RCMP Unionization, Let's Get It Right

[GordonH]

http://mppac.ca/
So why do they need a union if they already have whats in the link above.

[erinmore3775]

GH, please read the link you provided.

" Over the years, MPPAC has been successfully fighting for the right to engage in collective bargaining as the independent association on behalf of RCMP members, and has consistently raised questions of the RCMP management’s accountability, resources and training, and issues related to officer safety and the public’s safety.“Members want to negotiate our employment conditions and be consulted on how this bill represents them,” said Rob Creasser, MPPAC spokesperson. “Unfortunately the way it stands, this bill is flawed by removing vital matters from the bargaining table such as disciplinary measures and allocation of resources.”

http://mppac.ca/about/our-mission/

While the association exists, they are not a legal bargaining agent. They have no legal standing. While they may assist a member or civilian employee during a disagreement, they may only advise.They are not a union.

[Donald G]

Postby GordonH » Yesterday, 8:26 pm

http://mppac.ca/
So why do they need a union if they already have whats in the link above.

The following article by Tonda MacCharles pretty well describes the present situation.

By: Tonda MacCharles Ottawa Bureau reporter, Published on Wed Mar 16 2016
OTTAWA—The RCMP may be set for an old-style unionization war as a new organization has sprung up to compete to be the national bargaining unit for Canada’s Mounties, the Star has learned.
Calling itself the National Police Federation, the group incorporated last week in order to launch a national certification drive among some 17,000 RCMP frontline policing officers and reservists.
This latest development means two organizations — the NPF and the Mounted Police Professional Association of Canada (MPPAC) — are jockeying to become the bargaining agent as a Liberal bill to allow unionization is rushed through parliamentary committee before May 15.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016 ... table.html

[erinmore3775]

It would seem that the Parliamentary Committee is listening to at least some of those giving testimony.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rcmp-union-bill-changes-1.3547127

" Parliament's public safety committee has deleted two controversial sections of a bill that would have moved injured Mounties from an internal RCMP health services program to provincial workers compensation programs.

" NDP MP Daniel Blaikie introduced an amendment to remove all of those exclusions. Liberal MPs expressed some interest in removing harassment and workplace safety from the list, which would have made them subject to bargaining. However, RCMP Commissioner Bob Paulson told the committee that harassment was inextricably tied up with officer conduct and could not be bargained. He also assured committee members that senior management always has officer safety top of mind."I think what has happened is that committee has raised their concern, has essentially put the RCMP on watch, that our public safety and national security committee is watching how the RCMP handles harassment as an issue and we'll be expecting updates regularly," said Liberal MP and committee chair Rob Oliphant."

The committee chair seems to have much more faith in the Commissioner to curb harassment than most members and I do. It will be interesting to see if the RCMP brass can curb internal harassment and sexism. In the meantime I am pleased with how this Bill is proceeding with the amendments.

[erinmore3775]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/mountie-rcmp-lawsuit-suing-drinking-bottle-taylor-van-diest-armstrong-murder-1.3558281

For those who do not believe the RCMP members need union representation during harassment and discipline case should read the above article. The actions of the Commanding Officer of E Division may are not extreme or unusual in the day to day operations of how senior officers deal with their junior officers when they "believe" that wrong doing has occurred even when " the RCMP's Conduct Authority Representative Directorate (CARD) at national headquarters in Ottawa, refused another extension — concluding "all of the evidence … would not support a finding on a balance of probabilities that Constable Ilic had lied to the courts or investigators."

The RCMP have tough a enough job working on our streets without having to "fight" with senior management with no one in their corner.

[Treblehook]

Food for thought on this topic of RCMP unionization. It seems rather odd that the vast majority of retired members, who served for many years during the so-called dark ages of the RCMP are against any notion of unionization. The reference to "dark ages" relates to the more paramilitary management that existed in years gone by... a time when there was no staff relations reps and so on. This is a fact that is easily confirmed by speaking with almost any retired officer who served from the 50's, 60's and 70's and up until recent times. Does this mean that the current management and supervision within the Force is less competent than managers at various levels in past decades? Does it mean that the type of people being hired and filling the ranks of the Force are so different than those who preceded them? With the exception of those who have retired very recently, the response to the prospect of RCMP unionization is: they will regret it, sooner rather than later.

[Fancy]

A little history:

In the mid 1960s and early 1970s, major changes came about: equitation component of basic training was eliminated; educational requirements changed; university graduates were encouraged to join; married restrictions were eliminated; paid overtime came into effect; grievance process was introduced; Division Staff Relations Representative (DSRR) was established; and women were accepted into the Force.

http://www.rcmpveteransvancouver.com/19 ... e-changed/

[Smurf]

Off the top of my head I have to think that since the hiring of females, minorities etc. truly came into being around the 70' it is quite possible that it took a decade or two after that for many of these problems to raise their ugly head. Yes they were going on but as in most cases it takes a while for them to actually be brought forward. In the beginning it is easier to ignore and or cover up "a few complaints".

What I find really disturbing is that it has got to the point where it requires a union to clean it up. Why does management so often push it to that stage. Why can't they just handle things properly without being forced.

[erinmore3775]

Smurf wrote: " What I find really disturbing is that it has got to the point where it requires a union to clean it up. Why does management so often push it to that stage. Why can't they just handle things properly without being forced."

Truer words have not been spoken, especially with respect to the RCMP. It is also true for certain sections of the federal government. Unfortunately, unions seem to be the only way to even the playing field. It is also unfortunate that the Conservative Party of Canada, as represented by the Parliamentary Opposition, has withdrawn its support of the Bill that would allow unionization of the RCMP and fullfil the requirements of the SCOC ruling.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/rcmp-union-bill-conservatives-1.3572872

The Opposition members have said, "The Liberals are failing to support the brave men and women of the RCMP by forcing them to adopt this undemocratic practice. Conservatives will always stand with the RCMP and we will not support legislation that so blatantly violates the wishes of its members," O'Toole said."

"The Mounties remain Canada's only non-unionized police force.To date, officers and the two groups seeking to represent them have lobbied MPs to change several aspects of the bill, but have been largely silent about just how they would prefer to certify should they choose to form a union.Their most pressing concerns about C-7 included the now-expunged health-care provisions, as well as a list of issues excluded from the bargaining table, such as harassment and staffing levels."

It seems to me that instead of standing on a principle, Opposition members are standing firmly in a pile of political boffalgag. Instead of holding up Bill C 7, they should be working on amending or fighting the over riding set of motions that will repeal Bill C, that affects all federal employees. However, most of all they should be working to reform/improve the current management practices of the RCMP.

[cutter7]

paid training, excellent benefits and wages, early pension with ability to contract back while drawing pension and you want a union too? pfft.. how about getting a grip?