to time, but I am for most basic discussion working part time very sporactically as I have other things going on.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Osoyoos_Familyof4 » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:07 pm

Well, I have spent a lot of time in schools, and I have never seen it a big deal when kids are excluded because parents want them to be or even for other reasons. Kids get individualized instruction all the time outside of a big classroom for a whole host of ideas, not just because there is a moral objection.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby rustled » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:15 pm

It's rather interesting to think anyone can believe that a trustee's objection to SOGI 123 could have adverse affects on the students' feelings of inclusion and acceptance, while various parents' requests to exclude their children from lessons incorporating SOGI 123 could not.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Snman » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:18 pm

If we assume that there are several trustees on the board as opposed to only one so that a broad range of ideas and opinions can be assembled to make decisions that benefit all students then I find it disturbing that this individual is being asked to step down simply for disagreeing with the rest of them. Neufeld has every right to take the position he has, imho.

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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby rustled » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:19 pm

Osoyoos_Familyof4 wrote:I am more than "married to a teacher", I also have an MA in education and although I am not working for a school district, I still have plenty of other things I do as a sub-contractor from time to time, but I am for most basic discussion working part time very sporactically as I have other things going on.

Perhaps, then, you can explain what qualifies you to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Verum » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:22 pm

rustled wrote:No, they don't design or vet the curriculum, but they sure as heck have the right to voice their opinion of it. I'd suggest anyone who isn't at all concerned with the potential effects of controversial curriculum on the students' well-being would have a tough time insisting they represent the best interests of those who elect them: the public.

They certainly do have the right to voice their opinion as we all do, but if in so doing, they express opinions and push for changes which are likely to prevent the smooth operation of a school, or broadly and significantly go against the wishes of the parents, they are actually being detrimental and should step aside from the position of school trustee.

What reasonable claim that the students' well-being was going to be significantly harmed did he provide, leaving his religion and personal morality aside completely, since they have no place in public schools?
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Verum » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:23 pm

rustled wrote:
Osoyoos_Familyof4 wrote:I am more than "married to a teacher", I also have an MA in education and although I am not working for a school district, I still have plenty of other things I do as a sub-contractor from time to time, but I am for most basic discussion working part time very sporactically as I have other things going on.

Perhaps, then, you can explain what qualifies you to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

You do know what an MA in education is? Right? This is education we are talking about.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Osoyoos_Familyof4 » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:23 pm

Honestly, my input here wasn't about the specifics of the trustee issue, I didn't even read the link, because I am not interested in that particular issue. But I wanted to have input about what people assumed the curriculum was, and how it's framed. The issue of the trustee I don't have an opinion of yet. I just wanted to clear a misconception around the absurd idea that children are asked to assign themselves a special lane in life that is not subject to change. Some people assume that there is far more politicization than there is. Of course it's not without bias, but I have always tried to keep discussions respectful no matter what they are and who is involved (in the classroom anyway) ;)
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Verum » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:26 pm

rustled wrote:It's rather interesting to think anyone can believe that a trustee's objection to SOGI 123 could have adverse affects on the students' feelings of inclusion and acceptance, while various parents' requests to exclude their children from lessons incorporating SOGI 123 could not.

Parents are entitled to make decisions, even those widely seen as detrimental ones, on behalf of their children.
A trustee's objections would affect a much larger number of students and ones for whom he is not entrusted to make life decisions, unlike parents.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby rustled » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:43 pm

Verum wrote:
rustled wrote:Perhaps, then, you can explain what qualifies you to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

You do know what an MA in education is? Right? This is education we are talking about.

Yep, sure do. Are you suggesting anyone with an MA is properly qualified to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Verum » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:49 pm

rustled wrote:Yep, sure do. Are you suggesting anyone with an MA is properly qualified to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

No any old MA wouldn't qualify you, but an MA in education, and yes they are at least somewhat qualified to do so.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Osoyoos_Familyof4 » Jan 21st, 2018, 2:57 pm

I don't instruct these classes so I don't know who does or why they do specifically. That rationale about who is qualified to teach what has to do with a lot of particulars. The "degree" whether grad/post grad is the ticket to the show and the particulars of "special interest" subjects are sometimes taught by classroom teachers who have done some study in that field, or have special interest in a topic. Other specialized instructors may be deemed qualified by their particular area of study or practice.
It is up to a principal and the board offices who they bring in and why.

In larger districts there might be a travelling instructor who does a kind of seminar on sexual health, that particular worker might be a medical professional, it might be a social worker, it might be a specialized classroom teacher who has some kind of study in the field. In smaller districts it may be just the regular classroom teacher.
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby Hurtlander » Jan 21st, 2018, 3:23 pm

fluffy wrote:
Who does that exactly, and what is the strength of research behind the benefits of a program such as the one under scrutiny here? Going back to my post on the College of Pediatricians it sounds like Mr. Neufeld has a solid case against the program. Do the property’s have anything in their arsenal besides character asassination?

The College of Pedestrians that Barry Neufeld is referring to is an ultra conservative right wing branch of pedestrians that was formed in 2002 because of political and religious biases...
http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2017/10/24 ... _23254253/
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Re: B.C. school trustee vows to stay

Postby rustled » Jan 21st, 2018, 3:24 pm

Verum wrote:
rustled wrote:Yep, sure do. Are you suggesting anyone with an MA is properly qualified to raise and explore the issue of gender identity with 7 year olds?

No any old MA wouldn't qualify you, but an MA in education, and yes they are at least somewhat qualified to do so.

?
Somewhat qualified?

You're suggesting on the one hand that a trustee voicing his concerns about whether or not it is appropriate to implement curriculum that requires classroom teachers to raise and explore gender identity with 7-year-olds should step down because his opinion could lead to harm for some students.

Meanwhile, you acknowledge that even the teachers with an MA are only at least somewhat qualified to raise and explore gender identity with those same 7-year-olds. In other words, they are not fully qualified.

My, goodness. This is quite the brave new world, isn't it?

Edited: added underlined portion to ensure there's no misrepresentation.
Last edited by rustled on Jan 21st, 2018, 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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