Electric cars/Tesla/Solar power

Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby maryjane48 » Jun 12th, 2016, 3:07 pm

funny how many people do not understand that when gas powered cars first came on the scene it was exactly as now . most the horse and buggy crowd couldnt afford a gas car until ford came along and mass produced to keep costs low . we are at that point now where electric cars are on the verge of being mass produced and when that happens people will look back on gas days and wonder why we used gas in first place when energy from the sun is always there
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Smurf » Jun 12th, 2016, 3:27 pm

Have you bought yours yet. Let us know when you do, I would be interested. Till then it is all talk.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Jlabute » Jun 12th, 2016, 7:57 pm

I suppose if one is a few dollars short on their EV budget, a Nissan Leaf instead of a Tesla might be fine. Problem with the leaf is the base model at almost $33K goes 133km. If you get the next model up at close to $38K then you can go an astounding 177km, in ideal conditions. In the winter, it'll probably take you 4 days to get to Vancouver. lol.

I am waiting for better motors and batteries at a much much better price before I would consider even looking at them. The Chevy volt, Prius and others are hybrids and they too are expensive for what you get. Lithium oxygen holds promise for energy density close to gas if the hurdles can be humped.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Dizzy1 » Jun 12th, 2016, 8:01 pm

maryjane48 wrote:funny how many people do not understand that when gas powered cars first came on the scene it was exactly as now . most the horse and buggy crowd couldnt afford a gas car until ford came along and mass produced to keep costs low . we are at that point now where electric cars are on the verge of being mass produced and when that happens people will look back on gas days and wonder why we used gas in first place when energy from the sun is always there

Here's the thing, when we went from horse and buggy to the Model T, there was an improvement in performance - the exact opposite is a result (at the moment) going from gas to electric, there is a decrease in performance, so for the average person, its a step backwards. You can mass produce them until your hearts content, but they won't be a viable option yet.

Build one that can charge in 5 minutes and give you 800km of range, then your comparison would hold water.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Poindexter » Jun 21st, 2016, 1:28 pm

Drove a Tesla today, 0 - 60 in 4.3 seconds, my gawd I want one. When the Tesla model 3 hits the road things are going to change.

BMW recently came up with an electric car and I don't think it was by accident that it's ugly, this from a manufacturer that knows how to design beautiful cars. The reason is once sold electric cars like Tesla have so few moving parts that it will leave thier million dollar investment in service bays sitting empty.

Another thing I found really cool about Tesla is you can download upgrades, the car I drove didn't come with some of the options it currently has off the lot, like downloading an app for your phone the car can be upgraded without ever seeing a dealership or shop.

You can mass produce them until your hearts content, but they won't be a viable option yet.

A lot of people disagree, to give you an idea, top selling vehicle in the US last year was the Camry with 420,000 units sold. The Tesla 3 hasn't been test driven by a single customer and yet there are 400,000 units pre-ordered.

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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby hobbyguy » Jun 23rd, 2016, 11:07 am

I am in the camp that believes that believes that electric cars will wind up replacing 80% of the cars on the road. But, as many point out, as yet they are not practical enough for most applications. The limiting factor is battery technology, which is heavy, and takes too long to charge.

Have a look at this: http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/130380-future-batteries-coming-soon-charge-in-seconds-last-months-and-power-over-the-air

An electric car battery that recharges in 7 minutes? Now that would be game changer. Pull into a charging station, go get a coffee and and a snack, come back, pull away.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Dizzy1 » Jun 23rd, 2016, 8:34 pm

Poindexter wrote:A lot of people disagree,

A lot of people may disagree with me, but they're still in the minority, which represents an extremely small fraction of car buyers.
Poindexter wrote:to give you an idea, top selling vehicle in the US last year was the Camry with 420,000 units sold. The Tesla 3 hasn't been test driven by a single customer and yet there are 400,000 units pre-ordered.

You're comparing it with one manufacturer and one model type and the million EVs sold to date only represents 0.1% of vehicles sold. Even if there were 400 000 Tesla 3s on the road, that won't even represent half a percent of vehicles on the road. They have a very long way ahead.

The Tesla 3 isn't simply going against the Camry or any other single vehicle, its trying to go up against all of them as a whole.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Atomoa » Jun 23rd, 2016, 9:30 pm

Dizzy1 wrote:The Tesla 3 isn't simply going against the Camry or any other single vehicle, its trying to go up against all of them as a whole.


Just like the iPhone going up against all the clamshell non-smartphones out there. You are downplaying that the demand will become exponential in a untapped market. It's happened throughout technologies history. It's not competing against the combustion car, it's replacing the combustion car.

I have posted the S-curve of the marketplace point before but it was ignored. Here it is again.

http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-ev-oil-crisis/
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Dizzy1 » Jun 23rd, 2016, 10:10 pm

Atomoa wrote:
Just like the iPhone going up against all the clamshell non-smartphones out there. You are downplaying that the demand will become exponential in a untapped market. It's happened throughout technologies history. It's not competing against the combustion car, it's replacing the combustion car.

I have posted the S-curve of the marketplace point before but it was ignored. Here it is again.

http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-ev-oil-crisis/

Just like the Model T vs. horse and buggy comparison, the iPhone gave us more than a clamshell phone. The EV is not giving us more ... yet! Even if those projections in your link are correct, thats just a third of the market by 2040. Not even half the market in 24 years from now is hardly revolutionizing. Like I said, they have a very long way ahead of them before they become a viable alternative for the masses.

Speaking of ignoring posts, we're still waiting for you to back up your claim on page 2 ...

Even Steven wrote:Sorry to burst your bubble, but:

Solar panels are not efficient enough to charge up Tesla Power Wall and power your home. Unless you cover a football field with them.

Tesla Power Wall isn't powerful enough to charge up Tesla. If I'm not mistaken, you'd need 10 powerwall units (7 kWt) to charge up a Tesla (70-85 kWt). It actually not possible without using an inverter - which will only increase inefficiency.

Atomoa wrote:Your numbers are way off.

Dizzy1 wrote:Proof?
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Atomoa » Jun 24th, 2016, 10:12 am

Dizzy1 wrote:The EV is not giving us more ... yet! Even if those projections in your link are correct, thats just a third of the market by 2040. Not even half the market in 24 years from now is hardly revolutionizing. Like I said, they have a very long way ahead of them before they become a viable alternative for the masses.


Again, you ignore the untapped marketplace and the S curve. If you think EV's don't offer more than a combustion engine car offers I can't help you. If you think people won't want them, wait and see. You sound like a person a defending their non-smartphone in the early 2000's. Who needs internet access on a telephone, says you. Bells and whistles!

Speaking of ignoring posts, we're still waiting for you to back up your claim on page 2 ...


Nothing to back up my numbers were apparently wrong. You're not having a discussion, you're looking to invalidate anything I say. Sad that you seek that kind of superiority.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby hobbyguy » Jun 24th, 2016, 11:46 am

A Tesla went by me yesterday - can't afford it - but sure made me wish.

The electrical supply issue will be interesting. I have to think that nuclear will come back into the picture. Given that there are reactor designs out there that can neither do a Three Mile Island, nor do a Chernobyl, and produce far less waste... Now that will be an interesting discussion.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Dizzy1 » Jun 24th, 2016, 10:47 pm

Atomoa wrote:
If you think EV's don't offer more than a combustion engine car offers I can't help you.

i'm going to make this extremely easy for you. What more does an EV offer me that a gasoline or diesel engine doesn't? Does it drive faster? Does it drive farther? Am I able to drive 800km nonstop, stop for 5 minutes to refuel and drive another 800km nonstop? You're the salesman, I'm the buyer - sell me one.
Atomoa wrote:If you think people won't want them, wait and see.

I don't have to wait and see. Until EVs offer what a traditional car offers, they're a niche market and useless for the average motorist - plain and simple. If people have to completely adjust their life style, its not a product for the masses. I have no problem with EVs, they're fantastic, but I also appreciate the reality of the world we live in. Are they the way of the future? Maybe. But they're not the way of the present.

Atomoa wrote:You sound like a person a defending their non-smartphone in the early 2000's. Who needs internet access on a telephone, says you. Bells and whistles!

Did you even read my post? I specifically said that the iPhone offered us more than a typical clamshell phone - something that an EV does not do. An EV offers nothing to the average motorist to justify them buying one - nothing, zero, zilch, nada, nichts.
Atomoa wrote:Nothing to back up my numbers were apparently wrong. You're not having a discussion, you're looking to invalidate anything I say. Sad that you seek that kind of superiority.

Let me get this straight. Someone posted some information, you say they're wrong, you provide nothing to validate your claim and ignore the question when asked if you could validate your claim and you think I'm seeking some kind of "superiority"? Isn't asking for information to back up a claim the very fundamental of a discussion? Good grief.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Smurf » Jun 25th, 2016, 6:40 am

You hit it dead on Dizzy1. Good one. Mind you you have done it all before. Those who live in the real world understand, the rest probably never will.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby Atomoa » Jun 25th, 2016, 8:56 am

Dizzy1 wrote:What more does an EV offer me that a gasoline or diesel engine doesn't?

I specifically said that the iPhone offered us more than a typical clamshell phone - something that an EV does not do. An EV offers nothing to the average motorist to justify them buying one - nothing, zero, zilch, nada, nichts.


A benefit would be it's the best car ever produced and the safest car on the road currently and it doesn't need gas. It also drives and parks itself and it good for the environment.

You answered your own question however while arguing with yourself. I'm not going to step into a scrap between the two haves of your brain Dizzy. There is no room for me in this conversation. Why would I sell a car to a old grump that has no intention of buying a car and gets his rocks off arguing with salesmen? Get off the lot, tire kicker.

Let me get this straight. Someone posted some information, you say they're wrong, you provide nothing to validate your claim and ignore the question when asked if you could validate your claim and you think I'm seeking some kind of "superiority"? Isn't asking for information to back up a claim the very fundamental of a discussion? Good grief.


I ran the numbers and mine were incorrect. Nothing to add and back up. That is was what I said last post which you are making me repeat. Was that not good enough for you? You're now having a fit because I didn't write a formal apology letter, Charlie Brown.

Keep underestimating technology and the public's demand for it. That's a good policy in this era of Moore's law.
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Re: Million plus electric cars

Postby goatboy » Jun 25th, 2016, 9:11 am

I think we have a bit of a skewered view of electric vehicles in BC as our electricity is, relatively, clean electricity. In most of the rest of the country, that's not the case right now. Given the real environmental cost of producing an electric vehicle, especially the batteries, are we being duped into feeling better about buying an electric car than we should be? BTW, I would love a Tesla but not to make me feel like I belong to Greenpeace.

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