If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby neilsimon » Jul 29th, 2017, 7:30 pm

I find the assumption that hunters will be particularly against this a bit odd. I know plenty of hunters as it's really common up North. Trophy hunting seemed to be relatively rare as most who hunted did so for meat and quite a few of them viewed trophy hunting as hurting the image of hunting in general. Nearly all of them made sure that as much of the meat was used as possible.

Maybe hunting in and around the Okanagan is a little different.
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Queen K » Aug 14th, 2017, 3:29 pm

Bsuds wrote:I don't believe in trophy hunting. If you want to shoot something then do it with a camera!
Everybody wins, even the Grizzly.


Well break out your Nikons and Canons!

https://www.castanet.net/edition/news-s ... htm#204150

Bear meat hunting is still allowed. But if guides want revenues, they'll have to settle for taking people to see live bears, over and over, the same bear.

"There are an estimated 15,000 grizzly bears in B.C. Each year, about 250 are killed by hunters. While the trophy hunt will end, hunting for meat will still be legal.

In the fall, Donaldson said government will meet with First Nations and stakeholder groups to figure out next steps.

"The key elements of that strategy will include dedicated funding for wildlife and habitat conservation and a collaborative process in developing short- and long-term plans for wildlife resources," he said."
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Veovis » Aug 14th, 2017, 7:11 pm

Hunting for the meat and the purposes of responsible population management if just fine.

Killing one just to kill one for no other reason doesn't serve much point though.

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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Glacier » Aug 14th, 2017, 8:08 pm

If you kill caribou and moose, you have to kill wolves and bears eventually. If the numbers of bears get out of hand like the wolves have, hopefully they let hunters take care of business like they have with the wolves. If the numbers are low, leave them be.

As for the NDP's supposed ban, it's funny that they'd ban it in the "Great Bear Rainforest" as if bears are more endangered there. Don't they know that it's the BLACK bear that gives the forest its name!? The grizzly population is doing just fine there as far as I can tell, but you will not be allowed to shoot them even for food. Makes no sense.
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Queen K » Aug 15th, 2017, 7:01 am

https://www.piquenewsmagazine.com/whist ... id=3883192

Leaving space for Grizzly bears is an interesting article about not only saving them from trophy hunters but leaving their eco-systems intact for the future generations of bear.

I picked this out of the article as it's a long read as it is:

"In 2016 the province published the Scientific Review of Grizzly Bear Harvest Management System in British Columbia, a study compiled by Mark Boyce and Andrew Derocher from the University of Alberta as well as David Garshelis from the Minnesota Department of Natural Resources. Those experts conclude that "deteriorating habitat" is the biggest cause of declines, bringing a need for better population assessments. Although most of the population data in B.C. comes from habitat model estimates, the academic review examines a handful of southern units where more detailed information is available, thanks to DNA samples from grizzly hair left at baited sites, and bears who were monitored with collars.

Human-caused mortality has been excessive in the South Rockies at the bottom eastern part of the province, where grizzly populations declined by up to 50 per cent from 2006 to 2013.

"This unit has a number of outfitters and high demand by resident bear hunters," states the study, adding that "road and train-caused mortalities have been on the rise in recent years."

Directly south lies the Flathead, a grizzly unit that has benefitted from the best population monitoring since the late 1970s. Over the years, the number of grizzlies in this area has been closely tied to the availability of food.

"The density of hunter kills in this (grizzly bear population unit) is the highest in B.C. Despite this, the population doubled over a period of two decades, due to high reproductive rates driven by an abundance of food (huckleberries)," explains the study. "As the food supply diminished, the reproductive rate halved to the lowest known in North America, and the population declined precipitously. Continued monitoring of this population using DNA mark-recapture (2010-2014) indicated a population recovery."

THE POLITICS SURROUNDING THE TROPHY HUNT
Without a doubt, hunting is the most divisive issue concerning the future of grizzly bears in B.C. Despite numerous surveys from environmental organizations showing that most British Columbians oppose the hunt, the practice is permitted each spring in 65 per cent of the province, including in provincial parks.

Under the governance of the BC Liberals, the province has long defended the practise, citing over $7.3 million in hunting licences collected annually, plus another $2.25 million from surcharges that go towards the Habitat Conservation Trust Fund.

The current allowable harvest is calculated to be 572 grizzlies a year, or 3.8 per cent of the estimated population in B.C. But the province argues that hunters aren't coming close to killing this many grizzlies.

"While more than 3,000 authorizations are issued each year, on average only about 250 bears are taken by hunters," states the January release on bear management.

Despite the widespread unpopularity of hunting, certain experts believe that the permit system actually helps with grizzly management.

"The social and economic benefits derived from such use provides incentives for people to conserve them," says the International Union for the Conservation of Nature, as cited in the province's 2016 grizzly management study. "The grizzly bear hunt poses no conservation threat to populations, especially that it is heavily biased towards mature males."

Mikes believes that the real threat to grizzlies is encroachment onto their habitat from infrastructure and development.

"If the grizzly bear hunt was to end in B.C. tomorrow, the issues that the bears in the non-hunted, threatened population have would still exist," he says. "The grizzly bear hunt, fundamentally it's an ethical, moral choice that as a society we have to make."

This spring, politicians brought these ethics into the election campaign, particularly the NDP with its call to end the trophy hunt.

"B.C.'s grizzly bears are not trophies to hang on walls in Texas," states the party's official election platform.

But as the issue gained steam, confusion has grown over what exactly trophy hunting is and how a complete ban would affect the most respectful hunters. In the NDP's written response to questions from the BC Wildlife Federation, the party ensures that a ban wouldn't affect all grizzly hunting.

"This is not about being opposed to hunting," says the NDP. "B.C. hunters will continue to have the opportunity under the (limited entry hunting) system to harvest grizzly bear utilizing the entire bear."

But ensuring that the whole animal is used would require a significant funding boost to wildlife management in B.C.

"It comes down to one of the big problems we think there are with grizzly bear management in B.C., which is enforcement and managing of our laws and regulations," says Forbes.

DIFFERING POINTS OF VIEW
The hunting debate reveals a divide among British Columbians. The argument pits a rural lifestyle against distinctly urban values and opposing views around the real value of the grizzly harvest.

"(The Guide Outfitters of B.C.) appreciates that many people, especially those living in urban areas, have never been exposed to the vital role hunting plays in effective wildlife management," states the association's Grizzly bear Management Program. "Furthermore, we recognize that some people fail to see any value in hunting and dismiss it as irrelevant, an outdated and cruel anachronism in our modern world."

Forbes sees a greater value in the bear-viewing industry than continuing to permit hunters to use only part of a bear.

"They are not issuing licences for food," she says. "What we've heard from British Columbians is actually eating grizzly bears is an extremely rare thing to do. It's not a desirable meat, it's quite different than black bears, my understanding."

As the resident priority program manager with the B.C. Wildlife Federation, Jesse Zeman disagrees.

"From my personal experience grizzly bear meat is great," he says. "I have hunted them and have eaten them. There's really no difference between grizzly bear and black bear meat." He believes that the trophy-hunt debate distracts the public from greater conservation issues, citing challenges bears have had near settlements and roads in the Elk Valley part of the Kootenay region. A 2016 study shows a 40-per-cent drop in the valley's grizzly population over the previous eight years, with 68 per cent of deaths caused by non-hunting incidents, such as collisions with vehicles and trains.

"Whether we had grizzly bear hunting or not, we would have experienced a significant decline," observes Zeman. "When you carve up the landscape with trains and cars and people, you cut off corridors, you create islands of populations.

The Elk Valley runs through the eastern parts of two grizzly population units, the Flathead and the South Rockies. Despite the rapid decline in the valley's grizzlies, hunting permits are still being issued for these two population units, which are classified as "viable" by the province. There are even guide outfitting organizations based in the Elk Valley that list grizzly bears among the species they can assist non-resident hunters in tracking.

Zeman contends that hunters are among the strongest advocates for grizzly preservation initiatives.

"Conservation organizations that are being paid for by hunters' dollars are funding those projects," he says. "Oppositely, I don't think you see organizations that are funding the anti-hunting movement are funding those kinds of projects. There is a disconnect there."

LESSONS FROM DISTANT SHORES
Beyond B.C.'s mountains, vastly different approaches are being taken to manage bears and other large wildlife. Botswana banned all sport hunting in 2014, citing the value of wildlife to ecotourism, which has grown to contribute 12 per cent of the country's annual gross domestic product. Elsewhere in Africa, wild game hunting was outlawed with Kenya's ban in 1977 — but in the 40 years since, poaching has grown while the country's wildlife has declined by a disturbing 70 per cent.

Directly northwest of B.C., an estimated 30,000 grizzlies roam Alaska, where the state's authorities believe the animal's numbers are growing. This is more than the estimated total for all of Canada, enough for the Alaska Department of Fish and Game to now permit resident hunters to kill two grizzlies a year.

Off Alaska's southwest coast, healthy populations of a unique subspecies of the grizzly can be found on the islands of the Kodiak Archipelago. These bears are even larger than the grizzly, with males reaching up to 680 kg. Over 14,000 people live on Kodiak Island, but half of the archipelago is protected from development by being part of a wildlife refuge. Each year 4,500 people apply for 496 Kodiak bear permits. Every bear killed must be inspected by an Alaska Fish and Game biologist before being taken from the islands. Although the annual Kodiak harvest grew from 77 in 1969 to 173 in the early 2000s, the density of the bears is more than one per square kilometre.

For grizzly bears or any other large predator, a species cannot be sustained unless people stay far away, stresses Geist.

"The grizzly bear or the wolf do not belong in settled landscapes," he says. "Large carnivores can only be maintained in large areas of land that we dedicate to them."

THE FUTURE OF AN ICON
Although grizzly bears no longer dominate the West Coast like they did hundreds of years ago, the potential for fatal conflict with humans remains. From 1987 to 2016, six people in B.C. were killed by grizzlies, but during his numerous up-close encounters, Mikes has never been attacked.

"When the bear stands up on its back legs it's not to attack you, it's to look over the brush to figure out what you are," he says. "They're not out to get you... It's really part of the wild experience."

The grizzly is still California's official animal — despite being extinct in the state for nearly 100 years. Many fear that unchecked development will bring the same fate for B.C.'s grizzlies, thereby sacrificing part of the province's identity.

Zeman believes that the bear's future will rely on a focused combination of wildlife funding, accurate science and public support for conservation initiatives.

"What do we want this place to look like 50 years from now? Because if we have another 50 years like the last 50 years, none of us are going to like what it looks like," he says. "In the absence of objectives, we're failing fish and wildlife."

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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Glacier » Aug 15th, 2017, 1:01 pm

You know it amazes me how stupid the "save the grizzly bear" people are. Now the same tax payers that voted for the NDP to shut down grizzly hunting will be paying for the Conservation service to do the killing instead.

Smart move, BC will join the likes of California, Oregon, Washington and Colorado in the list of States and provinces that have taken predator management away from the sportsman and put it on the shoulders of Government.


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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby slootman » Aug 15th, 2017, 2:07 pm

Weaver was on the radio at lunch talking about this. He sure was bashing the NDP. It highlights how shady their 'alliance' is. Two parties that don't agree on issues should never be allowed to combine votes to overthrow the winning party.

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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Queen K » Aug 15th, 2017, 8:31 pm

Hunting for meat is still okay Glacier. :135:
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Queen K » Aug 18th, 2017, 3:24 am

http://www.theprovince.com/news/local+n ... story.html

<snip>........warning: highly disturbing photo at the beginning of the article

On Monday, the NDP government made good on a high-profile election promise by announcing a B.C.-wide ban on trophy hunting of grizzly bears, while allowing hunting to continue for meat outside the Great Bear Rainforest.

Trish Boyum, a coastal ecotourism operator and strong advocate of ending the grizzly trophy hunt, urged SCI to butt out of B.C.’s affairs.
“We in no way agree with Safari Club being involved in any decision making regarding wildlife in British Columbia,” she said. “This is what happens when we allow these kinds of people to have their way in our province.”

Boyum noted that she is associated with the Facebook page, Stop the Grizzly Killing, boasting 46,000 followers. She isn’t urging them to respond to The Sun’s poll, which she considers poorly worded and unscientific.

In March, environmentalists protested SCI donating $60,000 to the Guide Outfitters Association of B.C. within two months of the provincial election and only days before the start of the province’s controversial spring bear hunt.

<snip>

"While the grizzly trophy hunt will end, hunting for meat may continue outside the Great Bear Rainforest. The province will close “loopholes” by forbidding a meat hunter from possessing the paws, head and hide of a grizzly to ensure trophy hunts aren’t conducted under the guise of a meat hunt, Donaldson added."



One: Should foreign groups like SCI be allowed to interfere wiht or influence BC Govt policy?

Two: If nothing gets wasted in Nature, then meat hunting is strictly that, no keeping the fur, paws (claws?) or hide, one has to accept that leaving said items behind will not be wasted as far as Nature is concerned. Organisms will use the items not allowed to be taken out. How is this enforced anyways?
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Glacier » Aug 18th, 2017, 7:27 am

Queen K wrote:Hunting for meat is still okay Glacier. :135:

Yes, but not in the "great bear rainforest." It's a bit of a loophole because no one eats grizzly bear. Maybe some people will use the meat to feed their dogs.
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Re: If Elected, NDP will Ban the Grizzly Bear Hunt

Postby Queen K » Aug 18th, 2017, 10:45 am

http://www.huntingbc.ca/forum/showthrea ... ble-or-not

According to these guys: Coastal bear, ick. Which makes not hunting in the Great Bear Rainforest not such a big deal. Mountian Grizz is okay.

Will Outfitters change their marketing strategy to taking in photographers and nature buffs instead of shooters? That's what I want to know. Because presently the photo tours to see Grizz are extremely expensive.
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