A lesson for would be racists

[the truth]

Well lets make everyone equal then. Why do we have three tiers of people. Muslims have one set of rights. Natives a completely seperate set of rights. Then everyone else just gets to pay .

exactly,100% correct

[Ka-El]

Well lets make everyone equal then. Why do we have three tiers of people. Muslims have one set of rights. Natives a completely seperate set of rights. Then everyone else just gets to pay .

Apart from the usual deliberately inflammatory rhetoric (everyone else just gets to pay), we should recognize that “equality” is as yet an undefined or agreed upon concept (varying definitions across the political spectrum). We would need to start with a better base of understanding than three tiers of people separated into three unrelated groups (one ideology, one race, and one “everyone else”). In any case, while I am sure we could start an interesting discussion on this topic, it is still nothing more than a deflection from addressing the inappropriate and purposely provocative behavior as outlined in the OP.

[generalposter]

Sounds like someone’s got a bad case of verbal diarrhea. If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance you can always baffle them with bull poop.

[Ka-El]

If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance you can always baffle them with bull poop.

Or, if things get a little too complicated to understand (it always amazes me how concepts like stereotype, overgeneralization, and deflection are so hard for some to grasp - words are too big you say?) you can always default to rhetoric or hyperbole
- or even more deflection.

[Jflem1983]

If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance you can always baffle them with bull poop.

Or, if things get a little too complicated to understand (it always amazes me how concepts like stereotype, overgeneralization, and deflection are so hard for some to grasp - words are too big you say?) you can always default to rhetoric or hyperbole
- or even more deflection.

While i also had to assume he was refering to u ka el. Im not sure. He could be refering to my post as well. But ill let u take the credit

[Ka-El]

But ill let u take the credit

no worries, happy to oblige

[Mark5]

It appears that some people are now using the racist card as a weapon to silence others. The word racism is now used to describe any kind of conflict where white people are involved assuming they must be racist because they are white. Racism is the ultimate put down and it is hard to defend against it because no real proof is required and there is no real defense against it. But are people truly racist? A comment in the heat of an argument in a stressful situation is all that is needed declare someone a racist, even though they might not really be a true racist. This is in itself a form of racism perpetrated by non whites. Racism is not exclusive to Caucasian people. And it seems that people who feel they are victims of racism have big chips on their shoulders daring others to knock them off so they can accuse them of racism. It is a form of mob mentality and a form of racism itself.
Last summer I saw a fellow panhandling at an intersection on a traffic island. There was a big sign there indicating this was unlawful. So I rolled my window down and called out to him that it was illegal to panhandle there and can`t he read the sign. He turned my way and I saw he was a first nations guy. He immediately starting yelling at me that "no I can`t read because I am a dumb Indian and you probably hate Indians" I told him that I didn`t even know he was an Indian(his word) and I don`t hate "Indians" or anybody. He didn`t know what to say and I drove away because the light was green. However, I thought afterwards that I should have jokingly said that the only people I hate are people with big chips on their shoulders.

I personally think everyone is exactly the same no mater what. We are all human beings struggling on this planet and I have always judged others as individuals, not as a group. Unfortunately many progressive liberals judge whites as a group and in many ways, they are the real racists.

[the truth]

great post, and 100% the truth

[Ka-El]

I can’t imagine any reason for Fist Nations peoples to believe they are subjects of racism.

I can’t believe that anyone could be so ignorant of this issue to say that.

I personally think everyone is exactly the same no mater what. We are all human beings struggling on this planet and I have always judged others as individuals, not as a group. Unfortunately many progressive liberals judge whites as a group and in many ways, they are the real racists.

It is commendable to judge people as individuals and not a group. I would hope having a philosophy like that would help you to recognize the use of stereotype, rhetoric and overgeneralizations on these threads being used to describe First Nations people as a function of belonging to that group is prejudicial. If we want to remove the concept of racism from the discussion, then conscious choices have to be made to disregard racist thinking and ideas – and that will first require the personal courage to acknowledge culpability and the willingness to do the intellectual work.

Blaming this on white people as a group, or assuming all whites are racist because a few posters here are is just another example of stereotype. While it would be nice to think we are all equal, that is simply not the case. What is important, in my opinion, is that we all have equal opportunity to make what we each want of our own life, and that we live in a society that respects and provides for everyone to have that opportunity. Such respect includes acknowledgement and respect for our differences, as well as our similarities. As many people are saying now, we have strength through diversity.

I am sad to think what the real motive might be behind this effort to muddy and deflect from the impacts of racism by certain posters here, seemingly looking for any way to continue excusing their own racist behavior. It would seem the efforts to really create a more respectful and inclusive society are scaring some people. That would make for another interesting thread topic. They either scared of sharing, or they are ashamed at acknowledging they have been part of an ongoing problem. The efforts being expended here to make excuses or redefine the issue are very telling, but this hasn’t been the first time we’ve observed such ugliness on these forums, and I know the usual suspects are not finished yet.

[Verum]

It appears that some people are now using the racist card as a weapon to silence others. True, though it's important to note that many are using the "you/they are using the racism card to silence others", when it is a clear case of racism The word racism is now used to describe any kind of conflict where white people are involved assuming they must be racist because they are white. No, that is simply not the norm. Racism may be seen where it is not, but at least as often, if not far more so, people claim that there is no racism involved when there is. Just because the people involved aren't burning crosses or lynching people doesn't mean that racism isn't involved. Telling some First Nations people to go back to the "rez" is clearly racist, in the same way that telling Black people to go back to Africa, or Irish people to go back to the bogs. Racism is the ultimate put down and it is hard to defend against it because no real proof is required and there is no real defense against it. Somewhat true and unfortunately, racism and inappropriate claims of racism are both hard to defend against. But are people truly racist? A comment in the heat of an argument in a stressful situation is all that is needed declare someone a racist, even though they might not really be a true racist. Ah, but what is a true racist? If you blurt out a racist comment in the heat of the moment, are you not racist, or do you need to engage in overt or extreme racism to be one. Personally, I think that anyone who attributes traits or behaviours to someone based on their beliefs about their race, is a racist. Assuming that someone who is First Nations lives on a reservation is racist, in the same way that assuming a Black person has rhythm, an Asian is good at math, an Irishman is a hard drinker, etc. This is in itself a form of racism perpetrated by non whites. Racism is not exclusive to Caucasian people. True, though certainly as we Whites have largely been the most powerful group in Canada, we have had the most opportunity and ability to engage in racist behaviour. Something we have certainly done in the past and something many continue to do today, though most do so in more subtle ways than in the past. And it seems that people who feel they are victims of racism have big chips on their shoulders daring others to knock them off so they can accuse them of racism. It is a form of mob mentality and a form of racism itself. Yes, having a chip on your shoulder towards White people, or any other group of people, based on their race is racism.
Last summer I saw a fellow panhandling at an intersection on a traffic island. There was a big sign there indicating this was unlawful. So I rolled my window down and called out to him that it was illegal to panhandle there and can`t he read the sign. He turned my way and I saw he was a first nations guy. He immediately starting yelling at me that "no I can`t read because I am a dumb Indian and you probably hate Indians" I told him that I didn`t even know he was an Indian(his word) and I don`t hate "Indians" or anybody. He didn`t know what to say and I drove away because the light was green. However, I thought afterwards that I should have jokingly said that the only people I hate are people with big chips on their shoulders. In fairness, your comment was rather jerkish, though there is no need for someone to fly off the handle like that.

I personally think everyone is exactly the same no mater what. We are all human beings struggling on this planet and I have always judged others as individuals, not as a group. Unfortunately many progressive liberals judge whites as a group and in many ways, they are the real racists.

Yes, because judging Whites as a group is the real racism </sarcasm> Do you not see how racist your statement was? Real racism is racism against any racial group, and it doesn't matter which group it is. It's not about how liberal or conservative someone is. There is a rather large degree of blatant anti-indigenous peoples of Canada bias in this and other threads on this forum. Additionally, some other groups are treated with similar or even worse biases, in plain sight, repeatedly, by blatant racists, bigots, etc. There may be some correlation between political leanings and such bigotry, but political leanings are not the cause of it. The real racists are those who discriminate against people on the basis of their race, no matter what race or political leanings either have. If you use someone's race to insult them, or otherwise diminish them, you are a racist and trying to use the "anger/fear/hatred card" is just pathetic.

[Jflem1983]

Jeez. Its like i died and woke up in Berkley. What a nightmare. God forbid anyone have an opinion that differs from verum. They are for sure racist if they do.


Please save your white guilt for someone who cares.

[Jflem1983]

Whats actually funny. Im pretty well traveled. Born overseas. Have indonesian family. Muslim family. But i get held up as a RACIST. Oh well. One would think such a highly educated individual like verum would be above name calling .. guess not.

[fvkasm2x]

I wasn't going to post in here... because the conversation is just ridiculous and I wanted no part of it.

However, something happened to me yesterday that I thought I'd share as it's fairly applicable to the conversation and it upset me and worried me enough to tell my wife and neighbor about it as soon as I got home.


I was leaving work yesterday and passed 4 coworkers I know that had been hired for overtime. I work shift work and all 4 people I passed were from my watch and had been working the day shift. I smiled and joked "Wow, they must be hard up for tonight if they're hiring all four of you."

A double entendre joke referring to the fact that they needed a lot of overtimes and a friendly jab at their competency or abilities.

Then one of them says (and was serious) "Why, because we're all immigrants?"

I then realized that one was Iranian, one was East Indian and two were black. That was NOT my intention and I didn't even think about it at all until it was brought up. I immediately clarified, stating why I said what I did...

But now do I need to worry that because one person didn't get what I meant or understand my joke, that I might get reported? That I might be labeled a racist? That my coworkers won't like or trust me?

It's complete BS and surreal... that now I have to worry about my status at work because someone misunderstood something and took offense. If someone wanted to make waves for me, I'd probably be screwed even though it was completely innocent and I think is a good example of why we've taken things too far with political correctness and everyone being a victim.

[the truth]

exactly, and we can thank the leftwingers for this complete crap, your co workers already know how to play this racists bs game
if you think about it ,its a great way to get people fired to move up the work seniority list

[Jflem1983]

exactly, and we can thank the leftwingers for this complete crap, your co workers already know how to play this racists bs game
if you think about it ,its a great way to get people fired to move up the work seniority list

I dont think it will be a big deal. Its new years. People will go out have a good time and get on with it. I guess it being 4 people though there is a chance one will complain.