Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

ToddT
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by ToddT »

It is just a line.
From a safety standpoint, or better, a common sense standpoint, if you are comfortable passing on the right through an intersection in any town, let alone a town full of seniors and tourists that don't know traffic laws to begin with, I do not care who is at fault, you are an idiot. To feel a sense of entitlement that supersedes your well being and livelihood also makes you an egomaniac.

That applies to drivers and cyclists.

Road rats is a very good term for these select few.
twobits
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by twobits »

ToddT wrote:It is just a line.
From a safety standpoint, or better, a common sense standpoint, if you are comfortable passing on the right through an intersection in any town, let alone a town full of seniors and tourists that don't know traffic laws to begin with, I do not care who is at fault, you are an idiot. To feel a sense of entitlement that supersedes your well being and livelihood also makes you an egomaniac.

That applies to drivers and cyclists.

Road rats is a very good term for these select few.


Dedicated bike lanes on City streets are a different kettle of fish as compared to riding out on the Hwy or secondary arterial roads without marked bike lanes. And given that a large percentage of the population obtained their drivers licence prior to bikes lanes coming into existence, it is hardly surprising there is so much confusion.
Everyone has seen the new green painted sections of bike lanes at intersections but few know what they are intended for. They are nothing more than a traffic alert sign to make drivers aware of a danger area. It is a danger area because the creation of dedicated bike lanes has essentially added a legal through traffic lane for bikes that vehicles must yield the right of way to. I suppose an analogy would be say travelling down Main st or Skaha Lk road where there are two lanes of traffic going the same direction. Now say you were travelling in the left (center) lane and realized you were coming up to an intersection where you wanted to make a right hand turn. You cannot legally make that turn from the center lane so you have to yield to the traffic in the left (curb) lane, letting it pass you until you can move over and make your right turn.
The bike lanes have created another legal lane allowing the traffic (bikes) to have the right of way passing on the right. In your accident example above, the driver of the vehicle will be deemed at fault for not yielding the right of way to the cyclist going straight thru the intersection.
And I won't even get into whether I think that is a good thing or not.
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
ToddT
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by ToddT »

It's still stupid TwoBits and you know it.
jamapple
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by jamapple »

ToddT wrote:So passing on the right is ok, as long as you are a cyclist? That seems like a double standard to me.




If you are a cyclist passing a vehicle on the right, there's something either wrong with that vehicle, or the person driving it. I must say, I've never been passed on the right by a cycle before.
Donald G
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by Donald G »

To jamapple ...

Passing a motor vehicle on the right while remaining in your DESIGNATED bike lane is completely legal. Passing a vehicle signaling a left hand turn on the right is also legal for a bicycle whether there is a marked bike lane or not. Passing a motor vehicle on the right when there is NO marked bike lane and only one shared motor vehicle/bike lane in each direction is NOT legal.
twobits
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by twobits »

ToddT wrote:It's still stupid TwoBits and you know it.


I sure do. But to be honest, I don't have as much a problem with the cyclists in bike lanes within the City. There are so few of them using that asphalt and the ones that are there, have a lane that for the most part does not impede my movement. Sure, we have to be a little more vigilant at intersections, but overall, it's nada for me. Are bike lanes worth the expense given their sparse use.....another thread topic.

My issue is the road rats on hwy's and major arterial routes were there are no bike lanes.

Kinda feel like a taxpayer with a stupid hat on for spending thousands and thousands on creating safe bike lanes that between the Channel path, Skaha park, South Main to gov't, Lakeshore drive providing a safe travel route virtually around the entire City yet they prefer to use the roads that have no damn bike lanes! And if they want to challenge grades, turn right on Carmi at Gov't St, ride that to the top, and come down Duncan back to Gov't St. All within the safety of a dedicated lane for them.
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
Donald G
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by Donald G »

To twobits ...

It could be worse. It used to be runaway horses and "motor cars".

As in it was illegal to gallop a horse furiously across a bridge.
jamapple
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by jamapple »

Donald G wrote:To jamapple ...

Passing a motor vehicle on the right while remaining in your DESIGNATED bike lane is completely legal. Passing a vehicle signaling a left hand turn on the right is also legal for a bicycle whether there is a marked bike lane or not. Passing a motor vehicle on the right when there is NO marked bike lane and only one shared motor vehicle/bike lane in each direction is NOT legal.



Totally get that, as I have stated earlier. They are always to your right if they are in a designated bike lane. I just see a funny scenerio of a car being passed by a bicycle on the right side of the road, that's all. Got a little visual there, that's all.
twobits
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by twobits »

Donald G wrote:To twobits ...

It could be worse. It used to be runaway horses and "motor cars".

As in it was illegal to gallop a horse furiously across a bridge.


Whoa there buddy. You are seriously dating yourself. My only experience with road apples is their benefit in the garden lol.
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
twobits
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by twobits »

jamapple wrote:


Totally get that, as I have stated earlier. They are always to your right if they are in a designated bike lane. I just see a funny scenerio of a car being passed by a bicycle on the right side of the road, that's all. Got a little visual there, that's all.


That is a visual that is common in Vancouver now with physical barrier divided bike lanes. Given our population and demographic considerations, it will be our great great grandchildren that will finally cause anyone in Penticton to worry about traffic congestion that would make bikes passing vehicles a reality.
Do not argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

The problem with the gene pool is that there is no lifeguard.
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cv23
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by cv23 »

Just watching the Tour de France on TV.
Worldwide coverage of one the greatest sporting events in the world. Tens, if not hundreds of thousands of people lining closed off roads cheering on top athletes from around the world in their OMG spandex uniforms. The leader/world champion even gets to wear the prestigious gold spandex jersey.
What a difference in culture between one of the worlds oldest and most developed cultures and that of backwoods rural Canada specifically the Southern Okanagan, que banjos. Throngs of people and press from all of the world celebrating the performance of world class athletes while here in hillbilly heaven people are so ignorant they think these world class athletes are a form of vermin to be exterminated. A whole country not only willing to share the roadways of its entire country with these athletes while they race over several weeks but also during the entire rest of the year while they train.
Clearly it is the closed minds of a few ignorant hillbillies suggesting that our athletes be banned from their training areas which keeps Canada from producing more world class cycling athletes. As a country Canada has produced top flight athletes in a wide and diverse variety of sports and we should feel proud of all our athletes and their endeavors not refer to them as vermin and rats as has been done here. It is the very type of ignorant back woods hillbilly attitude towards cyclists clearly shown in this thread that has resulted in there being only one Canadian out of over 200 competitors in the highest level of cycling in the world. Even America, Happy 4th to you all, has dozens of world class cyclists competing in this the highest level of cycling in the world and viewed by millions around the globe. Good on you Victoria for having the understanding and tolerance to allow a world class talent to train, grow and flourish in your community. Hopefully one day some of the outspoken inbred members of this community will mature enough to not only tolerate but maybe even help encourage some of our local athletes to aspire and reach this pinacle of athletic competion taking place on the world's stage
jamapple
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by jamapple »

Bang on CV!! Great post.....and love the banjo part, but when in red neck coutry, I always say!
You are so correct, but also wanted to add, these aren't all professional riders, they are people with things to prove, and not to you or I, but to themselves.
So, something no one on here has known about me is that I once trained for an Ironman race. It isn't anything I would ever think of doing again at this stage, but I needed to prove that I could do it, so I did.
Running and swimming were very safe to do in training, but cycling was a whole other story. For the most part, I have to say people were good, some exceptional. But, I too have seen some of these people on here calling cyclists vermin and rats. I in fact had my bike laid out by one such person on eastside Road. No one around, just thought it may be funny to see how close he could get his mirror to me, and he didn't measure too well, and, I guess you know who lost that one. Never even stopped to see if I was OK or anything, so, I see your passion CV.
I rode my bike to work every day all summer, from Penticton to Oliver and back, and loved it. The time alone is something only cyclists would understand.
I have also seen cyclists go side by side, etc, so I know it isn't a one way street. I just know we HAVE to share the roads we have, as some of these "vermins" are people with a dream much bigger than alot of us will ever dream.
Stay safe, and please, share the road.
Ekalahaks
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by Ekalahaks »

Why can't our species communicate differences of opinion without all the name calling? This may be off topic a little but I think it merits a short pause to reflect on just how distracting and unhelpful all the characterizations of one another as "Rats", "Vermin", "Hillbillies", "Inbred", etc really are.

There is no denying that people can hold passionate views for and against ANY topic, and I suppose there are many that think this kind of thing is "harmless banter" that should be acceptable within the forum (you know, "freedom of speech" and all)... But when you get to the core of it, there just seems to be this growing need to tear each other down (I am speaking about tearing down the "person", not the point that person is making or representing). Is it done so that the aggressive name-calling poster can feel justified about their post and their own beliefs? Is it so their comments can be "boosted" somehow in importance to others and themselves? I don't know, I just find it hard to acknowledge and respect the real reason they post (which is usually found somewhere between all the disrespectful and sometimes hurtful personal generalizations).

It seems the bigger and more profound the name calling and negative categorization of people who hold different opinions and beliefs become, the more the actual topic gets sidetracked, which, is what I am doing by acknowledging it sadly.

I think both sides in this particular topic have very valid points... I can relate to both sides when they make realistic and valid points and even when I disagree with some. Should the topic have started with a less caustic title? I think so, but then again, we tend to be conditioned by our surroundings to seek out controversy and immediately react to it emotionally... instead of responding to it respectfully and with some forethought. So this topic was doomed from the beginning to devolve into a name calling match - 10 pages of replies in and the unnecessary personal attacks and generalizations continue.

There will always be a rationale in someone's mind as to why things need to get escalated into name calling and other mean-spirited barbs. I guess I would just prefer a lot less of the side show and more about the root of the reason people want to discuss these topics. I can also happily live in the minority as I am sure my opinion will be met with many opposing thoughts... it will be interesting to see if they need to escalate to name calling to accomplish that.
lowrenzo
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by lowrenzo »

Ekalahaks wrote:Why can't our species communicate differences of opinion without all the name calling? This may be off topic a little but I think it merits a short pause to reflect on just how distracting and unhelpful all the characterizations of one another as "Rats", "Vermin", "Hillbillies", "Inbred", etc really are.

There is no denying that people can hold passionate views for and against ANY topic, and I suppose there are many that think this kind of thing is "harmless banter" that should be acceptable within the forum (you know, "freedom of speech" and all)... But when you get to the core of it, there just seems to be this growing need to tear each other down (I am speaking about tearing down the "person", not the point that person is making or representing). Is it done so that the aggressive name-calling poster can feel justified about their post and their own beliefs? Is it so their comments can be "boosted" somehow in importance to others and themselves? I don't know, I just find it hard to acknowledge and respect the real reason they post (which is usually found somewhere between all the disrespectful and sometimes hurtful personal generalizations).

It seems the bigger and more profound the name calling and negative categorization of people who hold different opinions and beliefs become, the more the actual topic gets sidetracked, which, is what I am doing by acknowledging it sadly.

I think both sides in this particular topic have very valid points... I can relate to both sides when they make realistic and valid points and even when I disagree with some. Should the topic have started with a less caustic title? I think so, but then again, we tend to be conditioned by our surroundings to seek out controversy and immediately react to it emotionally... instead of responding to it respectfully and with some forethought. So this topic was doomed from the beginning to devolve into a name calling match - 10 pages of replies in and the unnecessary personal attacks and generalizations continue.

There will always be a rationale in someone's mind as to why things need to get escalated into name calling and other mean-spirited barbs. I guess I would just prefer a lot less of the side show and more about the root of the reason people want to discuss these topics. I can also happily live in the minority as I am sure my opinion will be met with many opposing thoughts... it will be interesting to see if they need to escalate to name calling to accomplish that.





Great post. Those who have to use loaded terms like vermin, hillbilly and spandex vermin lose all their credibility, even if they have valid points. I ride my road bike around Penticton. I follow most of the rules. I don't impede traffic. I wear spandex for comfort, not to make a statement. I wear coloured jerseys to be easily seen by others. Perhaps you don't notice me and the other 98% of bikers who do not affect traffic.

I do appreciate the 98% of drivers who respect my right to use the road too. Share the road, please.
southy
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Re: Road Rats in South OK and Similk.

Post by southy »

Thank for the post Lowrenzo .. see you are new here. Curious, where did you get a figure of 98%? I do share the road and try very hard to be nonreactive to whatever the real percentage of cyclists is who ruin it for a small minority. One does not have to drive very far to experience bad cyclist attitude. Unfortunate but true. Before the flood gates open -- yes, I agree you can say the same about bad drivers in our area as well. So what is the answer?

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