The Joys of ICBC and their "knowledgeable" staff

[feebledolphin]

This topic is a little bit of a rant as well as hopefully some useful information and insight for people looking to purchase a vehicle out of province. It might even spark up some people who may be able to help me out or provide information on what to do and where to go. It's been 2.5 weeks and I "own" a vehicle that according to ICBC, has no owners with power over it. If you chose to read this whole page, keep track of the amount of phone calls made to our lovely Insurance Corporation of British Columbia and the amount of half wits and overpaid employees they have staffed.
I'll try to make this as short as possible. I purchased a 2005 Subaru from calgary on the 16th of november, had it provincially inspected and passed within the first 2 days after returning home. I purchased the required Binder of Insurance for coverage through ICBC of which I later found out was over charged for, as well as a transit permit from Alberta. I had all documentation for the vehicle, including alberta registration papers showing that I was the new purchaser of the vehicle but when I went to insure the car, all hell broke loose.
Since the vehicle was leased for the first 3 years of its life in Alberta (05-08), the leasing company (GMAC Lease co.) is still on the title of the vehicle. The vehicle has been paid out and lease free for the past 4 years, but in Alberta removing the leasing company off the title is not mandatory, no does it affect any other purchasers within AB, or so I've been told by multiple people. The person I purchased the vehicle off kept the right side of the registration for his records as well as to cancel insurance and take his name off the vehicle. After providing the insurance broker with the necessary inspection papers, bill of sale, and left side of registration it was discovered that nothing could be done since the leasing company is still on the record. Que the first phonecall to an ICBC employee from which I was told I need a separate Bill of Sale from the leasing company with a $0 value showing they no longer hold interested in the vehicle. I now have to contact the person I purchased the vehicle off of to contact the company and get such paperwork. Easy enough right?..... WRONG. Since the company hasn't held power or interest in the vehicle for the last 4 years, the only paperwork they can provide is a "Letter of Release" stating they no longer hold interest in the vehicle I've purchased. I receive said letter and provide to the insurance agency of my choice and "due to ICBC standards, a letter is not acceptable". Que second call to ICBC and mention what I have in hand and again am told that the only way around it is to either have a Bill of Sale from GMAC or to have the person I bought the car off go to the registry in AB and have GMAC released from the title. Luckily the person I bought the car off of is a very kind individual who is willing to go do so and pay the charge. But, since he no longer owns the car, has it insured, or has power over it, they cannot release GMAC off the title. Que 3rd call to ICBC and mention what has happened, and get transferred to a higher power individual who records all my information and says to me that the reason I'm having problems is that I don't have the right side of the Alberta registration. Should be as easy as contacting the person again and getting him to send me the right side of the registration that he needed to cancel his insurance and registration with. Again, not at all how it works. I receive the right side of the registration, taking it to the insurance agency thinking, "finally after 2 weeks and all the headaches I get to insure my car and be able to drive to work and not be late or rely on other people". Is anyone seeing a pattern being set up here? Well there is, I was yet again declined insurance due to the fact that GMAC is still on the title. Que 4th call to ICBC to be told that "you're the first person to have this problem it seems because I've never even heard of your situation", and that they'd have their superiors contact me within the next couple days. I was then asked by the same individual "which insurance company do you get insurance with", which I was dumbfounded by the question (guess why) and simply replied back with, "well since I live in British Columbia, who else other then ICBC would I be able to get insurance through?". The person on the other end went silent then replied with, "you're right, that was a silly question". These are the people who make good money working for the Government through ICBC yet can't seem to realize that the company they work for is the only auto insurance place in BC. Needless to say I called back for a 5th time in hopes to get someone who might be a little bit more knowledgeable and helpful and after explaining everything I've been through simply stated, "hmmm I don't know how to help you". At this point I got (excuse my french) really f$#@ing mad and called back yet again. This time after getting no where again and being told that their Supervisor would have to review my file and contact me again sometime next week, I had a thought come to my mind. "I have no insurance on the car, I hold all the papers and AB registration to the vehicle, yet according to ICBC no one owns the car". that all prompted me to ask about getting storage insurance since god knows how long this is going to take to get resolved and I don't want a car worth a fair chunk of coin to have something happen. So I then asked about getting some storage insurance and surprise surprise, No coverage can be purchased since the car isn't registered in BC, nor can any insurance be purchased from AB since I am not an AB resident nor hold the title of the car in my name. So here I am, 2.5 weeks after purchasing a car, having it BC inspected and multiple attempts at getting insured just sitting by my house, with no possible way of getting any protection on it AT ALL.

Any input or thoughts on what to do next would be much appreciated. I've been told by some friends to contact CHBC for a news story since we all love ICBC and they might be interested. any thoughts, feelings, or general feedback would be great.

[watchkat]

I feel for your frustration.

A bit off topic, but after splitting amicably with my ex and him buying me out of my share of the home, the bank gave approval for him to take over the mortgage (which was tenants in common- we each had separate shares). He renewed the mortgage and it was over a year later that I received a letter from the bank stating that I should make application and pay the charge to have my name removed from the mortgage.
Hmm??????? I never signed the mortgage renewal and they knew we had parted. They renewed "his" mortgage and yet I apparently was still on it? I ignored it and he sold the house three years later without my signature and so I wonder at the powers of lenders to not have to pay to release vehicles and loans from the registries when they are paid out.

I understand that after a period of time, the liens will expire and be removed automatically in the registries as "stale dated" when the original expiry date of the contracts pass and are not renewed for a specific time.

I was irate to think that the bank told me that it was up to me to make application to have the charge removed and I had to pay to do that. It was they that put it on and they should have to remove these when they are no longer in effect.
Lenders are lazy and the governments should be forcing them to clean up these immediately without back charging the client.

Perhaps this is the basis of your "expired GMAC lease contract".
I wonder if the FICOM - Financial Institutions Commission (Canada)
Alberta Treasury Branches (ATB Financial) - Contact Information

Contact your ATB Branch Manager or the Customer Contact Centre at 1-800-332-8383. Should you require additional assistance, contact the Manager of Service Excellence by telephone at 1-866-858-4175 or by fax at (780) 408-7276. You can also contact them via the ATB Financial website.

In the event that you remain dissatisfied with the outcome, you may call the Office of the Ombudsman for an independent review:

Edmonton at (780) 427-2756 or by fax at (780) 427-2759; or
Calgary at (403) 297-6185 or by fax at (403) 297-5121.

Back to Contact Index
Federal Banks, Loan, Trust and Insurance Companies - Contact Information

Contact the Office of the Superintendent of Financial Institutions.

[Bpeep]

And for the interim, go to any autoplan agent, (one that you havent dealt with re this) give them your vin, year, make, and model, and ask for a storage policy.
It doesnt have to be registered in BC to get a storage policy.

[watchkat]

Since we took the time to try and help you, it would be courteous to respond and perhaps update the problem.

[Ken7]

This is simply amazing!!

ICBC then wonders why people just drive without insurance on a stolen licence plate.

I'm amazed the letter did not work from GMAC, why it would not is beyond me. Maybe because the policy doesn't spell it out and no-one from ICBC wishes to put the neck out and make a decision by making the right call, proceeding with insurance.

Common sense is just not common!!

Hope to here the rest of this story!

[feebledolphin]

Hello again, yes sorry for no update yet. I have been busy with work and making more phone calls.
As it sits today, Monday December 3rd, I have spoken to 3 other people all of which have been as useless as the first few. I was told on thursday that a supervisor would be contacting me friday, which of course never happened. I called again today to find out my file hasn't even been looked at let alone reviewed by a supervisor as promised Thursday. So again here I am unable to get any sort of coverage or insurance to cover the vehicle and not even a permit to take it to a different insurance place through ICBC. I have yet to contact an out of province Business as mentioned by "watchkat" as I wanted to see what ICBC had to say themselves. If anyone knows of any brokers willing to drive to the west side to my house to take a look and see if the papers I have will indeed work, a number would be greatly appreciated. According to everyone I've discussed the matter with, they all say I have more then enough ammunition to have the vehicle plated with BC plates. Maybe I should just shop around with different Insurance places? Regardless, the whole ordeal has been very time consuming, stressful and without a doubt unnecessary.

[797hauler]

Hello again, yes sorry for no update yet. I have been busy with work and making more phone calls.
As it sits today, Monday December 3rd, I have spoken to 3 other people all of which have been as useless as the first few. I was told on thursday that a supervisor would be contacting me friday, which of course never happened. I called again today to find out my file hasn't even been looked at let alone reviewed by a supervisor as promised Thursday. So again here I am unable to get any sort of coverage or insurance to cover the vehicle and not even a permit to take it to a different insurance place through ICBC. I have yet to contact an out of province Business as mentioned by "watchkat" as I wanted to see what ICBC had to say themselves. If anyone knows of any brokers willing to drive to the west side to my house to take a look and see if the papers I have will indeed work, a number would be greatly appreciated. According to everyone I've discussed the matter with, they all say I have more then enough ammunition to have the vehicle plated with BC plates. Maybe I should just shop around with different Insurance places? Regardless, the whole ordeal has been very time consuming, stressful and without a doubt unnecessary.

As a person who has personally had a chance to change the way ICBC works I have a fellow within ICBC, (Pretty high up as a customer elations manager) very kind. Pm me for his name. And give him a try. no guaruntee but its worth a shot.

[watchkat]

Here is a thought............contact CTV Vancouver "Steele on your side"
Linda Steele takes these things to air and goes and gets the solutions. Worth sending the original email that you posted above to her along with the VIN number, and other identifying information.

http://bc.ctvnews.ca/about-us/team-bios ... e-1.873277


You might also add that Lenders are supposed to remove liens when the debt is cleared and it seems common for banks in BC to not remove them either as they don't like to pay for a service when the lien will eventually be stale dated on the titles of objects and so hopefully they won't get caught.

[feebledolphin]

Here is a thought............contact CTV Vancouver "Steele on your side"
Linda Steele takes these things to air and goes and gets the solutions. Worth sending the original email that you posted above to her along with the VIN number, and other identifying information.

http://bc.ctvnews.ca/about-us/team-bios ... e-1.873277


You might also add that Lenders are supposed to remove liens when the debt is cleared and it seems common for banks in BC to not remove them either as they don't like to pay for a service when the lien will eventually be stale dated on the titles of objects and so hopefully they won't get caught.

Thank you again! I will definitely check into this tomorrow and send off an email right away! It would be nice to get this out to a little bit of the public just to see how terrible ICBC truly is run.

[feebledolphin]

Well Thank you to everyone who posted on here and helped me out! I was finally able to insure the car after only 2 phonecalls to the AB registry. The people I talked to got me to fax in the papers I had and they were able to remove the leasing company off the title. Simple as that! 20 calls to ICBC got me nowhere. I was amazed at how kind the people at the AB registry were. They all gave me direct numbers or their extensions in case something didn't work out for me. How often do you hear of an ICBC employee doing that? Seems to me all they want is their paycheque while the AB employees actually seem to want to help you.

Thanks again,

Josh

[watchkat]

So glad it worked out for you. I have always found the Treasury Branch in Alberta very easy to deal with and seems things haven't changed.

Watchkat.

[checkm8]

There are many sides to the ICBC stories that circulate. Here is another.
I am a senior. 10 days ago I was involved in an accident in which a truck backed into my van. The driver of the truck, a young man, took immediate responsibility, going so far as to calling ICBC and admitting to them he was at fault. A true gentleman. (Helps to restore my faith in young people).
The three folks I had the pleasure of dealing with at ICBC, were nothing short of incredible-all of them. They bypassed the usual "phone in claims" since I have a hearing impairment, and dealt directly with the claim in their Kelowna claim centre.
In addition, to date, I received 3 follow up calls from the local office and one from Vancouver ICBC Head Office, making sure I was satisfied with the service. My van will be repaired by the end of this week.
I could not have asked for anything more from ICBC. This experience is my second. The first was an accident some 20 years ago.
The service from ICBC then , was as it was this time - perfect.
It is so easy to criticize - but when they do their job and do it well, we should show our appreciation more often.
WH/West Kelowna

[WAYSTAN]

After reading your tale of woe!! I am reminded of the song "There's a Hole in my Bucket Dear Liza, Dear Liza". What a mess ICBC put you through. I must say you undoubtedly have more patience that I would have displayed!

[waterwings]

Seriously, you got to talk to people and not into a voice message machine. I didn't think there were people in a work world that actually answer the phone.