Politics & Religion

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unclemarty
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by unclemarty »

Hey Iphtheme, you're the one who likes documentaries, right?, ever seen "farewell Israel - Bush, Iran, and the revolt of Islam"...? If the horror shows around halloween time don't scare you anymore, that one might keep you up at nights.
"Jerusalem is a port city on the shore of eternity." - Yehuda Amichai
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JonyDarko
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Re: Politics & Religion

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Great topic and question.

In short you bet it does.

I actively look at the religion of all candidates along with many other things. I do not know about you but I like to have sane leadership. If someone talks about god here and there that's fine, does not bother me in the least. But if they get blessings against witchcraft, or think the world is 6k-10k years old, and "my personal favorite" claim fossils were put there to test our faith. Then yea, I really do think they are crazy and would keep looking for a better candidate.

Religion is not the only thing that can sway my opinion, I can be fairly picky. After all they are going to represent me and have power over my future.
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usquebaugh
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by usquebaugh »

unclemarty wrote:Hey Iphtheme, you're the one who likes documentaries, right?, ever seen "farewell Israel - Bush, Iran, and the revolt of Islam"...? If the horror shows around halloween time don't scare you anymore, that one might keep you up at nights.


You want me to think that Bush has the world's best interests at heart though he's really only a war-mongering fool? Anyone who doesn't see Bush for what he is has been drinking the Kool-Aid. My bet is you've drank several gallons. You might want to head to the hospital to have your stomach pumped.

Also, your comments about Islam remind me of the creeps in the Republican party who want people to think Obama's a Muslim, because that somehow makes him an indecent human being. As far as the situation in Iran goes:

1) I understand that the Americans are lying about the exact translation of what comes out of Ahmadinejad's mouth.

2) Why is the US the only country on the face of the planet that gets to decide who can or cannot develop nuclear weaponry when the US is the only nation to use an atomic bomb twice?!

3) Ahmadinejad has done nothing, except tell the US military (backed by Big Oil and Defense Contractors) to p*** off, so that his country isn't turned into another Iraq (you know the country that US invaded illegally, and while there has been using depleted uranium in its weaponry, and now many Iraqis are either infertile or their children are born with multiple birth defects. Yeah, Bush and his ilk, the so-called compassionate christian conservatives, are people I'd want to associate with after they've caused the deaths of 10s of 1000s of Iraqis who had nothing to do with 9-11.)

My goodness, if the US were going to potentially invade my country, I'd want a leader who stands up for myself and the other citizens, in order to keep them out, rather than bending over backwards to accommodate them, a la Harper.
Where oh where’d my body go?
Africa or Mexico?
Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
Have you seen my ghost?
Staring at the ground?
Have you seen my ghost?
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JLives
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Re: Politics & Religion

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I do actively look into a candidates religion and in certain cases it would definately affect my vote. If they don't believe in evolution they are off my list or if they are a fundamentalist (of any religion). I am an athiest and truly believe there should be a clear seperation of religion when it comes to setting law and policy. I do hold federal politicians to a bit of higher standard than civic because city councils do not really set laws that would affect social policies for the most part. With civic elections I am more concerned about fiscal mangement and development issues. I would vote for someone of any religion there is pretty much as long as I felt assured they could keep it from affecting their leadership.
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by Big ned »

Religion doesn't really enter into when I vote. I dislike it when people bring up religion too much when running for public office. I want someone who is honest and shows integrity. I guess I should stop voting .....

I do have conservative views and vote for those that share them.. That is about it. I would have a hard time voting in the US presidential elections this year. Both candidates are far from forth coming (although I read a list the other day of things that Barack has not disclosed and it scared me). I don't care if people have views that disagree with mine on religion as long as they can show that they have a policy that I think would be good for the country. And in the end isn't that what it boils down to... everyone has their opinions and vote accordingly.

What I can't understand (and I see it even in some of the postings here) is when people start getting personal about someone elses opinions and beliefs. Everyone has a different personal life experience and to judge them based on our own life experience is really kind of pointless. I see a lot of personal attacks (different from policy attacks etc) that really turn me off. Calling people names or calling them idiots etc based on their own personal life experience?.... Doesn't produce any kind of unity between people and is just plain destructive in nature.
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JonyDarko
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by JonyDarko »

If you are running for a political position, some of your personal beliefs are great indicators of whether or not you are mentally capable of handling a position of such power and control.

If you think the world is around ten thousand years old
If you think God gives you the right to wage war
If you think Evolution makes no sense at all and all creatures just kind of poofed into existence \
These are only a few and merely used as examples


You may not be rational or educated enough to hold a position such as PM or president.

You call it a personal life experience, I call it cognitive break down.
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usquebaugh
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by usquebaugh »

JonyDarko wrote:If you are running for a political position, some of your personal beliefs are great indicators of whether or not you are mentally capable of handling a position of such power and control.

If you think the world is around ten thousand years old
If you think God gives you the right to wage war
If you think Evolution makes no sense at all and all creatures just kind of poofed into existence \
These are only a few and merely used as examples


You may not be rational or educated enough to hold a position such as PM or president.

You call it a personal life experience, I call it cognitive break down.


:hailjo:
Where oh where’d my body go?
Africa or Mexico?
Where or where’d my body go?
Where’d my body go?
Have you seen my ghost?
Staring at the ground?
Have you seen my ghost?
Sick of those *bleep* clouds
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unclemarty
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by unclemarty »

iphtheme wrote:
unclemarty wrote:Hey Iphtheme, you're the one who likes documentaries, right?, ever seen "farewell Israel - Bush, Iran, and the revolt of Islam"...? If the horror shows around halloween time don't scare you anymore, that one might keep you up at nights.


You want me to think that Bush has the world's best interests at heart though he's really only a ... a la Harper.



I take it by your response that the answer to my question is no, you've not seen that particular documentary (a genre i simply remembered you fancied). If you had, it could have saved you a whole bunch of typing. For once my post to you wasn't meant as a poke but considering the past, i can understand why you'd react a la deffensive.

The documentary aims to shed some light on the difference between how Islam sees religion and government compared to how the western world does, How they view ALL parts of the world not under Islamic domination, the difference between their view of "peace" and what the rest of the world considers peace, and how Bush's reactions to current events actually played nicely in the overall goals of Islam...among other interesting facts.

These fundamental differences may seem inconsequential to us, sitting here in our rapidly shrinking little bubble of paradise but the events of history should serve as flaming red flags. Just ask any Brit that hasn't made the exodus over here yet.

...and by "They" i don't only mean the extremist nut-jobs - thats the truly scarry part.
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Glacier
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by Glacier »

unclemarty wrote:Hey Iphtheme, you're the one who likes documentaries, right?, ever seen "farewell Israel - Bush, Iran, and the revolt of Islam"...? If the horror shows around halloween time don't scare you anymore, that one might keep you up at nights.


Is there a website that shows this video? All I see is the trailer and the comments at the bottom...

atheistrebel wrote:If it were not for the American taxpayer sheeple, Israel would not exist anyway! That *bleep* country produces nothing except wars for the rest of us to fight and die! They are only surviving because of all you idiots out there that believe there'e a god and that's his favorite country and people or some stupid *bleep* like that! Wake up SHEEPLE!
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unclemarty
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Re: Politics & Religion

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"Farewell Israel - Bush, Iran, and the Revolt of Islam":

Friend of mine let me borrow the DVD and I'm sorry but i don't know of any internet links other than: http://farewellisrael.com/home.html

It was a fascinating look at Islam right from its beginnings through to the present day. It explained in a fair and informed way the reasons why, operating with modern western misconception, the hope of finding a peaceful resolution in the middle east has been and will continue to be futile.

"FAREWELL ISRAEL lifts the veil of mystery that has shrouded the Islamic culture from the Western world for many centuries. Joel Gilbert skillfully bobs and weaves through history to hit the high and low points of the struggles between two distinctly different, yet scarily similar, ideologies. Gilbert lays out his research in meticulous and painstaking detail, and viewers need only add their own reasoning to this chronological cautionary tale.
Those who have been paying little or no attention to what's been happening “over there” will be jolted into awareness by this crash course in past, current, and coming events. No matter where you stand on the Arab-Israeli issue, your comfort zone will be invaded and occupied by FAREWELL ISRAEL."

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Last edited by unclemarty on Nov 3rd, 2008, 11:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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averagejoe
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by averagejoe »

Maybe when the Israel settlers stop building houses on stolen Palistinian lands. Backed up by Israeli border gurds, Israeli Army with top of the line American weapons. Thats when there will be peace in the Middle East. At least that would be a good start.
Ecclesiastes 10:2 A wise man's heart is at his right hand; but a fool's heart at his left.

Thor Heyerdahl Says: “Our lack of knowledge about our own past is appalling.
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unclemarty
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Re: Politics & Religion

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A good begining for the extinction of Israel. Exactly my point about "Modern Western misconception" and the misguided notion that any concessions would be enough to begin a peace process with one party playing it as merely a strategic stepping stone. How much is enough?...just a little bit more.

"Accords with Israel are exposed as "The Diplomatic Strategy Against Israel," by which Egypt sought to defeat Israel through diplomacy, rather than establish "Western Peace." Israel's misunderstanding of Islamic goals and values are highlighted by its enthusiasm for Yasser Arafat and the 1993 Oslo Accords.

Next, President George Bush's tragic misunderstanding of 9/11 as a "War Against Freedom," in which the United States played into the hands of Al-Qaeda and the Islamist cause by advocating democratic reform across the Middle East, is revealed. Finally, the Iranian agenda for acquiring strategic weapons to eliminate Israel comes clearly into focus.

Today, at the direction of Iran, Islamists are preparing for a fateful coming war for Islam - and Israel is the number one target and obstacle in the path of Islamic revival. For Muslims, Israel embodies "injustice", and is the ultimate symbol of Islam's decline - a Western, secular society imposed by the West on former Islamic lands. Only with the return of Jews to their historic status as "Dhimmi" or "Tributaries," tolerated and protected within Islamic society, can Islamic revival succeed - resulting in "Islamic Peace" in the Middle East.

Farewell Israel: Bush, Iran and The Revolt of Islam reaches the unavoidable conclusion that Western and Israeli misunderstanding of Islam is leading to a coming war - which will have devastating consequences for the West, and worst of all for Israel - Farewell Israel!"
Last edited by unclemarty on Nov 4th, 2008, 1:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Jerusalem is a port city on the shore of eternity." - Yehuda Amichai
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averagejoe
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Re: Politics & Religion

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Could you explain "Only with the return of Jews to their historic status as Dhimmi or Tributaries? I've never seen this term?
Ecclesiastes 10:2 A wise man's heart is at his right hand; but a fool's heart at his left.

Thor Heyerdahl Says: “Our lack of knowledge about our own past is appalling.
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unclemarty
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by unclemarty »

Well, in anticipation of the subsequent onslaught of the "thread purists" i'll give it a go:

Because of their shared lineage to Abraham, Mohamad actually respected the Jews and Christians of old (little resemblance to the modern church by the way - other topic though) and as Islam expanded by conquest, Islamic laws existed that protected the local Jews/Christians from harm. But because neither Jews nor Christians were willing to recognise Mohamad as "The next and final prophet of God" those who led Islam following Mohamad's death viewed them as inferior and themselves as benevolent and tolerant overlords. The two 'inferior' groups were known as "Dhimmi" or Tributaries required to pay for the protection and freedoms they enjoyed within the Islamic world. Original Islamic law actually held severe consequences for any Muslim who killed a Dhimmi unless they dared display any alliance to the occasional outside Infidel that attacked Islam. When that happened, they were fair game for slaughter. The most recent case was that of the Armenians (men women and children) who met officially sanctioned obliteration at the hands of muslims following world war 1 for their attempt to move towards a more secular, democratic state.

Apply that little bit of understanding to todays Jews who dared carve themselves a corner of the land they consider their historical homeland with the help of western secular infidels . It doesn't take much connecting the dots to figure out what fate awaits them in spite of all the lofty "peace accords" todays islamic leaders have been seen willing to entertain. smoke and mirrors?

I only just watched the DVD and didn't realize there would be a test already. :spinball: I just meant to pass it along as a possible addition to Iphtheme's collection of documentaries.
Last edited by unclemarty on Nov 6th, 2008, 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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averagejoe
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Re: Politics & Religion

Post by averagejoe »

Thank you.
Ecclesiastes 10:2 A wise man's heart is at his right hand; but a fool's heart at his left.

Thor Heyerdahl Says: “Our lack of knowledge about our own past is appalling.

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