28 killed at elementary school

[GenuinelyInterested]

I’ve come to accept that the people making arguments against gun control and for gun ownership rights are making good points. I’m going to have to agree with those who suggest the problem with gun violence in America is not so much the lack of gun control, but the culture of Americans and their propensity to quickly use a firearm to solve a problem or face a challenge. I say if Americans want every person to be walking the street carrying a side arm let them. I have no plans to visit anyway.

All of a sudden, Columbia looks to be a safe vacation spot for us Canucks.

[steven lloyd]

All of a sudden, Columbia looks to be a safe vacation spot for us Canucks.

The Department of State reminds U.S. citizens of the dangers of travel to Colombia. Security in Colombia has improved significantly in recent years, including in tourist and business travel destinations such as Cartagena and Bogota, but violence linked to narco-trafficking continues to affect some rural areas and parts of large cities. This replaces the Travel Warning for Colombia issued February 21, 2012, to update information on recent security incidents and terrorist activity.

While the Embassy possesses no information concerning specific and credible threats against U.S. citizens in Colombia, we strongly encourage you to exercise caution and remain vigilant as terrorist and criminal activities remain a threat throughout the country. Two people were killed and approximately 60 injured by a car bomb during an assassination attempt on the life of a former Interior Minister on May 15, 2012.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_t ... _5778.html

If you’re not a politician or involved in the drug trade you’ll likely be quite safe.
Unlike in the streets, schools and movie theatres of America.

[grammafreddy]

If you’re not a politician or involved in the drug trade you’ll likely be quite safe.
Unlike in the streets, schools and movie theatres of America.

...and the bars, hotels and streets in Canada, too, eh?

Or are we just gonna sweep the gang and drug crap under the rug and call Canada safe?

I still maintain, if a guy in a black hat wants to do a shoot 'em up, he'll find a way - regardless of what the laws say. Always has. Always will. Doesn't make anything safer, not in Canada, not in the US and not in Columbia, either.

[metallica]

Or are we just gonna sweep the gang and drug crap under the rug and call Canada safe?

I still maintain, if a guy in a black hat wants to do a shoot 'em up, he'll find a way - regardless of what the laws say. Always has. Always will. Doesn't make anything safer, not in Canada, not in the US and not in Columbia, either.

[goatboy]

I still maintain, if a guy in a black hat wants to do a shoot 'em up, he'll find a way - regardless of what the laws say. Always has. Always will. Doesn't make anything safer, not in Canada, not in the US and not in Columbia, either.

You may be right, but I would like to make it as hard as possible for him to do it.

[hobbyguy]

It isn't "guys in black hats" that are doing these shootings. It appears to young men who are small in every way. Poorly equipped to deal with anything, somehow they seem to twist their thinking to a "big gun" makes me bigger. It just adds to the sadness.

Unfortunately, efforts to limit access (there will always be illegal transactions) will run up against varying degrees of this twisted thinking, and add to that the inevitable "boys and their toys" problem.

If you try to take away my toys, watch out. I like to think that I'm beyond that, but when it's my toys somebody speaks out against, well that's different. I felt that reaction today when reading an editorial comment that making the Bennet bridge passable for sailboats was a waste of taxpayer's money. Whaddya mean?? I own a sailboat. I should be able to go up and down the lake at any cost, it's my right!!! - not a very rational or sensible position, but that's the whole "boys and their toys" thing. Doesn't matter if it's excessively fast cars, or jacked up 4 x 4's, or outrageously loud cigarette boats, or guns. The same reaction occurs.

I think the "boys and their toys" problem is the biggest hurdle to having sensible and enforceable gun laws that are not full of loopholes. Without those laws, the sadness will continue.

We can not lose sight of how great the sadness is. It darn near ruined my Christmas thinking about those poor kids and their families, and the horrible Christmas they face or won't have at all. Surely we "boys" can "man up" and accept that while we can't stop all tragedies like this, we can, through a small sacrifice as to what kind of "toys" we have, prevent some. If that some were the kids in Newtown, it would be worth it - wouldn't it? If we see more rational gun laws, somewhere, some time, a tragedy such as this won't occur. We won't know it though, there won't be anything to see, except some happy kids going safely back to their families, and dreaming of Christmas...

[steelrules]

Or are we just gonna sweep the gang and drug crap under the rug and call Canada safe?

I still maintain, if a guy in a black hat wants to do a shoot 'em up, he'll find a way - regardless of what the laws say. Always has. Always will. Doesn't make anything safer, not in Canada, not in the US and not in Columbia, either.

These are the facts if "conceled carry Feinstine" gets her way there will be a blood bath in the US.
Americans will never give up their second amendment rights because it's not about hunting and sports, it's about having the power to get rid of a tyranical government, and if you haven't been paying attention that's exactly what they have now.
NDAA, warrentless wire taps, the end of posse comitatus, the end of habeas corpus, TSA everywhere "not just airports", capturing all emails, agenda 21.

The criminal elites have taken over the US and the American people are awakening to that fact.
Any gun grab will result in a lot of dead cops a lot of dead military and a massive amount of dead patriots.

[goatboy]

Gandhi,

Seeing that Ghandi was the leader of nonviolent resistance to British rule in India, the context in which you are using the quote is completely wrong.

Here is more of the text where this so called quote came from and this is how it was meant:

I used to issue leaflets asking people to enlist as recruits. One of the arguments I had used was distasteful to the Commissioner: 'Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest. If we want the Arms Act to be repealed, if we want to learn the use of arms, here is a golden opportunity. If the middle classes render voluntary help to Government in the hour of its trial, distrust will disappear, and the ban on possessing arms will be withdrawn.'

"Arms" in this context were military arms not the personal weapons of private individuals. The context of "depriving of the whole nation of arms" was the refusal of the British to conscript Indians into the British Army during the First World War. Gandhi was an extreme anti-militarist. The statement is odd coming out of him, but he used the circumstance for political purposes to advance the cause of Home Rule and Independence.

http://www.potowmack.org/gandhi.html#arms

[goatboy]

These are the facts if "conceled carry Feinstine" gets her way there will be a blood bath in the US.
Americans will never give up their second amendment rights because it's not about hunting and sports, it's about having the power to get rid of a tyranical government, and if you haven't been paying attention that's exactly what they have now.
NDAA, warrentless wire taps, the end of posse comitatus, the end of habeas corpus, TSA everywhere "not just airports", capturing all emails, agenda 21.

The criminal elites have taken over the US and the American people are awakening to that fact.
Any gun grab will result in a lot of dead cops a lot of dead military and a massive amount of dead patriots.

As SL said, Americans are far too quick to turn to a gun to solve their problems. Armed insurrection is not the answer to these troubling issues. Courageous politicians and a change of political will can accomplish the same things with no casualties along the way. Using the threat of violence to justify the ability to own a gun only goes to reinforce the stereotype of the pro-gun lobby.

[goatboy]

Americans will never give up their second amendment rights because it's not about hunting and sports, it's about having the power to get rid of a tyranical government,

Ah, the crux of the Second Amendment argument. Did the founding fathers mean the right to bear arms within a militia (In other words, the right to an armed militia), or the right to bear arms as an individual citizen? The Supreme court see's it one way, but I say it can be interpreted just as easily the other way.

As passed by the Congress:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

As ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, Secretary of State:

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed

[steelrules]

Your forgetting the larger context of Gandhi's words, getting rid of a foreign occupying army.

[steelrules]

Our safety and our liberty depends upon preserving the Constitution of the United States as our fathers made it inviolate. The people of the United States are the rightful masters of both Congress and the Courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who would pervert the Constitution.” ~ President Abraham Lincoln

The right of revolution in the US
Declaration of Independence

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security

[GenuinelyInterested]

Our safety and our liberty depends upon preserving the Constitution of the United States as our fathers made it inviolate. The people of the United States are the rightful masters of both Congress and the Courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who would pervert the Constitution.” ~ President Abraham Lincoln

The right of revolution in the US
Declaration of Independence

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security

Uuuummmm....crafted and published in 1776. ???? A little outdated, I think. if we all had to live by all of the archaic beliefs, we would be still killing Indians for profit and a woman's life would be valued less than..........do you get the point yet?

[steelrules]

Google "Democide" if you think we're any better than they were in 1776, think again.

[GenuinelyInterested]

Google "Democide" if you think we're any better than they were in 1776, think again.

THIS is NOT 1776. Things/people change.