Predictions

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Jmfva
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Re: Predictions

Post by Jmfva »

The Green Barbarian wrote:
Ranger66 wrote:
“Singh, who anticipates working more closely with the Liberals in the upcoming Parliament, says he plans to push for a proportional representation system, which would have given his party more seats based on its 16 per cent slice of the popular vote.”

Wrong again!


I don't think I was really "wrong again", firstly because Singh is a communist, not a Leftist, and also, I believe that I meant that not one Leftist on Castanet would say they wanted proportional representation. I honestly don't remember posting that, or what I was thinking at the time. I was too busy getting hammered, as once again Canada pulled a major league *bleep* and we are now stuck with our idiot in chief JT.

Also - to be wrong "again", I'd have to be wrong a first time. Not sure I can recall that ever actually happening, but it probably has somewhere.


The Green Barbarian wrote:Conservatives win the popular vote.

Prediction:

Not one Leftist demands that Canada go to proportional representation. Of course not.


Electoral reform should happen.
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Omnitheo
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Re: Predictions

Post by Omnitheo »

The Green Barbarian wrote:
Ranger66 wrote:
“Singh, who anticipates working more closely with the Liberals in the upcoming Parliament, says he plans to push for a proportional representation system, which would have given his party more seats based on its 16 per cent slice of the popular vote.”

Wrong again!


I don't think I was really "wrong again", firstly because Singh is a communist, not a Leftist, and also, I believe that I meant that not one Leftist on Castanet would say they wanted proportional representation. I honestly don't remember posting that, or what I was thinking at the time. I was too busy getting hammered, as once again Canada pulled a major league *bleep* and we are now stuck with our idiot in chief JT.

Also - to be wrong "again", I'd have to be wrong a first time. Not sure I can recall that ever actually happening, but it probably has somewhere.


Looking back at your posts in just this thread...let’s see..

Yes it will be interesting on Oct 22nd when the Conservatives are able to get into the books


First sentence of first post...well that didn’t take long.
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rustled
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Re: Predictions

Post by rustled »

I predict parties who cannot win a majority under the current system will always want electoral reform because they want more power than they are able to get under the current system.

What all of us want is the best governance possible.

I predict people who want electoral reform will only support a different system it if it improves their preferred party's chances. That is not the same as providing better governance. I predict most proponents of electoral reform will not be able to explain how their preferred system would result in better governance for Canada, only that they believe it would give more power to the party they currently support.
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Jmfva
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Re: Predictions

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rustled wrote:I predict parties who cannot win a majority under the current system will always want electoral reform because they want more power than they are able to get under the current system.

What all of us want is the best governance possible.

I predict people who want electoral reform will only support a different system it if it improves their preferred party's chances. That is not the same as providing better governance. I predict most proponents of electoral reform will not be able to explain how their preferred system would result in better governance for Canada, only that they believe it would give more power to the party they currently support.


would just be nice to vote without feeling like it's being thrown away. I think that is why we see a lot of voter apathy. What is the point?
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Predictions

Post by The Green Barbarian »

Omnitheo wrote:
First sentence of first post...well that didn’t take long.


That didn't take long for what? What the hell are you babbling about now? Actually, I really don't care.
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Predictions

Post by The Green Barbarian »

Jmfva wrote:
Electoral reform should happen.


In what way? I predict that you will say whatever way best helps the Greens and NDP.
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Re: Predictions

Post by rustled »

Jmfva wrote:
rustled wrote:I predict parties who cannot win a majority under the current system will always want electoral reform because they want more power than they are able to get under the current system.

What all of us want is the best governance possible.

I predict people who want electoral reform will only support a different system it if it improves their preferred party's chances. That is not the same as providing better governance. I predict most proponents of electoral reform will not be able to explain how their preferred system would result in better governance for Canada, only that they believe it would give more power to the party they currently support.


would just be nice to vote without feeling like it's being thrown away. I think that is why we see a lot of voter apathy. What is the point?

I've never really understood this. How is it "thrown away"? Because your party didn't win? I've often voted for the party that didn't win (or in a municipal election for a councillor or trustee who didn't win) and I've never once felt my vote was therefore "thrown away".

What does the term mean to you?
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Predictions

Post by The Green Barbarian »

rustled wrote:I've never really understood this. How is it "thrown away"? Because your party didn't win? I've often voted for the party that didn't win (or in a municipal election for a councillor or trustee who didn't win) and I've never once felt my vote was therefore "thrown away".

What does the term mean to you?


Yes Rustled. In today's young generation, where they are celebrated and cheered for everything they do, there is an assumption that if they vote, then that party they vote for must win. They aren't getting the pay-off for their effort then the effort was just plain meaningless, and so therefore wasted. Must have pay-off, or not worth doing. That's what people are like now.
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Glacier
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Re: Predictions

Post by Glacier »

Using Jmfva logic, he/she should never vote again at least at the Federal level) because a single vote never makes a difference, especially when you have proportional representation.
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Jmfva
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Re: Predictions

Post by Jmfva »

rustled wrote:I've never really understood this. How is it "thrown away"? Because your party didn't win? I've often voted for the party that didn't win (or in a municipal election for a councillor or trustee who didn't win) and I've never once felt my vote was therefore "thrown away".

What does the term mean to you?


I support the idea of electoral reform, that everyone's vote goes towards the party that best represents their political beliefs. There is no doubt in my mind that many voters don't bother because its a two party riding where they live or they have to vote strategically vs a vote for who they are best aligned with. It adds a lot of noise to the whole system.
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Jmfva
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Re: Predictions

Post by Jmfva »

Glacier wrote:Using Jmfva logic, he/she should never vote again at least at the Federal level) because a single vote never makes a difference, especially when you have proportional representation.


where did I say that? votes make a difference, but you can't always vote for who you really want to when you are forced to vote strategically. voting for the least crappy option isn't much choice.
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Re: Predictions

Post by Ranger66 »

"Oh right - prediction - I am going to say that the Conservatives are going to fall about five seats short of a majority"
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rustled
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Re: Predictions

Post by rustled »

Jmfva wrote:
rustled wrote:I've never really understood this. How is it "thrown away"? Because your party didn't win? I've often voted for the party that didn't win (or in a municipal election for a councillor or trustee who didn't win) and I've never once felt my vote was therefore "thrown away".

What does the term mean to you?


I support the idea of electoral reform, that everyone's vote goes towards the party that best represents their political beliefs. There is no doubt in my mind that many voters don't bother because its a two party riding where they live or they have to vote strategically vs a vote for who they are best aligned with. It adds a lot of noise to the whole system.

Thanks for your response. It seems to me we'd have more noise, not less, and either end up with the same results or worse governance.

But rather than take this thread entirely off topic, I'll leave it that.
:topic:

I predict people posting here are going to have a difficult time modelling the cooperative behaviour they say they want to see in our new government.
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The Green Barbarian
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Re: Predictions

Post by The Green Barbarian »

Ranger66 wrote:"Oh right - prediction - I am going to say that the Conservatives are going to fall about five seats short of a majority"


You do know that the election was yesterday right? Seems kind of silly unless you are posting predictions for the election in 2021.
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Glacier
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Re: Predictions

Post by Glacier »

Jmfva wrote:where did I say that? votes make a difference, but you can't always vote for who you really want to when you are forced to vote strategically. voting for the least crappy option isn't much choice.

You said: "would just be nice to vote without feeling like it's being thrown away. I think that is why we see a lot of voter apathy. What is the point?"

Here is a secret for you. One of the most liberating facts is that your vote doesn't actually make a difference. Once you realize this you have no pressure and feel no guilt no matter who you vote for.

At the federal level when your vote is worth 1/ 60,000th you know that your vote will never be the deciding vote. Therefore, no matter how you vote you will not make a difference. Under proportional representation your vote has even lower odds of making a difference.

There is no logical reason whatsoever to ever vote strategically. That is unless you believe in some sort of funky quantum physics where how you vote will magically simultaneously change how thousands of other people voted.
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