Understanding what consent actually IS

[Barney Google]

Understand Consent With the Help of Stick Figures and a Cup of Tea....

http://magazine.good.is/articles/tea-ne ... ed-so-good

I thought this was an excellent article and even better video clip....pretty simple message.

Wonder why there are so many that feel this is a grey or gray area.

[Glacier]

Wonder why there are so many that feel this is a grey or gray area.

No actually, I don't. In a society where it is socially acceptable to watch porn and to hook up on a regular basis (whether pre-planned or not), you're always going to get a lot of grey areas around consent.

[Barney Google]

It used to be socially acceptable for men to have mistresses on the side(and or to have concubines or numerous females in the harem that were not wives), and go to the local bar to watch the scantily clad ladies dance the can-can...then perhaps visit one 'upstairs' for a while. So why is there is a gray/grey area of non-consent when someone says, "No". Is todays society so much more accepting that "No" might mean "Yes" in some cases? What cases are those? By how someone is dresses? The way someone dances or acts? If someone is passed out or completely inebriated does that mean "Yes" too?

What is it about "Today" that we are or are not teaching our children about themselves and others?

[Glacier]

Dress codes are developed for a variety of cultural reasons, and if someone doesn't like them, too bad. I stayed at sparkling hills, and I went to the restaurant, and since I wasn't some holier-than-thou snoot, I did not wear open toed shoes or a shirt with exposed shoulders. They have a dress code. Interestingly, the pool's dress code is quite a bit different, especially at European hour. Schools also have a dress code, and refusing to abide by it is plain arrogant. No matter where you draw the line you will always have some people pushing the boundaries to see what they can get away with, especially these days when we see such awesome examples of how to dress on TV. To give in to the envelope pushers all the time just because they whine and cry permissive parenting at its worst.

No means no to 90% of the population, but since women are objectified in pop culture, some men think women are there for the taking. If you are dressing in a manner that society deems seductive and you're too stupid to realize it, then you'll probably not understand why someone would tell you to dress appropriately.

[whatwhat]

Honestly, consent should not have a grey area. No means no, even if I am walking down the street naked, no still means no. No matter how a women or man is dressed their body is their own and they have a right to decline sex/touch from other people.

Obviously there are dress codes in place in certain places, but some dress codes are extreme. Such as with girls in school, obviously there needs to be a appropriate dress code for a learning environment, but when it is 30 degrees out, a girl should be able to wear a tank top (with her bra strap showing) and it be appropriate. People walk down the street every day dressed in tank tops and shorts. I can go to college and where a tank top and it be completely okay. Not to mention that be telling young women that they shouldn't dress a certain way because its distracting, or inappropriate, they are being taught that they are sexualized people (even as under aged girls ). The schools should be teaching boys not to be distracted by a shoulder, or a bra strap.

[JLives]

Consent doesn't have a grey area. No means no or stop if you are in the midst of a sexual act.

As far as dress codes for girls go I would be *bleep* if I were male that the school thought I was some mindless being not capable of controlling myself around bare shoulders.

[Hassel99]

Does not touch on the aspect of intoxication vs sobriety. Have sex with an intoxicated women unable to give legal consent, clearly rape. Have sex with an intoxicated man unable to give legal consent...not rape? I guess? Depends?

Both equally intoxicated? Who is the victim? Did both get raped?
My wife and I went out for dinner last week, she was the DD. I got drunk, we had sex. Was I raped?


Grey area found...

[whatwhat]

Does not touch on the aspect of intoxication vs sobriety. Have sex with an intoxicated women unable to give legal consent, clearly rape. Have sex with an intoxicated man unable to give legal consent...not rape? I guess? Depends?

Both equally intoxicated? Who is the victim? Did both get raped?
My wife and I went out for dinner last week, she was the DD. I got drunk, we had sex. Was I raped?


Grey area found...

If you were so drunk where you were not able to verbally say yes or no, then it could easily be rape. Guys can be raped too, if you are intoxicated to the point where you can not say yes or no (whether you are a man or a woman) it can be considered rape. Of course the person may not consider it rape being as they may have been okay with it if they were conscious enough to speak. But then again, I know that if I were drunk enough to not be able to talk, I would not want someone to try and have sex with me, nor would I want to try and have sex with someone who is so drunk they can not even say so.

[flamingfingers]

My wife and I went out for dinner last week, she was the DD. I got drunk, we had sex. Was I raped?

Were you unconscious? If not, did you do or attempt to tell her to STOP? If you did, did she hold you down and complete her evil intent? Did she threaten you that if you did not cooperate she would beat you or kill you if she did not have her way with you?

[Glacier]

Were you unconscious? If not, did you do or attempt to tell her to STOP? If you did, did she hold you down and complete her evil intent? Did she threaten you that if you did not cooperate she would beat you or kill you if she did not have her way with you?

The feminazis call it rape even if you made no outward sign of saying, "stop". If it appears consensual at the time, but the next day the chick has second thoughts, and says she was pretty loaded at the time and wouldn't have given her consent had she been sober, that is rape according to the feminists.

[whatwhat]

The feminazis call it rape even if you made no outward sign of saying, "stop". If it appears consensual at the time, but the next day the chick has second thoughts, and says she was pretty loaded at the time and wouldn't have given her consent had she been sober, that is rape according to the feminists.

If a person is so drunk where they can not walk straight, slurring speech, throwing up etc and someone has sex with them is that rape? It might be, they may not be able to consciously make an educated decision. So why risk it? Why force that person to have sex while they are in that state.

Of course there are people who might lie and "change their minds", but you can not use those people to totally dismiss the rights of everyone else.

[whatwhat]

The feminazis

Hey Glacier, I just wanted to link you to a video that explains a little bit about feminism and about feminazis. You seem to really be clumping together a few extremists in the feminist movement into the whole group, and I think this video can clear it up for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqCQpJcW9Zs

PS. Clumping a group of people who are just trying to fight for equal rights in with a group of people who commited genocide on millions of people seems a bit extreme, no?

[Liquidnails]

I believe feminism is good for our society, I'm so glad we let you ladies do that stuff here.

[Barney Google]

If you have been a rape victim yourself or have had a family member or friend who has been raped and or sexually assaulted you wouldn't take this topic lightly and might be offended by some glib comments about it.

Most rapes and sexual assaults happen between individuals who know each other...most of them are not reported. In my books, NO means NO...and if someone is intoxicated and unable to make a rational decision then there should be no reason to say NO because it should just be respected that unless someone says YES...a person should not be violated.

If caught and charged and convicted "Perps" do the time. Some might even say they are sorry... but eventually, they get to put that 'aside' and move on in life (or not) totally their choice. Rape and sexual assault victims carry that act with them for the rest of their lives...it will affect them FOREVER, and more often than not, it affect their families and children FOREVER too! It was/is not their choice to be attacked and they can get counselling and 'treatment' (which may or may not help), they can learn to live with it..but they have no choice in having to bear their victimization FOREVER...

[FreeRights]

If you have been a rape victim yourself or have had a family member or friend who has been raped and or sexually assaulted you wouldn't take this topic lightly and might be offended by some glib comments about it.

Most rapes and sexual assaults happen between individuals who know each other...most of them are not reported. In my books, NO means NO...and if someone is intoxicated and unable to make a rational decision then there should be no reason to say NO because it should just be respected that unless someone says YES...a person should not be violated.

If caught and charged and convicted "Perps" do the time. Some might even say they are sorry... but eventually, they get to put that 'aside' and move on in life (or not) totally their choice. Rape and sexual assault victims carry that act with them for the rest of their lives...it will affect them FOREVER, and more often than not, it affect their families and children FOREVER too! It was/is not their choice to be attacked and they can get counselling and 'treatment' (which may or may not help), they can learn to live with it..but they have no choice in having to bear their victimization FOREVER...

I have a problem with this definition of rape. I'm likely going against the grain, but that's fine.

Rape is rape and I absolutely think that non consensual sex would be dealt with heavily and criminally.

But when a girl or a guy is too drunk to say no? The partner is likely very intoxicated too. I'm not defending sex in this manner, but should the responsibility not fall on both participants? One person made an irrational choice to have sex, and the other made an irrational choice to accept it.

But there are feminists who believe the irrational decision of the woman makes her unable to properly give consent. The equally irrational decision by the male is rape.

Does this actually make sense?