Divided country

rustled
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Re: Divided country

Post by rustled »


Seems to me Kenney doesn't believe separation is best for Alberta. He says he believes a stronger confederacy is a better goal, and I think he's sincere in that.

Kenney also very clearly understands who is behind the alarmist push to keep Alberta's oil in the ground. These same alarmists are funding all three of our so-called progressive parties.

Will these parties stand up for Canadian interests? Trudeau failed to do so, and now he's beholden to the NDP and the Greens, who are beholden to Tides, WWF, etc.

The parties must work together to sort this out. If they bow to the alarmists, we're hooped.
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the truth
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Re: Divided country

Post by the truth »

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2x4eyes
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Re: Divided country

Post by 2x4eyes »

All this 'infighting' between the provinces is nothing short of ridiculous...It's worse than being in a schoolyard because these people are supposed to be 'adults' in a democratic society.

I am so tired of hearing all this talk, I'm beginning to think if provinces want to separate from Canada, let them...Don't give them any federal money or assistance for anything and let them have to shell out their own money for whatever it is they want/need...Then we can watch them squirm when they can't afford to keep their province afloat...
rustled
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Re: Divided country

Post by rustled »

2x4eyes wrote:All this 'infighting' between the provinces is nothing short of ridiculous...It's worse than being in a schoolyard because these people are supposed to be 'adults' in a democratic society.

I am so tired of hearing all this talk, I'm beginning to think if provinces want to separate from Canada, let them...Don't give them any federal money or assistance for anything and let them have to shell out their own money for whatever it is they want/need...Then we can watch them squirm when they can't afford to keep their province afloat...


As is often the case, this infighting is a direct result of being dismissed and ignored while trying to be heard and have their concerns considered and their needs addressed.

We need far better diplomacy and engagement from our leader than what we saw during his last term.
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Re: Divided country

Post by Sparki55 »

2x4eyes wrote:All this 'infighting' between the provinces is nothing short of ridiculous...It's worse than being in a schoolyard because these people are supposed to be 'adults' in a democratic society.

I am so tired of hearing all this talk, I'm beginning to think if provinces want to separate from Canada, let them...Don't give them any federal money or assistance for anything and let them have to shell out their own money for whatever it is they want/need...Then we can watch them squirm when they can't afford to keep their province afloat...


Lol, we'd have the pipeline built in a year and be swimming in oil money.
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Re: Divided country

Post by 2x4eyes »

They all need to brush up on their conflict resolution skills then because all I'm seeing is adults behaving like children...lol

If an individual/group can't get what they want, do they hurl insults and such at others in the hopes of maybe getting what they want in the future?

This is what is wrong with some people/political parties/provinces nowadays - the sense that they beleive that they are 'entitled' to whatever it is they want...
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Re: Divided country

Post by JLives »

rustled wrote:As is often the case, this infighting is a direct result of being dismissed and ignored while trying to be heard and have their concerns considered and their needs addressed.

We need far better diplomacy and engagement from our leader than what we saw during his last term.


Then they need to communicate that better or, even better, get involved in our government. We can't run away from our problems, we need to actually deal with them. It's a big country with a wide range of people in it, we just have to learn to work together and understand not everyone's going to be happy about every decision that is made. Trudeau IS trying but it's hard to have discussions about what the serious issues are when so many people whine and *bleep* about every insignificant thing or whatever they saw in a meme.
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Re: Divided country

Post by Sparki55 »

2x4eyes wrote:If an individual/group can't get what they want, do they hurl insults and such at others in the hopes of maybe getting what they want in the future?


What is the alternative? Ask for what they want for decades and keep being ignored?
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Re: Divided country

Post by Omnitheo »

JLives wrote:
rustled wrote:As is often the case, this infighting is a direct result of being dismissed and ignored while trying to be heard and have their concerns considered and their needs addressed.

We need far better diplomacy and engagement from our leader than what we saw during his last term.


Then they need to communicate that better or, even better, get involved in our government. We can't run away from our problems, we need to actually deal with them. It's a big country with a wide range of people in it, we just have to learn to work together and understand not everyone's going to be happy about every decision that is made. Trudeau IS trying but it's hard to have discussions about what the serious issues are when so many people whine and *bleep* about every insignificant thing or whatever they saw in a meme.


In the end, despite concessions made to Alberta, despite pipelines and projects from the federal government, despite the dedicated work of people like Fuhr and Goodale, the west turned their backs on the liberals. And the Liberals won without them. They voted against those who represented their interests on the national stage in the ruling party, and have relegated themselves to sitting across the aisle crying to a party who no longer has any need to entertain them.

At this point, the federal government doesn't have any incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Rural BC, Kelowna etc. They will focus on what is best for Canada as a whole.

Maybe one day the conservatives will rethink their strategy and diversify to gain support from more than just western seperatists, farmers, and wealthy elites. but until then, Conservative support is just going to stay in conservative strongholds, and find itself in a dwindling demographic.
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Re: Divided country

Post by crookedmember »

Let's keep in mind it wasn't Justin Trudeau and the Liberal party that worked so hard to divide Canada.


Andrew Scheer, the Conservative Party, Harper, Larry, Curly & Moe, Presto! Manning, American-owned Post Media and the Russia-backed Canada Proud did.

Division was the sum total of their election strategy.

It just backfired on them, that's all.
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Re: Divided country

Post by Jlabute »

Yeah, the BQ seat count was up there. Maybe in reaction to a possible energy corridor benefiting all of Canada, and Quebec responded by saying keep your stinking fingers off Canada. That's the attitude of division. Nuttin' but a bunch a little trrds from Quebec.

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/bloc-leader-says-tories-shown-160143588.html
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Re: Divided country

Post by The Green Barbarian »

crookedmember wrote:Let's keep in mind it wasn't Justin Trudeau and the Liberal party that worked so hard to divide Canada.

.


Yes actually, it was Justin Trudeau and the Liberal party. Big time. Why even try and deny it? It just looks sad.
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Re: Divided country

Post by Jonrox »

Omnitheo wrote:At this point, the federal government doesn't have any incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Rural BC, Kelowna etc. They will focus on what is best for Canada as a whole.

Omnitheo, I agree with a whole lot of the things you say but I strongly, strongly disagree with this statement. This statement is exactly what's wrong with politics these days.

Although Conservative voters didn't vote for PM Trudeau he is still their PM, is still their leader, and is responsible for their well-being. He's not just the leader and PM for Liberal voters. He has a responsibility to look out for the best interests of all Canadians. His incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Kelowna etc... is that he's the Prime Minister and is responsible and accountable to all of us. It comes with the job.

At the same time, I believe all Canadians who voted for parties other than the Liberals also need to support PM Trudeau as the leader of the country. However, support does not mean "follow blindly" and comes in different forms. Support includes constructive criticism and pushing him to be a better leader.

To say he doesn't have an incentive to do what's best for all Canadians is the sort of divisive politics and rhetoric that has no place in our country. We aren't the United States.
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Re: Divided country

Post by Jmfva »

Jonrox wrote:
Omnitheo wrote:At this point, the federal government doesn't have any incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Rural BC, Kelowna etc. They will focus on what is best for Canada as a whole.

Omnitheo, I agree with a whole lot of the things you say but I strongly, strongly disagree with this statement. This statement is exactly what's wrong with politics these days.

Although Conservative voters didn't vote for PM Trudeau he is still their PM, is still their leader, and is responsible for their well-being. He's not just the leader and PM for Liberal voters. He has a responsibility to look out for the best interests of all Canadians. His incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Kelowna etc... is that he's the Prime Minister and is responsible and accountable to all of us. It comes with the job.

At the same time, I believe all Canadians who voted for parties other than the Liberals also need to support PM Trudeau as the leader of the country. However, support does not mean "follow blindly" and comes in different forms. Support includes constructive criticism and pushing him to be a better leader.

To say he doesn't have an incentive to do what's best for all Canadians is the sort of divisive politics and rhetoric that has no place in our country. We aren't the United States.


Agreed, he definitely is responsible and accountable for all canadians. It is sad however that no matter how much he does or betters the lives of the people in those areas the hatred will always be so strong in many that they will never support him. He could put in as many pipelines as they want and he will still be "Mr.dressup/ drama teacher". All we can do is hope that changes and the division is mended.
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Re: Divided country

Post by rustled »

Jmfva wrote:
Jonrox wrote:Omnitheo, I agree with a whole lot of the things you say but I strongly, strongly disagree with this statement. This statement is exactly what's wrong with politics these days.

Although Conservative voters didn't vote for PM Trudeau he is still their PM, is still their leader, and is responsible for their well-being. He's not just the leader and PM for Liberal voters. He has a responsibility to look out for the best interests of all Canadians. His incentive to do what's best for Albertans, Saskatoon, Kelowna etc... is that he's the Prime Minister and is responsible and accountable to all of us. It comes with the job.

At the same time, I believe all Canadians who voted for parties other than the Liberals also need to support PM Trudeau as the leader of the country. However, support does not mean "follow blindly" and comes in different forms. Support includes constructive criticism and pushing him to be a better leader.

To say he doesn't have an incentive to do what's best for all Canadians is the sort of divisive politics and rhetoric that has no place in our country. We aren't the United States.


Agreed, he definitely is responsible and accountable for all canadians. It is sad however that no matter how much he does or betters the lives of the people in those areas the hatred will always be so strong in many that they will never support him. He could put in as many pipelines as they want and he will still be "Mr.dressup/ drama teacher". All we can do is hope that changes and the division is mended.

Jmfva, you say this as though we should believe putting in a pipeline is some kind of beneficence, a concession to Alberta as Omnitheo suggested.

It isn't, any more than putting in a national railway was a benevolent gift from MacDonald to one of the provinces.

If Trudeau had understood this, we wouldn't be in the mess we're in now.

We do not expect to be "entertained" as Omnitheo suggests. We expect good governance.

Yes, there are Canadians who profess to hate Trudeau just as there are those who profess to loathe Scheer. Yes, there are Canadians who mock him for how he dresses and how he behaves in public, just as there are those who adore him for the way he looks and for his celebrity image.

There are also those among us who neither hate nor loathe nor adore him, but simply expect him to be a prime minister for Canadians first. There are those among us who have consistently asked the Liberal party and his remaining supporters to expect him to be responsible, accountable and honest, to put realistic expectations for Canada's long-term economic well-being before the demands of foreign interests and transnational corporations.

This should never be too much to ask, it is simply what we should expect, as Jonrox does, in return for our support.

After all, a strong Canadian economy is the only way we can sustain the social programs aggressively progressive Canadians like Omnitheo are asking for.
Last edited by rustled on Oct 22nd, 2019, 2:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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