No climate change here folks, move along.

Social, economic and environmental issues in our ever-changing world.

No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Snman » Jan 12th, 2018, 6:46 pm

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Omnitheo » Jan 13th, 2018, 10:52 am

I don’t think you read the entire article. As it states climate change has made such events less common
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby TheBoss » Jan 13th, 2018, 11:19 am

Basically climate change or Accelerated climate change, what ever you want to call it. Is a misunderstood science, in part due to weather modeling and the ever changing world. Look at this recent dump of snow it was called for Wednesday/Thursday we didn't get it till Friday. They based it off of what they saw with weather satellites and computer modeling, due to some variances the computer modeling was off.

Until we are certain of all of the variables Climate science will be misjudged and shunned by those who are ignorant of science.

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Silverstarqueen » Jan 13th, 2018, 11:29 am

Long ago the high arctic was much warmer than now. Then it got much colder. Now it is warming again. That is climate change. RIght now our climate is roughly half way between the warmest and coldest of times.

http://www.vancouversun.com/illustratio ... story.html

A cold snap, or snow arriving a few weeks early or later than normal, is weather, not climate change.
Growing oranges in b.c. (without a hot house) would be a sign of climate change.
A snow storm in Florida, or Morocco is weather.

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Snman » Jan 13th, 2018, 1:17 pm

Actually Omnitheo, I did read the entire article. My point was simply that the 'recent cold snap was not a result of climate change'. It seems that you take everything way too serious. Lighten up a bit, you'll have more fun.
Last edited by Snman on Jan 13th, 2018, 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby GordonH » Jan 13th, 2018, 1:22 pm

Silverstarqueen wrote:Long ago the high arctic was much warmer than now. Then it got much colder. Now it is warming again. That is climate change. RIght now our climate is roughly half way between the warmest and coldest of times.

http://www.vancouversun.com/illustratio ... story.html

A cold snap, or snow arriving a few weeks early or later than normal, is weather, not climate change.
Growing oranges in b.c. (without a hot house) would be a sign of climate change.
A snow storm in Florida, or Morocco is weather.


This planet is either coming from an ice age or going towards one, it's been happening for millions++++ years.
If it's going away from one then it is getting hotter..... if it is heading towards one it is getting colder.
Pretty simple

Added: this whole planet is changing daily both weather & physical i.e tectonic plates are constantly moving
When you have to start compromising yourself and your morals for the people around you, it’s probably time to change the people around you.

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Walking Wounded » Jan 13th, 2018, 7:52 pm

GordonH wrote:
This planet is either coming from an ice age or going towards one, it's been happening for millions++++ years.
If it's going away from one then it is getting hotter..... if it is heading towards one it is getting colder.
Pretty simple

Added: this whole planet is changing daily both weather & physical i.e tectonic plates are constantly moving


And anyone that believes man can stop climate change is an idiot.
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Verum » Jan 13th, 2018, 8:08 pm

Walking Wounded wrote:
GordonH wrote:
This planet is either coming from an ice age or going towards one, it's been happening for millions++++ years.
If it's going away from one then it is getting hotter..... if it is heading towards one it is getting colder.
Pretty simple

Added: this whole planet is changing daily both weather & physical i.e tectonic plates are constantly moving


And anyone that believes man can stop climate change is an idiot.

True, but I would contend that with the overwhelming evidence and scientific consensus, it would take similar to deny that humans are causing significant and relatively rapid changes in climate too.
"Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience." Explains why so few people reply to me, and why I might not reply
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Queen K » Jan 13th, 2018, 9:51 pm

Could it be that a whole life can shift the day one starts telling the truth about what makes one happy?
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Omnitheo » Jan 14th, 2018, 1:35 am

GordonH wrote:
Silverstarqueen wrote:Long ago the high arctic was much warmer than now. Then it got much colder. Now it is warming again. That is climate change. RIght now our climate is roughly half way between the warmest and coldest of times.

http://www.vancouversun.com/illustratio ... story.html

A cold snap, or snow arriving a few weeks early or later than normal, is weather, not climate change.
Growing oranges in b.c. (without a hot house) would be a sign of climate change.
A snow storm in Florida, or Morocco is weather.


This planet is either coming from an ice age or going towards one, it's been happening for millions++++ years.
If it's going away from one then it is getting hotter..... if it is heading towards one it is getting colder.
Pretty simple

Added: this whole planet is changing daily both weather & physical i.e tectonic plates are constantly moving



Over and over and over you keep saying this but you’re not getting it. Going into and coming out of ice changes, these sorts of climate changes occur over tens of thousands of years. NOT DECADES. Seriously, of all our records, Geological evidence, ice core samples, computer models. Tree rings, animal remains, we have only ever seen climate changes occur at these rates during a few very specific mass extinction events. All the other changes you speak of are long and gradual. Enough that species have time to adapt, to evolve. When climate changes at rates like this. Plants and animals die at extremely high rates. We have billions of people depending on food grown in conditions we have had for the last few thousands of years. Now entire areas are infertile due to drought. Look at California, subject to intense droughts and wildfires. California alone provides the US with half it’s food. What happens when that food can’t be grown?

Please stop acting so smug, like you’re smarter than the scientists devoted their lives to researching and studying this. “Oh plate tectonics, Ice ages” you think our scientists are morons? That they don’t know how the the earth naturally changes? That is not what anyone here is talking about. Nobody is arguing against the natural cycles of the earth. We are talking about the massive changes to atmospheric composition we are producing, which also affects the oceans and the trapping of heat in both the oceans and atmosphere leading abnormally accelerated changes to the climate above the normal expected.
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Omnitheo » Jan 14th, 2018, 1:43 am

Walking Wounded wrote:
GordonH wrote:
This planet is either coming from an ice age or going towards one, it's been happening for millions++++ years.
If it's going away from one then it is getting hotter..... if it is heading towards one it is getting colder.
Pretty simple

Added: this whole planet is changing daily both weather & physical i.e tectonic plates are constantly moving


And anyone that believes man can stop climate change is an idiot.


We can stop doing what is leading to it. Imagine if this attitude existed 20 years ago. “Anyone who believes we can stop the ozone hole from growing is an idiot” thankfully we didn’t. We listened to the experts who understood the science. We changed how we did things. Life went on for us, and the ozone hole has mostly repaired itself.

A billion years ago, all it took was some bacteria producing oxygen to change the atmosphere enough to result in mass extinctions and climate change. We’re a little bit more efficient at changing the atmosphere than some single celled organisms
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Silverstarqueen » Jan 14th, 2018, 10:40 am

I don't recall anyone saying the scientists were stupid, morons etc. so not sure why that's being thrown out there.

However:

https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/04/06/ ... f-records/

https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/04/06/ ... f-records/

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/f ... california

Now a couple of years does not mean climate change, but it is a trend. Which who knows may or may not last.

California has had very dry periods in the past as well. Rainfall has been quite variable over the last century.

http://www.laalmanac.com/weather/we13.php

Has the earth warmed quickly before? yes, 15 C in a decade.

"After about 1,300 years of odd behavior, this interruption, called the Younger Dryas, ended. Earth resumed its warming course. One important study of Greenland ice cores showed that in a single decade of the Younger Dryas’s departure, temperatures over Greenland shot up about 15 degrees C. That’s as if your local climate changed to one typical of that 1,500 kilometers south of you in the geologic blink of an eye."

Extreme abrupt changes have happened in cooling and warming. "The first episode caused a jump in Greenland’s air temperatures of 10-15 degrees (C) in just a few decades beginning about 14,700 years ago. An apparent shutdown of the AMOC about 12,800 years ago caused an abrupt cooling of some 5-9 degrees (C), also over a matter of decades.

When the AMOC was reinvigorated again about 11,600 years ago, it caused a jump in temperatures of 8-, 11 degrees (C), which heralded the end of the ice age and the beginning of the climatically warm and stable Holocene period, which allowed human civilization to develop."

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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Jlabute » Jan 14th, 2018, 1:37 pm

Omnitheo wrote:
We can stop doing what is leading to it. Imagine if this attitude existed 20 years ago. “Anyone who believes we can stop the ozone hole from growing is an idiot” thankfully we didn’t. We listened to the experts who understood the science. We changed how we did things. Life went on for us, and the ozone hole has mostly repaired itself.

A billion years ago, all it took was some bacteria producing oxygen to change the atmosphere enough to result in mass extinctions and climate change. We’re a little bit more efficient at changing the atmosphere than some single celled organisms


Did we repair anything yet? Apparently natural variability has helped the ozone and down the road we will see real results in Antarctica’s ozone hole due to reductions in chlorine’s and bromines in the atmosphere. The scientists say 2070, but, cant rely on their models so we will see. O3 also reacts with H2O so weather conditions can cause ozone to vary.
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/11/04/earths-ozone-hole-shrinks-to-lowest-since-1988/comment-page-1/
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Re: No climate change here folks, move along.

Postby Snman » Jan 14th, 2018, 3:25 pm

https://www.castanet.net/news/Canada/21 ... her-coming

Can we include Madhav Khandekar as one of the smart guys? I think we have to consider that the debate is not yet over. There are many scientists who question the computer modeling and research. Due diligence would suggest we hear everyone out before we agree to massive global carbon taxation. I know looking green is great, but lets not look foolish at the same time. I have to wonder why scientists who question the science don't get any mainstream media coverage. Are they the stupid scientists?
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