Why the U.K. Needs to Leave the E.U.

[Queen K]

Several things are happening.

Polish center has been threatened.
Muslim center has been firebombed.
Muslim woman verbally assaulted on a bus.
Homes have been vandalized.

The last one is from word of mouth from someone who has relatives in London.

[ferri]

i've been reading about that too. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho ... 04191.html

[maryjane48]

Several things are happening.

Polish center has been threatened.
Muslim center has been firebombed.
Muslim woman verbally assaulted on a bus.
Homes have been vandalized.

The last one is from word of mouth from someone who has relatives in London.

apperently some of the leave side have distanced themselves from the main leader for reasons you just listed

[maryjane48]

wonder how polish people made the bad people list ?

[Hurtlander]

Several things are happening.

Polish center has been threatened.
Muslim center has been firebombed.
Muslim woman verbally assaulted on a bus.
Homes have been vandalized.

The last one is from word of mouth from someone who has relatives in London.

Yesterday I posted a link to an interesting article about the bad things now happening in England as a result of the vote to leave the EU. The link is back on page 14...

[hobbyguy]

Poles are being perceived as taking jobs away from Brits and driving wages down.

The lunatic fringe is out. We have them in Canada. The US has them. Belgium has them. Austria has them. Sweden has them. Poland has them. etc. etc.

However, as I have indicated before, the "remain" is ginning up perceptions of racism to try to gain political advantage. The situation is very hard to read from here.

http://www.spiked-online.com/newsite/article/britain-has-not-become-racist-overnight-brexit-eu/18511#.V3RTlDXGCaY
"Any incident of racism or xenophobia is abhorrent and should be challenged. But the speed with which Remainers have exploited this apparent surge – in what is, at this point, largely anecdotal reports – has been shameful. Acting like the propaganda wing of the EU establishment, they have rushed to confirm the prejudices of the elites by arguing that these vague statistics and endless tweet allegations show just how racist the working-class, Leave-voting public is."

Not sure, however, how reliable that source is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiked_(magazine)

What that article does reference, however, is the elitism and intellectual snobbery toward the British working class. That kind of thing is how those who close plants in western democracies and move them to low wage countries help themselves to justify their unethical greed.

I think the brexit vote gave the British worker a chance to give those elites and snobs a single finger salute.

[hobbyguy]

This gives some insight into the EU culture, and one of the top people in the EU: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36662636

"The 30,000 pages of documents leaked by the whistleblowers exposed favourable tax arrangements offered by Luxembourg to some of the world's biggest companies - including Apple, Ikea, and Pepsi - while Jean-Claude Juncker, now head of the European Commission, was prime minister."

So Juncker gets promoted to head of the EU Commission, and it is the whistleblowers who get prosecuted and convicted? And the EU, with folks like Juncker at the top says it is going to do something about tax evaders and tax cheats???

There is something stinky in Brussels, and it ain't cheese.

[sooperphreek]

when people bring up the xenophobia lunatic fringe is a good way to put it. it is a "fringe" of people. not everyone who voted for brexit is a bigot or racist. and not everyone who lost a job to a pole hates them and wants to firebomb them. but they can certainly resent that there are so many of those people that scoop up jobs. and resent the system and establishment enough to make them pay attention by using one of the last big scale direct democracy opportunities there will be for a long time if the establishment has their way.

[Partmanpartfish]

So, now Boris Johnson has taken himself out of the running for the conservative leadership. He helps to create a huge mess, and now he runs from dealing with it. Beyond the pale.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06 ... -gove-ent/

[logicalview]

*removed*

[hobbyguy]

From what I understand, Boris only bowed out because Gove decided that he could do a better job. It appears Boris thought so too. Gove is not as polarizing a figure. http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-36677028

[sooperphreek]

So, now Boris Johnson has taken himself out of the running for the conservative leadership. He helps to create a huge mess, and now he runs from dealing with it. Beyond the pale.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06 ... -gove-ent/

i guess it all depends on how you look at it. it was a mess for branson and other oligarchs sure. they post losses that dont really mean anything. its all a stock market game of abstract numbers and binary. of course you could look at this situation as an opportunity for the UK to have autonomy and sovereignty. which is never a bad idea.

[sooperphreek]

From what I understand, Boris only bowed out because Gove decided that he could do a better job. It appears Boris thought so too. Gove is not as polarizing a figure. http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-36677028

interesting point. with how popular boris is i think him bowing out to throw support behind someone is good. hes already proven what an asset he was in campaigning. use his strengths to the leave sides advantage. the real question is whether gove will have the balls to actually use article 50.

[hobbyguy]

The notion that countries involved in large "free" trade agreements have not done enough to deal with the impacts of those agreements is, I think, key to the Brexit vote. If it is you that gets done over by these agreements, and you are given no equivalent opportunities, then how would you feel? How would you react?

No secret that I am anti- "free" trade. As expressed by the likes of Bernie Sanders, I have no problem with "fair" trade. I think that in the long term, if you factor in the costs associated with the "losers" (every time a "free" trade deal is struck, criticisms are answered with the shtick that "there will be winners and losers") these "free" trade deals are a net loss to western democracies. Especially as people lose democratic control (whatever little bit they have).

This is an interesting development: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36681475 Austria could well wind up with a "far right" president. Note how well that nationalist parties - like UKIP - are doing in Europe. The map is interesting.

Note that Germany, the big "winner" in the EU, has a low "nationalist" vote. (Germany is the big winner in the EU because: firstly it has outsize control on the affairs of the EU governing bodies, secondly operating in Euros gives Germany the advantage of a massive currency devaluation (Germany used to struggle within Europe as the Deutschmark was the strongest currency), thirdly the EU gives Germany a somewhat captive market due to EU tariffs on all non-EU goods and services, and lastly they get other people to pay for running the show they dominate.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/16/britain-would-be-diminished-by-leaving-eu

"Not only does Norway suffer the indignity of implementing whatever regulation or directive comes off the fax machine, but it also pays around €340m a year into the EU budget" - yet Norway is not an EU member.

I also find it interesting that nationalism is now viewed as "far right". It begs the question: Ought not Canadians be concerned with Canadians first? etc. Pride in your country and wanting it to do well is now being denigrated as "far right"??? Hmmm...

Anyway: The failure of countries to adequately deal with fall out from major deals like EU membership is coming home to roost, and the homogenizing blackmailing blender that is the EU just makes it worse.

IF Britain wanted to cut a "free" trade or "fair" trade deal with Canada - they can't as members of the EU. http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/customs/customs_duties/tariff_aspects/index_en.htm

The more I look into the EU as it currently operates... the more I shake my head. This really is a cautionary tale for Canadians. These big overarching trade deals wind up just being destructive "Trojan horses".

[sooperphreek]

i dont know what it is about europe. basically the EU is conformity instead of conquering. you buy in instead of being over run in a blitzkrieg.