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28 killed at elementary school

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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby SurplusElect » Jan 24th, 2013, 3:15 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:Also, I think we have to ban video games that promote violence.


Slight disconnect. Can't kill someone with pixels. If I throw a copy of BF3 at you, it might hurt a little.

People can seek out BF3 all they want - funny thing though - when they go postal and want the same guns in real life - they wont be available - only boring muskets and pink farm guns. BF3 will be much more entertaining and satisfying.

I wonder if BF3 would be as appealing if the weapons shot flowers instead of bullets?
Last edited by SurplusElect on Jan 24th, 2013, 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby theyeti » Jan 24th, 2013, 3:17 pm

ready fire aim !
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby Captain Awesome » Jan 24th, 2013, 3:27 pm

SurplusElect wrote:Slight disconnect. Can't kill someone with pixels. If I throw a copy of BF3 at you, it might hurt a little.


That's how it starts. First they play Battlefield 3 while eating pizza and acquiring large number of zits to feel badass, next thing they buy AR-15. I think I see a progression.

Ban video games to end all violence everywhere at once.

Easy peasy.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby SurplusElect » Jan 24th, 2013, 3:38 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:Next thing they buy AR-15. I think I see a progression.


When they "go to buy a AR-15" a pink stick will be the only thing available.

Basically - the general sentiment is stop making guns cool.

Americans need to really re-think what they are all about. They are fighting "terrosrism" but technically speaking Homeland Security should be shutting down the NRA. NRA's mandate is to promote domestic terrorism in the event that citizens dont agree with their government.

Why wasnt the NRA trying to arm #occupy? Why didn't the Tea Party fight back against tyranny and march on Washington with their guns?

We did it with cigarettes and made them ugly in society - only for weak losers who lack self respect. Voting should be a symbol of freedom, not a weapon.

The resistance to this is comical. Can't feel like a badass with a pink gun eh? This resistance to gun control - what is it really all about then?
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby Captain Awesome » Jan 24th, 2013, 4:17 pm

SurplusElect wrote: Can't feel like a badass with a pink gun eh?


Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Wow, painting guns pink clearly made it uncool to buy guns. Oh wait, it didn't.

May be some flowers are missing...Also, we should invent a device that turns gun shots into San Francisco (Be Sure To Wear Some Flowers In Your Hair) song bits - that will really make it uncool to fire guns.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby SurplusElect » Jan 24th, 2013, 4:22 pm

Now make them look like your grandfathers hunting rifle.

No military similarities.

See how many "black trench coat gangs" and wannabe's take up arms.

Interesting that those are obviously weapons appeal to women, and women are never mass-shooters, are they?

Sorta speaks to my theory that the wrong people seek these weapons out simply because of what the look of the weapon makes them feel.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby Captain Awesome » Jan 24th, 2013, 4:40 pm

SurplusElect wrote:Now make them look like your grandfathers hunting rifle.

No military similarities.


Image


Now we're talking. Nobody would ever shoot from something like this. The lives are safe.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby SurplusElect » Jan 24th, 2013, 4:47 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:Nobody would ever shoot from something like this.


No too-many-movie-watching, low IQ basement dwellers looking out to go out in "a blaze of glory" anyways.

Blaze of glory and warrior mentality does not go well with Hello Kitty.

We made cigarettes un-cool. I'm sure the US can do this with guns.

Thing is - they don't wanna *Pouty American kid kicks the dirt*.

They like feeling like lethal bad-asses. Hence the problem.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby Captain Awesome » Jan 24th, 2013, 5:01 pm

I must say, out of all threads on Castanet, this one is the most inane and entertaining, thanks SE. Pink guns to solve gun violence - that's awesome.

Oh crap, need to get back to work and get all serious.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby goatboy » Jan 24th, 2013, 5:47 pm

Captain Awesome wrote:
Image


Now we're talking. Nobody would ever shoot from something like this. The lives are safe.


Those are just airsoft guns though, right?
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby RichardW » Jan 24th, 2013, 8:00 pm

Rwede wrote:Beans. I know people that hunt coyotes with "scary-looking" guns. You're way off buddy, wayyyyy off.

Ignorance of firearms breeds a certain fear. Fear of the unknown. It's alive and well on this forum.


You may be correct, but we can't tell - you didn't provide a reasoned argument. That fact that you know people that hunt with a gun that looks a certain way doesn't explain what the problem is if the gun doesn't look that way. Tell us why you 'fear' (your word) this particular change.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby steelrules » Jan 25th, 2013, 1:16 pm

Gun laws do almost nothing to curb gun crime.

Washington Times article
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... -gun-laws/

President Obama has called for stricter federal gun laws to combat recent shooting rampages, but a review of recent state laws by The Washington Times shows no discernible correlation between stricter rules and lower gun-crime rates in the states.

States that ranked high in terms of making records available to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System also tended to have tighter gun laws — but their gun-crime rates ranged widely. The same was true for states that ranked poorly on disclosure and were deemed to have much less stringent gun-possession laws.

For example, New York, even before it approved the strictest gun-control measures in the country last week, was ranked fourth among the states in strength of gun laws by the Brady Campaign to End Gun Violence, but was also in the top 10 in firearm homicide rates in 2011, according to the FBI.

Meanwhile, North Dakota was near the bottom in its firearm homicide, firearm robbery and firearm assault rates, but also had some of the loosest gun laws and worst compliance with turning over mental health records to the background check system.

Analysts said the data underscore that there are no simple or easy broad answers to combating gun violence, which is a complex equation involving gun-ownership rates, how ready authorities are to prosecute gun crimes and how widely they ban ownership.


Enlarge Photo
Gary Kleck, a criminology professor at Florida State University, said in an email that a simple comparison between states’ strength of gun laws and gun-crime rates doesn’t say much about the effects of the laws because the exercise fails to control for other factors such as gun-ownership rates.

In an exhaustive analysis with data from 170 U.S. cities that did control for such factors, Mr. Kleck and fellow researcher E. Britt Patterson concluded that there was no general impact of gun-control laws on crime rates — with a few notable exceptions.

“There do appear to be some gun controls which work, all of them relatively moderate, popular and inexpensive,” the researchers wrote. “Thus, there is support for a gun-control policy organized around gun-owner licensing or purchase permits (or some other form of gun-buyer screening); stricter local dealer licensing; bans on possession of guns by criminals and mentally ill people; stronger controls over illegal carrying; and possibly discretionary add-on penalties for committing felonies with a gun.

“On the other hand, popular favorites such as waiting periods and gun registration do not appear to affect violence rates,” he said.

No state patterns

The Times analysis looked at the Brady Campaign’s rankings for strength of each state’s gun laws and at Mayors Against Illegal Guns’ rankings for how states perform in disclosing mental health data to the background check system. That information was then matched against the FBI’s 2011 gun-crime rankings for homicides, robberies and assaults.

The results showed no correlation among the strength of laws and disclosure and the crime rates.

For example, Maryland and New Jersey — both of them populous states with large metropolitan areas — have tight gun laws but poor mental health disclosure. But New Jersey’s gun-crime rate was in the middle of the pack, while Maryland ranked sixth-highest in homicides involving guns and second-highest in robberies with guns.

Delaware and Virginia, which both ranked high in mental health disclosure and ranked 18th and 19th in the Brady tally of tough gun laws, also had divergent crime rates.

Delaware ranked among the top 10 in number of gun robberies and gun assaults, while Virginia was in the middle of the pack on its measures.



Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... z2J1J7jEqy
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby steelrules » Jan 25th, 2013, 5:22 pm

Truth.
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby RichardW » Jan 25th, 2013, 8:00 pm

steelrules wrote:Gun laws do almost nothing to curb gun crime.

Washington Times article
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... -gun-laws/

President Obama has called for stricter federal gun laws to combat recent shooting rampages, but a review of recent state laws by The Washington Times shows no..... [etc, etc etc]



Or to put it more accurately, gun laws that can be circumnavigated with weaknesses within them (such as private sales of guns not requiring background checks) or by visiting a neighbouring jurisdiction (such as anywhere in the US) have been shown to produce a mixed bag of results. It's kind of what you'd expect really.

If you read the whole article, including the second half that you didn't post, it provides reasons for why correlations do not show up consistently.

Your assertion is the equivalent of building a dam across half of a river and upon studying the results declaring that a dam could never be effectively used to hold back water.

The article seems to hint that proper background checks are somewhat effective. Now you, Steelrules, don't seem like a particularly responsible gun propagandist, but I've gotten the impression so far that you are a responsible gun owner. Perhaps if the US introduced strict and consistent background checks that would be something you would support?
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Re: 28 killed at elementary school

Postby Captain Awesome » Jan 25th, 2013, 8:10 pm

RichardW wrote:Perhaps if the US introduced strict and consistent background checks that would be something you would support?


I think everybody could agree to that. But I'm pretty sure they already have background checks...
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