Train carrying oil exploded: Downtown on fire

[36Drew]

Castanet write-up on the matter: http://www.castanet.net/edition/news-story-95882-4-.htm#95882

Railway says it can't pay for cleanup
by The Canadian Press - Story: 95882
Jul 31, 2013 / 5:59 am

A railway involved in Quebec's fatal derailment doesn't have the cash to pay for the torrent of post-disaster expenses headed its way.

The chairman of Montreal, Maine & Atlantic Railway says the company is now depending on its insurers to start cutting cheques and he has raised doubts publicly on whether the company will even survive.

In the end, says one expert in civil responsibility, taxpayers could be stuck with a bill in the hundreds of millions of dollars.

Quebec law professor Daniel Gardner says he highly doubts MMA has enough coverage to absorb the massive, combined financial liabilities of damages like environmental cleanup, emergency-crew salaries and lawsuits.

In fact, he believes the Lac-Megantic derailment could have more financial consequences than any other land disaster in North American history.

"The whole cost of this will be far closer to $1 billion than to $500 million," said the Universite Laval academic, adding he would be surprised if the railway had a total of $500 million in coverage.

"What will probably happen? ...The company will go bankrupt, insurance coverage won't be enough."

Gardner expects governments will wind up covering the difference.

[matai]

mathiew are you aware that most of us on Castanet do not read or speak French?
It would help if you posted English articles/links.

The English link is in my post, check again lol :-)

[Bsuds]

Sorry I guess I missed that.

[hobbyguy]

All the more reason that the oil companies, who almost certainly provided the cars to MMA, should be sued.

LV, the oil companies "ought to have known" that the cars were prone to rupture or the fittings getting knocked off in the event of an accident. Their plan by "layering", i.e. mechanisms such as leasing the cars etc., is to obfuscate and abrogate their responsibility. Regardless of the accident that MMA had, they knew that if something untoward happened, those cars would not stand up. As I detailed before, the industry simply figured it was cheaper to pay for clean up and liability claims. Now they don't want to do that.

So give me a reason folks shouldn't block the rail transport of dilbit across BC. These guys are operating in a fashion that puts the public at risk. If I do that, e.g. drunk driving, or even lighting a camfire right now, I'll get stopped. But these guys, well, grease a few palms maybe?, and carry on as if nothing happened.

[twobits]

All the more reason that the oil companies, who almost certainly provided the cars to MMA, should be sued.

Sounds like a bit of speculation on your part. Can you provide any evidence of who owns the railcars? Regardless, ownership of the railcars is moot to me. What matters is that they met current government standards and no one was breaking any laws by using them. If you need to point some fingers beyond the liability of MMA, perhaps it should be the governments of both Canada and the US who have been talking about the standards of these DOT 111 cars for about two decades now.

If "ought to have known" is the threshold measure for culpability and liability, the entire world just might as well shut down. Tomorrow I am going to sue my bed manufacturer because they "ought to have known" that falling out of bed from the height of my pillow top mattress could cause personal injury.

[matai]

Today, the journalists were allowed inside the burnt zone. 40 pictures here:
http://www.journaldemontreal.com/2013/0 ... M.facebook

[grammafreddy]

What a mess. Those poor people. But look at all those wonderful old bricks! I'd love a bunch of them for my back yard.

[hobbyguy]

Well towbits, "ought to have known" is important to the whole issue of due diligence. Not being a lawyer, I can't give you the the exact details. But I was personally on the receiving end of the questions of "ought to have known" and "due diligenece" when an overzealous (in my opinion) WCB inspector went after me personally (as the manager responsible) over a serious workplace accident. The question revolved around whether or not I knew or "ought to have known" that a piece of handling equipment was not suitable for the application (where it failed - crippling an employee). In point of fact we were able to show that the limitation cited by the manufacturer was not known to me, and was unlikley to be known as the manufacturer did not include the information in their manuals or safety documentation, nor were there WCB bulletins regarding previous failures, nor industry publications meantioning the problem. Therefore WCB wnet after the manufacturer instead, and I had to testify, and the manufacturer was found liable.

All you have to do to see that rail companies don't generally own the tanks cars is look at the previous articles and this will help too: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tank_car Unfortunately, all the picture of the cars show them so badly burnt that the identiy marks are gone, so can't say definitively, but I'll betcha a "you the man" that MMA doesn't own them.

[hobbyguy]

twobits, I kept looking, and the unburned cars in a picture on huffington post clearly shows an "X" designation in its ID numbering - and so is not owned by the railroad. Look for the picture with Harper in it. 3 of 3 unburnt cars have the "X" designation - and it's a good bet the burnt ones used to have "X" markings. With the two in the string that was pulled away from the fire that have id's visible, that's 5 for 5. http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/07/19/mma-derailment-lac-megantic_n_3619022.html#slide=2668183 So my assumption looks fairly good.

As Burhardt has done the least honorable thing and put MMA into bankruptcy, you can bet the lawyers will be busy tracing back the ownership of those "X" cars.

I guess the province of Quebec is going to wind up owning a railway.

[Atomoa]

Railroad company filed for bankruptcy.

Safety get traded for profit to the point of this disaster (one man watching a entire train?) and now the taxpayer will clean up the mess.

[matai]

Yes, how surprising they went bankrupt:
http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Mon ... story.html

[twobits]

Yes, how surprising they went bankrupt:
http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Mon ... story.html

Gee hobbyguy, why do you suppose Canadian Pacific and Western Petroleum are also seeking damages from MMA. Could it be for the loss of rolling stock and the loss of crude oil?

[hobbyguy]

Not sure LV, but Western Petroleum seems to be in the refined product end (lubricants or fuels) and the cars they show on their website https://www.westernpetro.com/fuel_by_rail_program.

Specualtion: They, like Tafisa (particle board company) may have a significant disruption to their business caused by the closure of the track, and may be filing the claim to activate the "force majeure" clause in supply contracts.

Not sure why CP has filed a claim, that could be anything - but it could be, another speculation, a "transfer" move as CP possibly contracted MMA to complete the delivery of the crude from the Bakken to Irving. So CP may indeed be on the hook for the value of the cargo and possibly the rolling stock. It is a nice way for CP to transfer liability if that is the case. My guess is that they are "getting out in front" legally so that they can say "don't sue us, it's all on MMA.

All that will be interesting to follow, but it is sad that in the end, all this legal wrangling will make things even more difficult for the folks in Lac-Magantic. The insurer for MMA is refusing to cut any cheques, so that guarantees that the insult of long legal battles will be added to their tragedy.

I guess for the companies involved the term "business ethics" is an oxymoron.

[matai]

Today Pauline Marois said on tv she kicked MMA and their workers and their contractors out of the cleaning zone in Lac Megantic. Quebec hired a new business to do the cleaning and pumping, and said she will sponge the bill.

They also said because MMA caused a tragedy and is costing Quebec money, the province is now a guaranteed creditor, and Marois said the money they will get from MMA's bankruptcy will first be redistributed to the victims, before being used to pay the government bills.

[hobbyguy]

Somewhat to see what response I would get, I emailed the following question to our local MP:

"Please advise why the government has not placed a moratorium on the rail transport of crude in light of the obvious failures that resulted in the Lac Megantic tragedy"

The predictable response was nothing, but I got this:

"Thank you for your e-mail.



I have forwarded it to the Minister of Transport the Honourable Lisa Raitt for her consideration and comment. I have asked that she reply to you directly.



I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts and opinions with me. Please feel free to contact me at any time to discuss issues concerning the federal government.

Sincerely,"

Should I hold my breath for a response Lisa Raitt?