War, Hatred & Oppression

[averagejoe]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

[Meema]

1.John 14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

[averagejoe]

1.John 14:27
Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.

Thanks for posting Meema. At least you provided a quote instead of some that just talk off the top of their heads from something they heard from somewhere?

[Meema]

taken out of context these verses can seem to contradict....my take on it is that one is spiritual peace and one is natural(flesh)peace.
1John Spiritual-between God and man
MatthewNatural-between man and man
what's your take on it Joe?

[tryscotty]

[quote="averagejoe"]Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”[/quote]

Nice try. The context shows what Jesus means Jesus was clearly saying that if you follow him you will be hated and persecuted even by members of your own household. If Jesus advocated War than why is it well documented the first century Christians were put in prison and put to death and otherwise martyred for their neutral stand and refusal to join the army? Add that to the already quoted scriptures I posted earlier and there's one answer. You would think that Christians that actually lived when Jesus did knew what he taught and guess what. They refused to join in any wars. I realize most will not agree with what's in the Bible but it is a wide road "most are on". Hope you like the exit. There's a new commandment to Love and Jesus demonstrated it and taught it. He even said it was not ok to even have a legion of Angels fight for HIM so what makes you think it's ok to fight for us?

[averagejoe]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Nice try. The context shows what Jesus means Jesus was clearly saying that if you follow him you will be hated and persecuted even by members of your own household. If Jesus advocated War than why is it well documented the first century Christians were put in prison and put to death and otherwise martyred for their neutral stand and refusal to join the army? Add that to the already quoted scriptures I posted earlier and there's one answer. You would think that Christians that actually lived when Jesus did knew what he taught and guess what. They refused to join in any wars. I realize most will not agree with what's in the Bible but it is a wide road "most are on". Hope you like the exit. There's a new commandment to Love and Jesus demonstrated it and taught it. He even said it was not ok to even have a legion of Angels fight for HIM so what makes you think it's ok to fight for us?

You keep saying everyone knows and well documented. I haven't seen anything as of yet that you talk about? Other than opinions, can you produce something? I'll start that maybe some Christians were persecuted in the 1st Century. But Armenia became the first Christian country? How come thats never mentioned?

[averagejoe]

taken out of context these verses can seem to contradict....my take on it is that one is spiritual peace and one is natural(flesh)peace.
1John Spiritual-between God and man
MatthewNatural-between man and man
what's your take on it Joe?

Not sure what your talkin about Meema???

[tryscotty]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Nice try. The context shows what Jesus means Jesus was clearly saying that if you follow him you will be hated and persecuted even by members of your own household. If Jesus advocated War than why is it well documented the first century Christians were put in prison and put to death and otherwise martyred for their neutral stand and refusal to join the army? Add that to the already quoted scriptures I posted earlier and there's one answer. You would think that Christians that actually lived when Jesus did knew what he taught and guess what. They refused to join in any wars. I realize most will not agree with what's in the Bible but it is a wide road "most are on". Hope you like the exit. There's a new commandment to Love and Jesus demonstrated it and taught it. He even said it was not ok to even have a legion of Angels fight for HIM so what makes you think it's ok to fight for us?

You keep saying everyone knows and well documented. I haven't seen anything as of yet that you talk about? Other than opinions, can you produce something? I'll start that maybe some Christians were persecuted in the 1st Century. But Armenia became the first Christian country? How come thats never mentioned?

The Christian view of war has changed throughout the history of the faith.

The early church (the first 300 years) was strongly pacifist. Origen said that Christians "do not go forth as soldiers". Tertullian wrote "only without the sword can the Christian wage war: for the Lord has abolished the sword." Clement of Alexandria wrote "...he who holds the sword must cast it away and that if one of the faithful becomes a soldier he must be rejected by the Church, for he has scorned God." http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions ... /war.shtml

[Meema]

taken out of context these verses can seem to contradict....my take on it is that one is spiritual peace and one is natural(flesh)peace.
1John Spiritual-between God and man
MatthewNatural-between man and man
what's your take on it Joe?

Not sure what your talkin about Meema???

Sorry...in Matthew 10 I believe He is talking about natural(flesh, between family etc) peace and in 1John he is talking about spiritual peace...Jesus died so there would once again be peace(reconciliation) between God and man

[GordonH]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Here is the meaning of the word peace from the above verse: http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/1515.htm

[averagejoe]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Here is the meaning of the word peace from the above verse: http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/1515.htm

Here is the meaning of sword..I came not to send peace, but a sword.”
Sword is a weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword

[averagejoe]

taken out of context these verses can seem to contradict....my take on it is that one is spiritual peace and one is natural(flesh)peace.
1John Spiritual-between God and man
MatthewNatural-between man and man
what's your take on it Joe?

Not sure what your talkin about Meema???

Sorry...in Matthew 10 I believe He is talking about natural(flesh, between family etc) peace and in 1John he is talking about spiritual peace...Jesus died so there would once again be peace(reconciliation) between God and man

From my reading is that there would be peace among the Israelite nations when they followed God's laws. He would afflict them when they would not follow them. i.e. when the Israelites went into captivity in Assyria (721BC) and Babylon (586BC).

[GordonH]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Here is the meaning of the word peace from the above verse: http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/1515.htm

Here is the meaning of sword..I came not to send peace, but a sword.”
Sword is a weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword

Yes it does, but not a battle sword. http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/3162.htm

[Meema]

From my reading is that there would be peace among the Israelite nations when they followed God's laws. He would afflict them when they would not follow them. i.e. when the Israelites went into captivity in Assyria (721BC) and Babylon (586BC).[/quote]


OT Jews were treated differently by God but once Christ was crusified He sees us all the same. Jews still have to come to Christ to find the peace you are talking about...or what I think you are talking about.

Galations 3
26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

[averagejoe]

Come on guys, do a little research before you know what your talking about. Jesus was no hippy for those who think that.

Jesus said....Matthew 10:34 “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth; I came not to send peace, but a sword.”

Here is the meaning of the word peace from the above verse: http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/1515.htm

Here is the meaning of sword..I came not to send peace, but a sword.”
Sword is a weapon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sword

Yes it does, but not a battle sword. http://strongsnumbers.com/greek/3162.htm

Like I said, this from your own posting hockeyfan1970...
properly, a slaughter-knife; a short sword or dagger mainly used for stabbing; (figuratively) an instrument for exacting retribution.

Still a sword!