Harper to meet with Chief Spence/First Nations leaders

[grammafreddy]

@zontar

Low income non-native people do get perks - they get free meal programs and free school supplies at school, they get child care subsidies, sports and arts program subsidies, GST and (in BC) Carbon Tax credits, low income housing subsidies, welfare recipients and some low income non-natives get free/reduced cost medical and free dental and free/reduced cost prescriptions and I am sure there's other benefits, too. Welfare will also pay for work clothes and boots if they get a job that requires them and they don't have them already.

Would you consider "free housing and no taxes to be like winning the lottery" if you had to live on an Indian Reservation in their homes provided in order to get it and abide by the rules and restraints set out by the federal government? The homes belong to the feds and perhaps you may not be allowed to make changes and repairs to it but have to live with what they will pay for (or not pay for). If it is an uninsulated house and the temps go sub-zero but you have to pay the heating bill, is that a bonus? If your water source is not clean or your plumbing backed up, is that acceptable in return for a free house and no taxes?

[the truth]

dig a little deeper gramma,and see what the chief ownes off native land

[the truth]

@zontar

Low income non-native people do get perks - they get free meal programs and free school supplies at school, they get child care subsidies, sports and arts program subsidies, GST and (in BC) Carbon Tax credits, low income housing subsidies, welfare recipients and some low income non-natives get free/reduced cost medical and free dental and free/reduced cost prescriptions and I am sure there's other benefits, too. Welfare will also pay for work clothes and boots if they get a job that requires them and they don't have them already.

Would you consider "free housing and no taxes to be like winning the lottery" if you had to live on an Indian Reservation in their homes provided in order to get it and abide by the rules and restraints set out by the federal government? The homes belong to the feds and perhaps you may not be allowed to make changes and repairs to it but have to live with what they will pay for (or not pay for). If it is an uninsulated house and the temps go sub-zero but you have to pay the heating bill, is that a bonus? If your water source is not clean or your plumbing backed up, is that acceptable in return for a free house and no taxes?

or they can go to school get a job and move out, like we all do when we grow up

[grammafreddy]

Between her and her boyfriend they pull in close to $400,000/yr and they don't have to pay for housing or taxes. Anyone with that kind of cash can have someone come in and build them a house. Not the best sympathy story I'd say.

Can they? Have you got a link that says any native in Canada can build their own home on the federal government's land? Some bands who have self-government agreements can have "allotments" and can perhaps build on the federal land (which is probably what Chief Louie did - link provided earlier) but not every band has that. The government has very strict rules about what can and can't happen on their land.

Earlier in this thread, I gave you the link to the northern doctor's assessment of their homes and the difference between the house that the feds built for him and the homes the feds build for the natives to live in.

[grammafreddy]

dig a little deeper gramma,and see what the chief ownes off native land

How about you do that, okay?

[grammafreddy]

or they can go to school get a job and move out, like we all do when we grow up

That's so easy to say, isn't it?

[the truth]

but your so good at it, afraid of what you might find, why is it so hard for you to admit that spence is full of it and should
step down as chief and should just happy to not go to jail at this time for fraud

[zzontar]

Can they? Have you got a link that says any native in Canada can build their own home on the federal government's land? Some bands who have self-government agreements can have "allotments" and can perhaps build on the federal land (which is probably what Chief Louie did - link provided earlier) but not every band has that. The government has very strict rules about what can and can't happen on their land.

The natives also have their own government. If they have a rule that they have to live in a shack when they're bank account is overflowing then that's their problem, but I doubt that exists. Worse case scenario would be the Chief and her boyfriend have to live in their free house for a while before buying a nice one in the tropics somewhere and living off-reserve.

[grammafreddy]

but your so good at it, afraid of what you might find, why is it so hard for you to admit that spence is full of it and should
step down as chief and should just happy to not go to jail at this time for fraud

Lazy, aren't ya?

I have posted quite a few things that were not in Chief Spence's favour, so quit blowing smoke on that one.

[grammafreddy]

Can they? Have you got a link that says any native in Canada can build their own home on the federal government's land? Some bands who have self-government agreements can have "allotments" and can perhaps build on the federal land (which is probably what Chief Louie did - link provided earlier) but not every band has that. The government has very strict rules about what can and can't happen on their land.

The natives also have their own government. If they have a rule that they have to live in a shack when they're bank account is overflowing then that's their problem, but I doubt that exists. Worse case scenario would be the Chief and her boyfriend have to live in their free house for a while before buying a nice one in the tropics somewhere and living off-reserve.

How do you know their bank accounts are overflowing? Link?

Are you speculating that they would go live in the tropics because that's what you would do?

[grammafreddy]

http://www.kelowna.com/2009/11/30/some- ... t-nations/

[zzontar]

Gramma honestly, they make about $400,000/yr between them and don't have to pay for housing, vehicles, or taxes. Are you still trying to make that a hardship story? Also, you've been going on about how they have to pay taxes on goods bought off-reserve, but with a little investigating, that's not always true.

http://www.cba.org/bc/public_media/rights/237.aspx

As well, section 87 exempts from tax the goods and services bought by status Indians at businesses located on Indian reserves. The exemption also includes goods bought elsewhere and delivered to the reserve.

[LoneWolf_53]

The problem I have with Levant is that he is a sensationalist. He seldom tells anything from all sides and only talks about (with a smirk and a fair amount of exaggeration) what he can derive ratings from. I don't use him if I want a complete picture of anything. He raises good points sometimes but often his points have a counterpoint that he doesn't mention.

I understand that and actually agree with you. The thing is I see his lips move and don't care as much what he's saying as I do about the supporting documentation he has, and that can't be refuted.

I also looked at other sources and compared, for example when I went to the APTN network site there's a clip where the guys are criticizing Ezra's take on some of the numbers but the reality of it is so what.

For example Ezra said the financials show 18 councilors on the payroll, the APTN guy says well yes but that's not quite right because some were only there for short periods, so the data is incorrect and it should be 12 full time councilors. What I say to that is who the heck cares if it's 18 or 12, the town has only 300 homes so how many councilors do they need? How many do we have in Kelowna with a population of around 120,000?

In other words the APTN is resorting to pure semantics to refute Ezra's statements in matters where it really counts, and demonstrates that there is indeed a huge amount of financial mismanagement occurring there.

Check out this one...... http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/video/2083927748001 If there's nothing to hide why has Spence taken it upon herself to order her police to remove Global reporters form Attawapiskat? If there's nothing to hide why chase away reporters from one of Canada's largest news sources?

I hear you GF but Ezra is providing enough info to where if we discount even half of what he says there's still major cause for concern and plenty of red flags flying.

Spence is mayor and her boyfriend co-manager, and that isn't seen as a blatant conflict of interest?

APTN also said the Tech Advisor only works three weeks out of the month not four so that data is skewed. Again so what? there's only three hundred homes there, what on earth does this guy do to be making what he does and regardless of what days, weeks, or hours he works the documents show how much he cost the band.

This Spence is a real piece of work GF and as I've said before this whole hunger strike farce is nothing more than a ploy to shift focus away from her own misdeeds.

I have looked for quite some time and haven't run across the other clip that touched on the mine and how much money it spends on contracts, and how many natives it employs, but there was a mine source giving the figures and that's what I'd been referring to.

If I stumble across it again I'll post it............... I found it it was in the other forum thread, the info I was talking about regarding monies from the mine begins around the 6min mark http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... JWTotEc_XA

[grammafreddy]

Gramma honestly, they make about $400,000/yr between them and don't have to pay for housing, vehicles, or taxes. Are you still trying to make that a hardship story? Also, you've been going on about how they have to pay taxes on goods bought off-reserve, but with a little investigating, that's not always true.

http://www.cba.org/bc/public_media/rights/237.aspx
As well, section 87 exempts from tax the goods and services bought by status Indians at businesses located on Indian reserves. The exemption also includes goods bought elsewhere and delivered to the reserve.

You really need to pay better attention. At no time did I ever say she was completely honest. However, I didn't say she was a crook, either. I said there may be corruption there - as there is on a lot of the native reservations.

Your link and quote does not say anything about goods bought off reserve and brought back with them to the reserve - it says "delivered to the reserve" ... so that's like bought online or special ordered to the store or ...

[zzontar]

You asked for a link saying their bank accounts were overflowing. No link required, just the ability to add 2+2. As far as things bought off-reserve, many places (e.g. furniture stores) have free delivery and it's possible to have almost anything delivered, so on bigger ticket items it would be worth the delivery charge if there was one.