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Daytime running lights, and no front plates

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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby dodgerdodge » Dec 9th, 2017, 4:04 pm

Dizzy1 wrote:As far as your WRX goes - didn't say you'd have a problem but it does effect performance ...

http://www.vwvortex.com/aftermarket-and ... orsepower/

... this is the very reason why cars such as the Golf R do not have factory equipped fog lights as they restrict the required airflow and it also highly recommends not to attach the a front plate to the front or side grills as it will decrease performance.


So manufacturers have to design their cars to suit, as per your fog light note above. I am pretty sure Subaru as well as many other high performance car manufacturers know only too well about air flow restrictions with turbo vehicles that they design, manufacture and sell to countries around the world of which some will have mandatory front plate requirements.
It is clearly not the problem you think it is otherwise we would see major changes in car design or no cars sold in countries requiring front plates.

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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Jflem1983 » Dec 9th, 2017, 4:30 pm

Front plates are silly. We should do like our neighbors and get rid of them. Who wants to bother with extra plates. It doesnt really do any practical good
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby my5cents » Dec 9th, 2017, 5:39 pm

Plan logic.

Number plate(s) are required on vehicles so they can be identified. Pretty simple, right ?

If you need to identify something, especially something that has the capability to move. Would it be better to have multiple pieces of identification or just one ?

From the ICBC web site, it doesn't quote Section 3.01 of the MVA Reg (which is the charging section for not having your front plate affixed), but it does indicate the fine for "Improper Display of plates" and "Illegible Plates" are both $230.

So to all you "front plates are silly, front plates don't do anything,,,,, etc"

Not having one may cost you. From a citizen of BC (if you're caught),,, Thank you for paying extra "taxes".

So a front plate does do something, it could save you $230.

http://www.icbc.com/driver-licensing/ti ... ences.aspx
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Mitch85 » Dec 9th, 2017, 7:23 pm

Even Steven wrote:
Mitch85 wrote:It’s a law for a reason


Yes, it's against the law (rolling eyes emoji here).

But it's between the offender and the police officer. Police wannabees and old people who do nothing but criticize everybody around for breaking the law need not to worry.


Police officers don’t create laws, they enforce them. There is nothing wrong about starting a dialogue about people who break laws. These laws create the foundation of our society. If people don’t want to follow it, maybe they should move somewhere where it isn’t illegal?

The ‘minding your own business’ mentality has not worked well for some countries.

If this law is outdated, there is a process to review it. Then, it may change. Until then, it’s required equipment.

Even Steven, we clearly disagree on this subject. Thanks for the insight on your views on this, and I hope you follow this up and try to get these laws changed! It may enlighten you as to why rules like this exist.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby GordonH » Dec 9th, 2017, 7:31 pm

Jflem1983 wrote:Front plates are silly. We should do like our neighbors and get rid of them. Who wants to bother with extra plates. It doesnt really do any practical good


Why not, gives those wanting to report bad/illegal driving practises a harder time to get the correct plate #.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Dizzy1 » Dec 9th, 2017, 10:59 pm

dodgerdodge wrote:
Dizzy1 wrote:As far as your WRX goes - didn't say you'd have a problem but it does effect performance ...

http://www.vwvortex.com/aftermarket-and ... orsepower/

... this is the very reason why cars such as the Golf R do not have factory equipped fog lights as they restrict the required airflow and it also highly recommends not to attach the a front plate to the front or side grills as it will decrease performance.


So manufacturers have to design their cars to suit, as per your fog light note above. I am pretty sure Subaru as well as many other high performance car manufacturers know only too well about air flow restrictions with turbo vehicles that they design, manufacture and sell to countries around the world of which some will have mandatory front plate requirements.
It is clearly not the problem you think it is otherwise we would see major changes in car design or no cars sold in countries requiring front plates.

I didn't say it was a problem, I simply disagree with the need of a front plate - its an outdated requirement that serves no purpose here.

As for the manufacturers go, of course they're aware that many places require front plates - but they're not legally required to design a car with an area to mount a front plate (as they are in the case of rear plates).
Last edited by Dizzy1 on Dec 9th, 2017, 11:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Dizzy1 » Dec 9th, 2017, 11:02 pm

Mitch85 wrote:If this law is outdated, there is a process to review it. Then, it may change. Until then, it’s required equipment.

Absolutely! Very well put statement.

I think its outdated. I think it should be reviewed and then go from there.

Me, personally - if we ever do drop the requirement or if I end up moving to an area that doesn't require a front plate - mine is coming off right away.

Even if we had the option of a sticky plate, that would be an improvement. Simply move it some where on the front bumper, no holes required and doesn't intrude with sensors.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby GordonH » Dec 10th, 2017, 6:42 am

Wow, it's amazing how a 6"x12" piece of aluminum can cause such a stir.
impo having front & rear plates gives everyone a better chance of identifying bad/illegal driving practices to the police i.e hit & run.... weaving/possible drinking driver etc.... etc
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby alanjh595 » Dec 10th, 2017, 6:45 am

Just like a friend, that had her car rear ended while it was parked and the other driver took off. The licence plate left an imprint on the bumper.

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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Bsuds » Dec 10th, 2017, 7:55 am

If you have a rear facing dashcam then being able to record a plate behind you is helpful in some situations as well.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby twofingers » Dec 10th, 2017, 12:05 pm

Leave it as it is! Now, when I see a vehicle approaching me without front plates, it’s probable that there’s a red and white ‘trainer plate’ affixed to the rear. Gives me a chance to get out of the way!

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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Dizzy1 » Dec 10th, 2017, 1:50 pm

GordonH wrote:Wow, it's amazing how a 6"x12" piece of aluminum can cause such a stir.
impo having front & rear plates gives everyone a better chance of identifying bad/illegal driving practices to the police i.e hit & run.... weaving/possible drinking driver etc.... etc
[
It's not causing a stir - just bringing out different views and opinions on the topic.
quote="alanjh595"]Just like a friend, that had her car rear ended while it was parked and the other driver took off. The licence plate left an imprint on the bumper.[/quote]
Bsuds wrote:If you have a rear facing dashcam then being able to record a plate behind you is helpful in some situations as well.

I will admit, those are two valid arguments in favour of front plates - even thou I remainl on the "nay" side ;)
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby dirtybiker » Dec 10th, 2017, 3:33 pm

Frankly, front plates are not a safety issue, just a compliance issue.

Whatever, nothing to lose sleep over.

Day time running lights though are a safety issue, whether that be not having any,
to having too many, poorly adjusted or modified.

This I do take issue with.
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby dodgerdodge » Dec 10th, 2017, 6:45 pm

Dizzy1 wrote:
I didn't say it was a problem, I simply disagree with the need of a front plate - its an outdated requirement that serves no purpose here.

As for the manufacturers go, of course they're aware that many places require front plates - but they're not legally required to design a car with an area to mount a front plate (as they are in the case of rear plates).


I have no idea about any legal requirement on manufacturers part but i would think it would be a poor decision on their part to design a car with no place for front plate as their market for potential sales would be a lot smaller. If for example VW designed ALL vehicles with no front plate provision they would not sell many cars in Europe which would be completely stupid. As far as i am aware (i could be wrong) ALL European countries require front and rear plates. Why then is this practice so outdated?
North America is a different thing and i really have no idea why for example BC has to have them but Alberta can work without them. Maybe someone has the answer
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Re: Daytime running lights, and no front plates

Postby Dizzy1 » Dec 10th, 2017, 9:03 pm

dodgerdodge wrote:
I have no idea about any legal requirement on manufacturers part but i would think it would be a poor decision on their part to design a car with no place for front plate as their market for potential sales would be a lot smaller. If for example VW designed ALL vehicles with no front plate provision they would not sell many cars in Europe which would be completely stupid. As far as i am aware (i could be wrong) ALL European countries require front and rear plates. Why then is this practice so outdated?
North America is a different thing and i really have no idea why for example BC has to have them but Alberta can work without them. Maybe someone has the answer

Keep in mind, Europlates are a good 2 inches narrower than ours - so that does make a difference for fitment on some cars.

My two cars for an example - on my BMW, the front plate can still be mounted centrally with no obstruction to the park assist sensors or engine airflow. My VW, our BC plates won't fit centre mount without either obstructing the airflow to the engine or if you mount it lower, obstructing the driver's assist sensor. When I picked the vehicle up, the dealer simply zap strapped the plate to the lower grill off to the right - which obstructed airflow to the intercooler. I ended up buying a tow hook adapter and have it placed off centre on the bumper - I haven't had any problems with the sensors yet, but I have read that some people have. If we had a euro plate format, the plate would fit fine on the front bumper mounted centrally

On the Mrs' TDI - we originally zap strapped the plate to the lower grill because we didn't want any holes drilled into the front bumper (personal choice) - but we eventually got a tow hook adapter for her car as well and noticed quite a difference in throttle response, especially in warmer temperatures when the lower grill opened up.
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