Payroll tax is not the answer

Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby Redmonte » Mar 8th, 2018, 12:11 pm

One of the promises on which the BC NDP party campaigned was to finish what the Liberals started by getting rid of the remaining 50%of MSP premiums being paid by honest British Columbians. True to their word, they've announced the go-forward of this plan for 2019. But, and this is a huge but, introducing a payroll tax to be shouldered by business is definitely not the answer. Small and large business alike should not be asked to carry the burden of replacing a lost (and substantial) Government revenue stream. Individuals should be responsible for their personal health care and as such, they should contribute. I was under the impression that the revenue shortfall created by getting rid of MSP premiums would be made up by a minor increase in the BC Personal Income Tax. That way, everyone, including low, medium and high income earners completing a tax return would pay a small but proportionate amount into the coffers. The NDP - as usual - has stuck it to business, the only sector which can grow the economy with more jobs. Not only does business have to come up with the money for this ill-planned program, but they are also effectively paying to keep all the "former" MSP administrators employed, now as Payroll tax administrators. And what of the payroll tax due for provincial government employees? Who pays that? :-X
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby kgcayenne » Mar 8th, 2018, 1:17 pm

<$500,000 payroll
= 0 tax

>$500,000 <$1,500,000 payroll
= Not yet determined, but less than the next tier

>$1,500,000 in payroll
= 1.95% of gross payroll

Small business are not being asked to carry the burdens, big business is.
I think things that should be taxed are things that cause health problems when abused: tobacco products, alcohol, processed foods, fast foods. <---tax the bejeeebus out of that stuff.
Businesses that are sedentary should either implement fitness programs or be taxed to compensate for the detriments to their employees' health. Yeah, I said it. Desk jobs. Tax the hell out of desk job companies who keep employees butts planted at their desk 8hrs a day and aren't encouraging them to be active and prevent diabetes and heart disease.

Hold on a second... our bureaucrats are desk sitters.... yes, they desk-sit for us, we're their employer, essentially --- BY WAY OF TAXES. Time to pay up?

That went in a really weird direction... not well thought-out at all... rambling, more or less. But hey, it's discussion.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby CapitalB » Mar 8th, 2018, 1:26 pm

The NDP generally platforms on targeting the wealthy rather than charging things back to the general population. Seems about what would be expected in that regard.
So much of the violent push-back on everything progressive and reformist comes down to: I can see the future, and in this future I am not the centre of the universe and master of all that I survey, therefore this future must be resisted at all costs.

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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby The Green Barbarian » Mar 8th, 2018, 1:31 pm

CapitalB wrote:The NDP generally platforms on targeting the wealthy rather than charging things back to the general population. Seems about what would be expected in that regard.


yes - when it comes to stupid ways to destroy wealth, the NDP has that market cornered.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby alfred2 » Mar 8th, 2018, 2:29 pm

CapitalB wrote:The NDP generally platforms on targeting the wealthy rather than charging things back to the general population. Seems about what would be expected in that regard.

It just seems that way; Manitoba did that years ago[ndp] and small store got rid of staff, or did not give raises, b
dumb way to do that. Indirectley we all pay, it is just a smoke screen that a lot of you have fallen into. :smt045 :200:
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby flamingfingers » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:00 pm

If the BC Liberals had introduced this, there would not have been a whinge or whine.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby Urban Cowboy » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:09 pm

flamingfingers wrote:If the BC Liberals had introduced this, there would not have been a whinge or whine.


I agree, and that because had the Liberals done it, they would have weighed all the pros and cons in advance, and also not dropped it like a bombshell without warning, during the very time period that business already has to prepare for increased costs.

The Liberals don't throw things at the wall, and see what sticks, that's the difference, but I don't expect you to grasp that.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby flamingfingers » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:18 pm

flamingfingers wrote:If the BC Liberals had introduced this, there would not have been a whinge or whine.


Old Techie wrote:I agree, and that because had the Liberals done it, they would have weighed all the pros and cons in advance, and also not dropped it like a bombshell without warning, during the very time period that business already has to prepare for increased costs.

The Liberals don't throw things at the wall, and see what sticks, that's the difference, but I don't expect you to grasp that.


ICBC $1.3 BILLION
BC Hydro - $70+ BILLION what a mess!
MSP - DOUBLED
SCoC Judgement in favor of BCTF
MONEY LAUNDERING in BC Casinos

Seems to me they threw all kinds of things 'at the wall, and see what sticks'. It all slithered down the wall like a big clot of snot and the only thing is stuck to was US, the BC taxpayers.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby The Green Barbarian » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:19 pm

flamingfingers wrote:If the BC Liberals had introduced this, there would not have been a whinge or whine.


I doubt that. I still am angry about the carbon tax. We really need a third option to vote for in this province.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby The Green Barbarian » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:20 pm

*removed*
Last edited by ferri on Mar 8th, 2018, 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Off Topic
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby flamingfingers » Mar 8th, 2018, 5:30 pm

James stated in QP today, several times in fact, that there would be dialogue carried out through the balance of this spring and summer to let all employer groups provide information re: the EHT and the final legislation and Budget update this fall would reflect this information.

I can't feel to sorry for the companies/corporations paying EHT - they have had that expense reduced by 50% as of this past January 1 and it still works as a write off of expenses for them. And as I stated a long, long time ago, an employees' wage package took the MSP premiums into consideration.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby ninetyninepct » Mar 8th, 2018, 8:45 pm

Tax the hell out of desk job companies who keep employees butts planted at their desk 8hrs a day and aren't encouraging them to be active and prevent diabetes and heart disease.

Hold on a second... our bureaucrats are desk sitters.... yes, they desk-sit for us, we're their employer, essentially --- BY WAY OF TAXES. Time to pay up?

That went in a really weird direction... not well thought-out at all... rambling, more or less. But hey, it's discussion.[/quote]
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Agreed - commonly referred to as Government "workers".

How about saving a few hundred million by cutting down on overdose responses. How about distracted driving tickets starting at $1000 for first offense? Let's start making the offenders pay.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby Gone_Fishin » Mar 8th, 2018, 9:34 pm

Wait a second!
This new tax also captures the public sector including Municipal workforces. As mentioned on Global News tonight, the screenshot shows a sampling of the costs this tax will create for some cities. Who pays for the added cost to municipalities? Well, our property taxes do. We ALL do.

Everyone in this province in some way shape or form experiences increased costs when property taxes go up. Whether you're a homeowner, landlord, renter, a small business that pays a triple net lease, that small businesses client who has that cost passed down to them, ALL of you, ALL of us, will be paying higher taxes because of this payroll tax.

Had the BC Liberal Party formed Government after their 2017 election win they would have cut the MSP all together, WITHOUT replacing it with anything. The idea was that the economy was growing, which would've replaced the revenue that would've been lost from cutting the MSP. That's how free enterprise governments operate, grow the economy, cut taxes, grow the economy, cut taxes.

How's that NDP "affordability" treating you?

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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby Redmonte » Mar 10th, 2018, 1:02 pm

flamingfingers wrote:James stated in QP today, several times in fact, that there would be dialogue carried out through the balance of this spring and summer to let all employer groups provide information re: the EHT and the final legislation and Budget update this fall would reflect this information.

I can't feel to sorry for the companies/corporations paying EHT - they have had that expense reduced by 50% as of this past January 1 and it still works as a write off of expenses for them. And as I stated a long, long time ago, an employees' wage package took the MSP premiums into consideration.


There aren’t many employers these days that pay their staff MSP premiums - it's a huge perq and so costly that many employers are simply dropping that benefit from their benefit packages. For those small businesses who offered that perq, no longer paying it will be a relief. Perhaps small raises with the new found money would be appreciated.

But big businesses should not be funding health care for the rest of the population who paid their own MSP (and in too many cases, those who never paid MSP premiums while abusing the system). This payroll tax is ridiculous.

Personal health care is an individual responsibility and as such the costs for health care should be borne by each British Columbian. And with this payroll tax hitting municipalities, districts and provincial coffers, my point is further supported. Handing down heavier property taxes and income taxes in a non-transparent way is worse. We'll never know how much of those extra taxes actually funds health care. A personal tax increase rate based on net income(separate line item calculation) is the only fair and transparent method to fund health care.
And while this will not be popular, I believe that heavy users of health care should have to incur higher expenses before receiving medical expense credit on their personal tax return (or increase the percentage of net income used to calculate eligible medical receipts). Perhaps people would take better care of themselves knowing rebates/credits would be harder to get.
Last edited by Redmonte on Mar 10th, 2018, 1:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Payroll tax is not the answer

Postby Hurtlander » Mar 10th, 2018, 1:13 pm

Redmonte wrote:And while this will not be popular, I believe that heavy users of health care should have to incur higher expenses before receiving medical expense credit on their personal tax return (or increase the percentage of net income used to calculate eligible medical receipts). Perhaps people would take better care of themselves knowing rebates/credits would be harder to get.

Good idea, let’s punish those with chronic heart disease of cancer or MS or rheumatoid arthritis etc, since none of those diseases they had little or no control over.....
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