Proportional Representation

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Frisk
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Proportional Representation

Post by Frisk »

Anyone want to have a discussion about proportional representation? I'm sure it's a topic we'll be hearing a lot of over the next couple years with the ndp holding the balance of power. I'm not really against it but I just don't see the point, the ndp have already achieved what they would have under a PR government, a liberal or conservative minority with them holding the balance of power. And so while the ndp would prevent the liberals and conservatives from ever getting a majority under a PR government, they'll do the same to themselves. They were not too far off in 2011...

Our province seems to be the hotspot for PR discussion in canada, and seeing how BC largely rejected it in our referendum last year, I think I know how the rest of the country feels about it. Also trudeau lost the popular vote so I'm sure he's probably not too keen on changing the system.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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Italy, Israel, Sweden, Germany... dogs breakfast. Enough said.
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Re: Proportional Representation

Post by GordonH »

PR went through a referendum in BC and was rejected for fptp, what are the chances federally would be any different.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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Someone noted under PR, Bernier's PPC would have received 7 seats.

'nuff said.

I'd prefer some sort of ranked voting. Of course, that would almost kill the CPC because they're nobody's second choice.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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I find it kind of funny how Proportional Representation has finally become a "thing" with many Conservative supporters, only because the shoe is now on the other foot. After the 2011 election when Harper had a majority govt with only 39.6% of the votes, when people complained they were called whiners and reminded of our democratic process.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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crookedmember wrote:Someone noted under PR, Bernier's PPC would have received 7 seats.

'nuff said.

Whew. Guess we dodged more than one bullet to the head this last election.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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One reason I like FPTP is that under PR Jody Wilson-Raybould would not have been able to get elected.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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crookedmember wrote:Of course, that would almost kill the CPC because they're nobody's second choice.


That's true. Just a lot of people's first choice. Which makes a lot of sense given what a great party they are.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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The Green Barbarian wrote:
crookedmember wrote:Of course, that would almost kill the CPC because they're nobody's second choice.


That's true. Just a lot of people's first choice. Which makes a lot of sense given what a great party they are.

They were my second choice until this election, when Trudeau took the Liberals too far left of center.

I'd think a single ranked ballot may be worth a try. Not proportional representation, though. That seems to lead to less accountability, more backroom deals, and a mucky mess. IMO, there's no point banging on about "being represented" when we are not prepared to hold the people we have elected to account. If that was in place for this election, folk like myself who find all the other parties too far left or too far right could mark "Rhino" for second choice.

People seem to have this warm and fuzzy notion about "being represented". It's as though in their minds electing the correct representative will mean they get things mostly the way they want them done, get their priorities addressed, regardless of the consequences for others and even for themselves down the road. That's not a recipe for good governance.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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crookedmember wrote:Of course, that would almost kill the CPC because they're nobody's second choice.

That's true. And they were not the first choice for the majority of Canadians either.
Which makes a lot of sense given what a loser of candidate they picked for leader.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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coffeeFreak wrote:I find it kind of funny how Proportional Representation has finally become a "thing" with many Conservative supporters, only because the shoe is now on the other foot.


Proportional representation would be debilitating for the conservatives and I'm sure most of their supporters understand that. If they're patient then they'll get their turn to govern soon enough.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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rustled wrote:They were my second choice until this election, when Trudeau took the Liberals too far left of center.


How exactly do you propose that Trudeau has taken the liberals too far left of center?
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Re: Proportional Representation

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Omnitheo wrote:How exactly do you propose that Trudeau has taken the liberals too far left of center?


I can't tell if trudeau is on the left, in the center, or on the right. He and his party have broken so many promises that its become difficult to gauge where they even stand on things anymore.
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Re: Proportional Representation

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Ka-El wrote:That's true. And they were not the first choice for the majority of Canadians either.


LOL - no it's not true. And they were the party that received the highest number of votes. So in that sense, "the majority" of Canadians did make them their first choice.

Which makes a lot of sense given what a loser of candidate they picked for leader.


Not sure if you are talking about Scheer here, especially since he is far from a loser. Now when he runs around in black face, dancing around in foreign countries, and writing love letters to murdering dictators, we can talk.
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Re: Proportional Representation

Post by Ka-El »

Proportional representation can be complicated though. Especially given that math can be so tough for partisan right-wingers. If 30% of the population votes for one party, and 70% of the population voted for “anyone else”, then no, your party did not win the majority of the total votes. One third of the population voted right, while two thirds of the population voted center and left. Cons lose. The only question now is how long it is going to take for the whiner snowflakes to accept that.
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