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#MeToo

Social, economic and environmental issues in our ever-changing world.

Re: #MeToo

Postby Silverstarqueen » Nov 3rd, 2017, 10:05 pm

I was sexually touched while working for a family friend. I was 13 and did absolutely nothing to bring it on.
I've also been sexually assaulted and there was no justification for the guy's behavior. Yes, it was a male that assaulted me. I do not blame all males, or even most males, have no particular grudge against the opposite sex.
We have already posted examples where the victim was male, I'm sure there must be examples where the perpetrator is female, no one has said it cannot involve either sex. and I have heard the same comment on TV, so I don't know why there is this harping that the blame is always on men in general. We don't know if most of the abusers are male , but so far most of the reports are of male abusers. Probably because victims are not reporting female perpetrators for their own reasons.or perhaps because males are more often in a position of power.

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Re: #MeToo

Postby WeatherWoman » Nov 4th, 2017, 8:25 am

http://www.cbc.ca/news/opinion/reportin ... -1.4387611

It seems that no matter what women do to deal with assault or harassment, it is wrong. If they don't speak out, they are criticized. If they speak out years after the fact — finally feeling brave enough to do so — they are asked what took so long. If they speak out online, they are said to be unethical and bullying.
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Re: #MeToo

Postby MAPearce » Nov 4th, 2017, 2:10 pm

Probably because victims are not reporting female perpetrators for their own reasons.or perhaps because males are more often in a position of power.


NO ....

It's because our society believes that men must "enjoy" the attention ... Because they are men ...

You are a FOOL if you think for a second that it's ok for men to say "me too" because of the abuse they suffered at the hands of a woman would be accepted by the masses ....

Most people , females being most of the most , still reject that a man can NOT like being objectified ...
I payed attention in High school....But not to what they were trying to teach me..

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Re: #MeToo

Postby Silverstarqueen » Nov 5th, 2017, 7:44 am

Probably because victims are not reporting female perpetrators for their own reasons.or perhaps because males are more often in a position of power.

MAPearce wrote:NO ....

It's because our society believes that men must "enjoy" the attention ... Because they are men ...

You are a FOOL if you think for a second that it's ok for men to say "me too" because of the abuse they suffered at the hands of a woman would be accepted by the masses ....

Most people , females being most of the most , still reject that a man can NOT like being objectified ...


I have not heard what you claim, that men (or boys) must "enjoy" being abused or sexually assaulted. Unless it came perhaps from an abuser, because it sounds just like the kind of excuse an abuser would use. "He (or she) really wanted it, all sexual activity was consensual... blah..blah."
I think the atmosphere is changing, has changed, a lot. People are now realizing that many boys and men have suffered abuse and it is just as traumatizing for them as anyone else. We have had big strong hockey players, grown up ex-alter boys, world class skaters, and now more recently those in the entertainment industry, explaining how painful their experience of abuse was, how it ruined their lives in many cases, or led to suicide or lifelong depression. Who could hear these stories and not begin to understand the magnitude and horror of the suffering?
Since females , most, have experienced some form of sexual harassment or assault at some point in their lives, you can bet they understand better than others, how devastating the experience is, and how it has affected them sometimes for the rest of their lives.
Are there still people (male and female) who "just don't get it" yet? Of course. They aren't really listening, or they don't believe those who are telling their stories. They make excuses for the perpetrator, like they can't control their hormones, or they can't seem to understand the rules of engagement with others, or the victim was dressed too attractively. Or Weinstein's looloo of an excuse "it was the 70's and 80's, things were different then". No they weren't, sexual assault and harassment were just as horrible then as they are now. The only difference is now people are beginning to understand the extent of it, how easily it was pulled off and covered up, and the devastation it can cause.The only difference now is that more abusers are being exposed, and people are more believing now when victims do come forward. A few abusers have been dragged into court, or had to make huge pay outs to shut people up, and more abusers have been publicly shamed (rare in the past).
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Re: #MeToo

Postby MAPearce » Nov 5th, 2017, 8:07 am

I have not heard what you claim, that men (or boys) must "enjoy" being abused or sexually assaulted. Unless it came perhaps from an abuser, because it sounds just like the kind of excuse an abuser would use. "He (or she) really wanted it, all sexual activity was consensual... blah..blah."


You're just not ready to listen , are you ? You've just made an excuse to deny that this abuse happens and vilify the victim with "it sounds just like an excuse an abuser would use " .. How nice . Would any man who's been a victim really open up to you ??

I wouldn't . You'd just say that I'm making excuses ..

My gut feel is that you'd rather embrace the victim mentality and trumpet a cause that you may have once in your life been guilty of just to float your own boat ...
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Re: #MeToo

Postby Osoyoos_Familyof4 » Nov 5th, 2017, 8:58 am

Men who are sexually harassed are no less victimized than any woman (full stop) and I don't believe that any poster on these forums disagrees. They ought to be reporting it when it happens, just like women. The reasons men don't report are varied and sometimes they don't report for the same reasons women have a hard time reporting.

It does not (or should not) minimize the seriousness of men's claims to state unequivocally that sexual harassment where women are the victims is a systemic problem of mind boggling magnitude. Men do not "in general" (this doesn't mean NEVER) have to endure the issue in the volume that women seem to encounter overall.

Woman have to start reporting, even if it means they lose a business opportunity or risk further scrutiny, this is the only way it will stop! We can support them by encouraging meaningful law enforcement and prosecution. I know why women don't report, I get it, but they still have to report, even if it's at a personal loss for the next woman's gain.

I realize what I'm going to say next isn't necessarily about sexual harassment, it's about sexual politics and the workplace in general, which in my opinion is really the precursor to the solution of sexual harassment. We need to start a conversation where we acknowledge that in the workplace, there are lots of sexual dynamics happening when there ought to be none. This includes straight-up sexual harassment, but also includes attractive people of both genders (but most often men) who will simply bend over backwards to further the career of someone they'd like to fcuk. I have witnessed more women in corporations who were brilliant get ignored or under utilized because they weren't considered "fcukable". Yes, I do realize I am being crude and simplistic, but I worked for a multi-million dollar international corporation for 15 years that had business with other major multi-million dollar corps and my experience is that "looks" matter, more then they ought not to. We need to stop objectifying and over-acknowledging beauty. The workplace simply doesn't need to be so concerned with beauty and sexuality and the false promotion and attention of the pretty. I have seen a lot of average looking men make it to the top, but you have a better chance of filling the captains chair of a business if your a woman if you happen to look good in a skirt and a pair of pumps. This doesn't mean that women CEO's got what they have because of their looks, but some of them did, or at least got a break and a foot in the door because of it. Human Resource departments need to be vigilant about who is getting promoted and why, and start rewarding who does well, not who looks good on the brochure. And of course, HR needs to take allegations seriously and not just deal with harassment by putting a sticky note in some predator's employee file.

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Re: #MeToo

Postby Silverstarqueen » Nov 5th, 2017, 10:08 am

I have not heard what you claim, that men (or boys) must "enjoy" being abused or sexually assaulted. Unless it came perhaps from an abuser, because it sounds just like the kind of excuse an abuser would use. "He (or she) really wanted it, all sexual activity was consensual... blah..blah."

MAPearce wrote:You're just not ready to listen , are you ? You've just made an excuse to deny that this abuse happens and vilify the victim with "it sounds just like an excuse an abuser would use " .. How nice . Would any man who's been a victim really open up to you ??

I wouldn't . You'd just say that I'm making excuses ..

My gut feel is that you'd rather embrace the victim mentality and trumpet a cause that you may have once in your life been guilty of just to float your own boat ...


Well I am not going to lie. I have not heard the claim that males (or any victim) must "enjoy" being abused except when it came from
abusers,as if it was some valid excuse for their behavior which it isn't(as quoted) so I am not going to lie about that.

I ,did not in any way deny that this abuse happens, and did not vilify any victims, I have great sympathy for them.
I would not expect just any man to open up to me, because few men open up to anyone, and I haven't had a close relationship with any man who claimed to be abused. If they did, I certainly wouldn't deny the abuse, and I would believe them. You can call that a victim mentality if it makes you feel better.
I don't know where your "gut feeling" is coming from, and I don't know what you are saying I am "guilty" of, but it certainly isn't of abusing anyone... and.. I don't have a boat.
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Re: #MeToo

Postby davis123 » Nov 6th, 2017, 9:00 am

TreeGuy wrote:https://www.castanet.net/edition/news-story-209650-35-.htm#209650

"And, we have hired six girls to sell beer in the crowd and the fans are liking that too."


Let me start by saying I don’t have an issue with this. I really just want to point out the irony. Men are expected to control themselves and keep their eyes to themselves, but then let’s put them to the test by getting girls in tight tees to sell them beer.


lol, really? The server in the pic is wearing a regular t-shirt, and you imply that men are put to the "test" because you consider it a 'tight tee'? How about you acknowledge she is a person, with thoughts, feelings, etc. She isn't a big old bag of breasts for you to satisfy your 'visual desires'. How you see this as her problem and not your own issue because you can't control yourself from staring at someone's breasts is absurd. Here's a solution for you...look up, see that face? Yep that's where you are supposed to look. Is that really so difficult?

I would understand if you're talking about hooters chicks but cmon this server is wearing like an Old Navy kind of tshirt.

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Re: #MeToo

Postby davis123 » Nov 6th, 2017, 9:40 am

Gixxer wrote:I dont think women can relate to what its like being a man because some women dont experience a real orgasm until they're in the their 30's. Men experience it when they first hit puberty, and when it does it consumes our minds.

What it really comes down to is self control, respecting others , and knowing right from wrong.

And yes I know Im going to catch alot of backlash for this.


Wouldn't you say it's likely a problem if it consumes your mind? Like an addiction consumes other people's minds. Women don't need to understand or relate to the fact that sex consumes your mind. We don't give a flying crap if it consumes your mind. That's YOUR problem, take it up with a counselor if it's an issue in your life. The reason your mind is consumed with sex is because you allow it and society has plastered sexuality in everything and made you believe that men have these massive sexual desires and they have to be visually stimulated everywhere they go. Guess what? Women ARE sexual as well, some are dirty pigs about it as well, but the vast majority are not. For you to think that men have this special unique sexual dilemma because they might orgasm earlier in life is just beyond ridiculous.

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Re: #MeToo

Postby dominik » Nov 7th, 2017, 7:41 am

You know... I had to rack my brain over this. I do believe #MeToo is inclusive of men, however we do see those kind of things differently when they happen to us. Double Standard definitely plays a role here.

I looked back to my teenage years and realized a litte surprised that I had something happen to me which I never really considered as an issue. Yet oddly enough I remember that in the moment I was extremely uncomfortable. Having an older woman slap my *bleep* with a verbal advance doesn't seem like an issue yet I remember seeing that person as one I trusted and felt comfortable with, and all of the sudden that was gone.

It is odd, I personally now don't see it as a big issue (I have grown older) however I do remember how it made me feel back then as if it was yesterday. I can't personally see it as abuse... Overstepping? Yes, but considering this, some of the things women encounter on a daily basis (and I always worry that I may have contributed either by saying something, doing something or worse not standing up for someone) far exceed this.

As men, it is too easy to ignore this reality or down play it because we don't "see/feel" it in our surroundings, however this does not mean it doesn't exist... similar to racism...

To all the women affected... I am sorry, I thought we as people had become better...

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