Ottawa decides not to decide

[Donald G]

*removed*

[Rwede]

The mess we are in, Alberta included, goes back to the Mulroney government, and has been exacerbated by the Harper government.

Oh ferchrissakes.

The mess we are in today is the immediate responsibility of Justin Trudeau. He's busy taking selfies with DiCaprio while people are losing their jobs at a scarily rapid rate.

Justin Trudeau is too stupid, too self-absorbed, and too inexperienced to help Canadians.

So, all he can do is take a selfie with DiCaprio and appear on ladies' gossip TV shows.

He's useless. He needs to admit he can't handle the job, and give it to someone who can, and I don't really care which party that person is from at this point.

The honeymoon is over. Justin is fiddling while Rome burns.

[logicalview]

The mess we are in, Alberta included, goes back to the Mulroney government, and has been exacerbated by the Harper government. .

The "mess" we are in isn't really a mess at all, it's the same mess that countries like Norway etc are in. It's what happens to resource exporting countries when resource prices drop, and to blame Mulroney or Harper is just silly.

[I Think]

Had Harper worked to continue the balanced economy, in place when he took office, instead of dumping all Canada's eggs into the oil basket (crappy oil, needing dirty extraction efforts) Canada would be in much better shape.

[Donald G]

by hobbyguy » Today, 2:04 pm

The mess we are in, Alberta included, goes back to the Mulroney government, and has been exacerbated by the Harper government.

I am afraid that the Canadian National Energy Policy was first drafted by Pierre Elliott Trudeau (1980 to 1985)

[logicalview]

Had Harper worked to continue the balanced economy, .

This is a wonderful talking point, but it makes no sense in the real world. What does a "balanced economy" even mean, and what was Harper supposed to do exactly? It's easy to say "Harper should have worked toward a balanced economy" when you don't even understand what this means, and are just using it as a talking point to try and sound intelligent.

In another thread you claimed, in defense of Trudeau, that it wasn't the government's job to create jobs. But suddenly Harper was supposed to create jobs. I just don't get how you guys reconcile this blatant hypocrisy.

[Partmanpartfish]

I am afraid that the Canadian National Energy Policy was first drafted by Pierre Elliott Trudeau (1980 to 1985)

Donald, you know that 1980 is 36 years and many Prime Ministers ago, right?

[logicalview]

Donald, you know that 1980 is 36 years and many Prime Ministers ago, right?

Just like Mulroney was 24 years and many Prime Ministers ago.

[Donald G]

by Partmanpartfish » 35 minutes ago

Donald, you know that 1980 is 36 years and many Prime Ministers ago, right?

I appreciate you bringing that important bit of Canadian History to my attention.

Since you made a point of not mentioning that Justin Junior's father was the one who initiated the National Energy Policy and were blaming it all on the Conservatives I thought that you might have been trying to mislead people. Now that I know different I can again rest easy >>>

[Partmanpartfish]

by Partmanpartfish » 35 minutes ago

Donald, you know that 1980 is 36 years and many Prime Ministers ago, right?

I appreciate you bringing that important bit of Canadian History to my attention.

Since you made a point of not mentioning that Justin Junior's father was the one who initiated the National Energy Policy and were blaming it all on the Conservatives I thought that you might have been trying to mislead people. Now that I know different I can again rest easy >>>

Donald, I simply assumed that you were not aware that PMs and governments subsequent to Mr. Trudeau's were able to change policies and laws as they saw fit.

I

[Donald G]

by Partmanpartfish » 6 minutes ago

Donald, you know that 1980 is 36 years and many Prime Ministers ago, right?

by Partmanpartfish » 35 minutes ag0

Donald, I simply assumed that you were not aware that PMs and governments subsequent to Mr. Trudeau's were able to change policies and laws as they saw fit.

Any more Canadian history that you consider of vital importance that you think important regarding PM Justin Trudeau's dithering ??

[Partmanpartfish]

Any more Canadian history that you consider of vital importance that you think important regarding PM Justin Trudeau's dithering ??

I'm not giving you a history lesson, Donald. I'm simply suggesting it's ridiculous to blame the problems in the oil patch today on the government of three and a half decades ago.

[Donald G]

by Partmanpartfish » 5 minutes ago

I'm not giving you a history lesson, Donald. I'm simply suggesting it's ridiculous to blame the problems in the oil patch today on the government of three and a half decades ago.

And what changes in the National Energy Police took place under subsequent governments that would justify blaming them for the policies that Daddy Trudeau originally adopted ?? Please be specific about the changes they made that directly contributed to the disaster.

What changes is Trudeau Junior going make in the NEP to change the situation that the former governments did not do ?? Again please be specific about what he is going to do and identify how it will improve matters for Canada.

Real life facts, rather than theories would be appreciated.

[Partmanpartfish]

by Partmanpartfish » 5 minutes ago

I'm not giving you a history lesson, Donald. I'm simply suggesting it's ridiculous to blame the problems in the oil patch today on the government of three and a half decades ago.

And what changes in the National Energy Police took place under subsequent governments that would justify blaming them for the policies that Daddy Trudeau originally adopted ?? Please be specific about the changes they made that directly contributed to the disaster.

Donald, if Trudeau's policies were so bad, why didn't subsequent governments change them? Your hero Steve had TEN YEARS to do just that.

[d0nb]

The mess we are in, Alberta included, goes back to the Mulroney government, and has been exacerbated by the Harper government. I think they believed they were doing the right thing, but did and have failed to recognize that Milton Friedman and his compatriots led us down the garden path. Even Milton's most ardent supporter, Alan Greenspan, has trouble with accepting that it was Milton's theories that contributed mightily to the 08/09 debacle.

The sub-prime mortgage debacle of 2008-09 probably wouldn't have happened if Wall Street's lapdogs (the Clintons) hadn't allowed Glass-Steagall to be gutted. This failure to regulate in the public interest along with the flooding of the housing market with cheap loans guaranteed by GSEs puts that financial disaster at the feet of meddling politicians, not poor old Milton Friedman.

The FTA negotiated by Mulroney and Reagan was a good start at freeing trade from political manipulation and improving the regulatory framework for commerce between Canada and the US. At the time of the FTA, the US had some concerns about its energy security and was willing to indulge Canada with a trade pact as long as it offered some assurance of access to Canadian resources. In other words, a mutually beneficial agreement. The deal should have included labor mobility rights, but that would probably have been too frightening for xenophobes on both sides of the border.

Many Canadians voted for the Chretien Liberals precisely because they promised to renounce NAFTA if they failed to secure necessary changes. Of course, the Liberals lied. And in truth, NAFTA probably isn't as beneficial to Canada or the US as it should be. Its main function seems to be be to allow corporate access to cheap labor and poorly enforced environmental laws in what is increasingly a dangerous and corrupt country.

I tend to agree with those who think the US made a big mistake when it stopped at annexing only the northern half of Mexico. It would have been better if they had kept the whole thing. At least Trump's stupid wall wouldn't be as long.