Harper to meet with Chief Spence/First Nations leaders

[grammafreddy]

Hi Gramma, I don't have the time or desire to read endless links and reports made by unhappy people and many by the ones responsible for the problems, It's just that when you said the Feds constructed the the homes, I had a vision of the PM and his cronies with shovels and hammers building houses on the Rez. I think that would make anyone chuckle a bit.

Probably a great photo op, eh?

[Roadster]

Yes GF, I read the link, I even commented on it if you remember that. You have brought it up several times now. Its not the answer to every comment here tho, its only what he saw on one reserve and not all are in the exact same trouble for the exact same reasons.

[Ken7]

SOMEBODY FINALLY HAS SOME BRAINS AND IS NOT AFRAID TO CALL IT AS IT IS........

Canada's First Nations Debate - Globe & Mail.

Now this could stir up a bit of a debate...but it is food for thoughts regarding comments from a reader in the Globe and Mail. It's a short history lesson on natives.

This land does NOT belong to them. Why do some people keep saying that it does?

Is it because that's what they want you to believe? Well then the marketing campaign must be working.
Let's get this straight...


1. These people's ancestors did not just appear in North America magically out of thin air one day 50,000 years ago. They came in waves across the land/ice bridge from Asia . What's more these waves in many case were not related groups of people. They came from various places around North Eastern Asia and were from different genetic strains....in other words the "natives of North America are not a homogenous group of people and more importantly.... They are immigrants too, like millions of immigrants today.


2. The idea that the "natives" were peaceful caretakers of the land or benevolent tenants couldn't be further from the truth. The various tribes warred on each other constantly. They were violent. Want proof? Ask the Huron's...oh that's right you can't. The Iroquois wiped them out. How about slavery that was rife among the first nation tribes until the Europeans came over and freed the slaves and put an end to this "valued cultural tradition"? Is slavery peaceful and humane?


3. The idea that we "stole" this land from them is also ridiculous. A more technologically advanced and numerous cultures invaded and conquered. This is exactly what has been happening since the dawn of humanity all around the globe. To say we "stole" their lands is just plain wrong. That is akin to saying the Saxons should return England to the Angles. Or maybe we should launch a campaign to have Roman descendants give Italy back to the Etruscans.


It is a nonsensical notion driven by the politically correct bleeding hearts on the left and some intellectually deficient liberals, and it will continue to cost this country needless and wasted billions and billions until we get some backbone and turn off the taps.

Are these people in trouble?
Yes.

Do they need help?
Yes.

Are they responsible enough to look after themselves and efficiently spend the billions the tax payers give them?
Certainly not.

Not if you understand what is going on in almost all of the reservations across Canada with the Chiefs (along with family and friends) keeping almost all the money given to the reserve by us tax payers.

The only way to fix this situation is to bring them into society as equals. They should be getting jobs and paying taxes like the rest of us because in reality, they are no more special than any of the other hundred or more cultures that call Canada home.

Turn off the taps.

Do away with this "traditional use" and "cultural" nonsense.

Educate their children to become modern citizens, instead of finding their identity and source of pride in some folks who occupied the land 15000 years ago.

Let them stand proud and free as citizens of Canada or fall on their own account.
Will there be problems with the transformation.

Of course that’s the way it is with turning off free money to anyone, but the time is long overdue to correct this and let ALL of us (natives included) get on with OUR lives.

[LoneWolf_53]

Makes perfect sense to me, and is also what many of us have been getting at for quite some time.

Natives were here, someone bigger and stronger came along and took what they viewed as theirs, just as they themselves did when they covetted an enemy tribes livestock and/or women.

Our ancestors really weren't any better or worse than theirs, so get over it already.

[Snman]

I agree with ken7 and lonewolf53 as do many on this thread and I would suggest that the majority of non natives in this country would also agree. So why then does the government not listen? Do we need to protest and set up blockades of our own?

[waterwings]

I just read the gov.gc.ca site where loans, monies, economic education including home repairs and any other schooling that a band or reserve will need to produce, build, collect rents on is available to any aborginal or native reserve through CMHC and other programs for Indians but the hitch is they have to apply and they have to meet objectives and be accountable including keeping books that will meet forensic or audited bookeeping.

GF don't for one new york minute post one single more line about links unless you produce both sides for everyone to read.

[kibbs]

Over the past few weeks the Idle No More movement has burst onto the scene with a wave of peaceful protests and calls for a new approach to relations between indigenous peoples and the Canadian government.
The Idle No More movement was triggered by Bill C-45, passed two week ago, which threatens first nations' treaty rights and removes many of the protections on Canada’s precious rivers and lakes.
(For those unfamiliar with the Idle No More movement, check out this, this and this article).
This movement, which has received support from all three pan-Canadian opposition parties and a wide range of civil society organizations, has grown from a small campaign to thousands of people across Canada declaring that the Harper government must reform relations with the indigenous peoples of Canada and stop taking away important environmental protection measures.
A key part of the Idle No More protests is Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence’s hunger strike, which has just entered day 17. Chief Spence is asking for a meeting with Prime Minister Harper to discuss the plight of her people, and up until now he has refused to meet with her.
Chief Theresa Spence says she is willing to die for her people in order to get the Harper government to discuss respect for indigenous treaties.
Greenpeace has expressed its support for the movement and its vision of a more just society grounded in environmental sustainability.
We need you to join us in telling our government to respect treaties and the environment. Please e-mail Prime Minister Stephen Harper ([email protected])

[CountryAtHeart]

j watson...
If we, the "white" people ever decided to use the same disruptive behavior the FN uses our butts would be in jail faster than you could blink.
If we sent in our yearly tax accounting the way this Native Chief has kept their books, we would be charged with a federal fraud crime and have the book thrown at us. Years in prison with fines we would still be paying off on our death bed.

The FN and our governments have re-written history with all of their peace, loving, living with nature etc; it is pathetic. That the white men brought violence into their societies is such crap. They knew extreme violence before the whites ever set foot on this continent.

I am not a racist. I just think it is about time we strive for Canadian equality. For everyone.

[LoneWolf_53]

Over the past few weeks the Idle No More movement has burst onto the scene with a wave of peaceful protests and calls for a new approach to relations between indigenous peoples and the Canadian government.
The Idle No More movement was triggered by Bill C-45, passed two week ago, which threatens first nations' treaty rights and removes many of the protections on Canada’s precious rivers and lakes.
(For those unfamiliar with the Idle No More movement, check out this, this and this article).
This movement, which has received support from all three pan-Canadian opposition parties and a wide range of civil society organizations, has grown from a small campaign to thousands of people across Canada declaring that the Harper government must reform relations with the indigenous peoples of Canada and stop taking away important environmental protection measures.
A key part of the Idle No More protests is Attawapiskat Chief Theresa Spence’s hunger strike, which has just entered day 17. Chief Spence is asking for a meeting with Prime Minister Harper to discuss the plight of her people, and up until now he has refused to meet with her.
Chief Theresa Spence says she is willing to die for her people in order to get the Harper government to discuss respect for indigenous treaties.
Greenpeace has expressed its support for the movement and its vision of a more just society grounded in environmental sustainability.
We need you to join us in telling our government to respect treaties and the environment. Please e-mail Prime Minister Stephen Harper ([email protected])

I'm afraid at this point that just comes off as and outdated at that since day 17 of the phony hunger strike was more than two weeks ago.

kibbs do a little digging as to who's funding that idle no more nonsense.

[Roadster]

I agree with ken7 and lonewolf53 as do many on this thread and I would suggest that the majority of non natives in this country would also agree. So why then does the government not listen? Do we need to protest and set up blockades of our own?

And havent many of us said almost all of this what he wrote, right here already,,, its time to end the money flow and offer them a move toward civilization,,, a city or town where they can gain work of some kind and become a """paying it back""" part of society like the rest of us. I am truely sick of hearing sad stories of people who wont get up and do something when their chiefs are taking from them and finding out We should pay even more,,, I hope all this attention makes our government rethink the whole thing, let many of them threaten to starve themselves... It isnt my problem if you wont put food to your mouth, specially when our taxes paid for it. Totally sick and tired of it, as if I wasnt before this attempt. I think many Canadians are getting tired of this already and exposing any money theiving events by chiefs might just make this worse,,, I have a feeling this might not be a good thing for them as a group.
At times I am almost willing to see them all under one chief and let this go on but other times I think a cut off is needed. Maybe thats really what needs to happen cos you cant just keep sending cash to people who wont get anything good out of it and dont seem to want make something of it. It isnt like it hasnt gone on long enough. It should have been set up and a """pick me up and let me get on my feet thing"""
I have to be honest,,, if I was being sent money I might find it hard to get up and out the door, I might need a boot in the butt too.

[Snman]

Part of the problem is left wing nuts, like kibbs, who like to 'crusade' for the environment or whatever is the protest of the day. How 'bout I call up the PM (see kibbs link above) and tell him to shred those bogus treaties and also that he can tell the indians to put that in their peace pipe and smoke that in the healing circle.

[zzontar]

Funny... earlier today I find out this:

As well, section 87 exempts from tax the goods and services bought by status Indians at businesses located on Indian reserves. The exemption also includes goods bought elsewhere and delivered to the reserve.

... and today Spence is trying to defend her spending:

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/chief-spence-m ... 02825.html

For example, housing: we have to hire contractors, we have to order the materials from out of town and to shipment. We pay tax on that.

I found out they don't have to pay tax on that with a quick Google search and Chief Spence doesn't know that? Riiiiiiight.

[the truth]

removed - Jennylives

[ticat900]

Look Every white man and indian man knows cheif Spence is a idiot and a moron so nuff said

Heres a quote from Cheif louie of osoyoo,s ;
'The biggest challenge will be how you treat your own people.'
'Blaming government? That time is over.'

Spence would be a little wiser if she had followed Louies advice especially on the first quote

[grammafreddy]

I just read the gov.gc.ca site where loans, monies, economic education including home repairs and any other schooling that a band or reserve will need to produce, build, collect rents on is available to any aborginal or native reserve through CMHC and other programs for Indians but the hitch is they have to apply and they have to meet objectives and be accountable including keeping books that will meet forensic or audited bookeeping.

GF don't for one new york minute post one single more line about links unless you produce both sides for everyone to read.

LOL - I have posted links from both sides. Where's your link to what you posted?

Just because the government website states the above, doesn't mean the government gives them the money or that CMHC approves the loan. One of the complaints the bands have is that the process is so mired in red tape that things take far too long.