16 things atheists need Christians to know

[OREZ]

I'm no psyche major, but I believe it is human nature to hunger for understanding, a need to know, even if it sometimes leads us to prematurely accept as fact what is merely the best theory to date.

Definitely agree with you there, most of us have that tendency... except for the people who are totally absorbed in reality TV and Hollywood gossip, that is... lol

[Nebula]

Orez, to be clear, I do not associate the belief in god to a believe in a young earth. There is a subset of those who believe in god who believe in a young earth.

As for your question about the origin of the universe and the term 'speculative', I suppose it all depends on exactly what you are talking about.

We can measure how far away things in the universe are from us. We can also determine that things are moving away, that they are expanding outward. Since we know that some things are very, very far away from us and the light from those object took a very long time to get here, we can reasonably safely say that, at some point in the far past, those things were far closer to each other.

Up to that point, I don't believe there's a whole lot of speculation involved. Now if you want to know what happened just before the Big Bang, where did the matter come from, etc., I thik there would be some speculation involved.

[DeepEnd]

I've always been intrigued by this. Since most people are well aware of this (especially if a person is old enough to have actually observed how "new discoveries alter previous beliefs") and it doesn't take much to peruse relatively recent (recent in the grand scheme of things) textbooks and encyclopedias and see how this is not exactly unheard of, would it not be logical to conclude that much of what is emphatically stated by some as "scientific fact" today may likely be replaced by the "scientific fact" of tomorrow, the same way if has in the past? If so, what do you think it is it that allows many people to so easily feel comfortable with accepting speculative science on grand subjects such as the origin of the universe?

One problem with your statements above that I see is that you state that the origin of the universe is speculative science. A few scientists didn't get together one day and say, "Hey, let's just invent a way the universe could have come about."

At least read something on the subject before making a silly comment like that.

The only way they have arrived at their understanding today is by speculative science.




J. Robert Oppenheimer Lecture in Physics, delivered March 13, 2007, by Stephen Hawking, the Lucasian professor of mathematics at Cambridge University

http://berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2007/03/16_hawking_text.shtml

[Born_again]

Thank god for hypothesis. Curse god for his people that wilfully ignore what scientific theory is all about.

[forum]

Without any background or complete understanding in biology or any sciences for that matter, I could see the concept of evolution being hard to grasp by any individual.

[binky11]

Nah. Atheists know they're right. Religious people just think they are.

Well I'm willing to bet my life you are wrong..................oh wait.........that is what we would be betting on.
Because Christians do not hate athiests, but athiests hate Christians, well I think that most (so called athiests) are bitter for one reason or another. Or they for some crazy reason think their lives would have to change too much and be taken out of their comfort zone, so instead of coming to that realistic conclusion, they cry athiest, it's just easier.

And don't go harping on me about athiests hating Christians, THEY cannnot leave them alone, I am yet to meet one that was content to agree to disagree, that intrigues me. Why are the majority of claiming athiests so bent on converting Christians to believe they are wrong. Thats very interesting too. Tells me all I need to know really. Time will tell, and there's not much of that left.

[Born_again]

.... think their lives would have to change too much and be taken out of their comfort zone ....

Can you please explain what this comfort zone is? Describe it, if you are able.

[cliffy1]

The atheists prayer: Lord, please save me from your followers.

What Christians can't seem to understand is that they are not the only deists on the planet, they just think they are the only ones with a direct pipeline to the Big G and their Big G is the only true Big G - a triad of Big Daddy, The Kid and the Holy Spook. Atheists and agnostics don't hate Christians, they just hate their self righteous arrogance, their always talking down to anyone who doesn't believe as they do in fairy tales and magic. Their constant judgements about how everybody who doesn't kiss God butt exactly the way they do are all going to Burn Baby Burn. Perhaps if they came down off their high horse and joined the human race, you know the one with flawed psyches, pimples and smelly poop, they might get a little more respect from the rest of humanity.

But don't fret. Soon you all will be in the big revival meeting in the sky while the rest of great unwashed fry for eternity when the Kid comes back and smotes the rest of us heathen. So, if you can't tolerate or respect others' beliefs, you can't really expect others to tolerate yours.

BTW I am not an atheist nor an agnostic. And I would like to clarify that I am referring to the fundamentalist Christian evangelical types who give the rest of Christendom a bad name. Most Christians I've met pretty much just live their lives according to their beliefs and don't bother others with it. Unfortunately, those on the other side of the equation who lash back don't usually qualify their contempt but tend to paint all Christians with the same brush. That is not fair either.

[binky11]

I couldn't agree more that there are many so called Christians that do give Christianity a bad name. There are many white people that give whites a bad name. There are many athletes who give sports a bad rap, I could go on and on with this but you get my point. The churches have gotten so bad with "ear tickling" and "fluffy sermons" I cannot bear to even go anymore.
But the "real" mature Christians (who are becoming fewer and fewer) thanks to the prosperity teachings and the likes, well they are out there. Same as there is good and bad in all races and colors and religions etc. The fact is, I have been hurt more by proclaiming Christians than I have by my non-Christian friends, yeah I can admit that. Any proclaiming Christian that declares to be pure and without sin and leads the "perfect" life, is very deceived. You don't throw the baby out with the bath water.
May I add however, that a few of the comments you made you very blasphemous, I have never met anybody who believes in God that would say such things, are you sure you are not a proclaiming athiest?

And born_again...............I think you know what it means to be out of your comfort zone, in the context I put it in anyway.
People thinking they cannot become a Christian because the not so mature ones leading them to believe that as long as there is sin in their life, they might as well forget it. So very untrue. Many people think this and it is a myth and misconception. You were born a sinner, you will die a sinner, it's just that you wil want to start getting rid of the sin in your life AFTER conversion, it becomes a desire.

[cliffy1]

Well, yes I was rather blasphemous there, I admit, because that is the way evangelicals talk to "non-believers. I cannot say that I am Christian because I am not, even though I try to follow the teachings of Jesus (among others teachers) I do not believe that he actually existed in the flesh, that he was the sun of any god (that was not a typo) and that the creator of the Universe has anything to do with the affairs of men nor does he care what you think, believe or do. I also believe the bible is a work of fiction and that a caring god would not stifle our creativity with a bunch of silly rules.

Having said that, I have studied comparative religions, philosophies, psychology, metaphysics, parapsychology, and quantum physics and mechanics. I have been in the churches, meeting halls, spiritual rituals and ceremonies of a multitude of religions and spiritual beliefs. I have discussed various belief systems with hundreds of believers and nonbelievers to try to understand why they believe as they believe. I have met very few who would have an open mind enough to do that.

I can respect anybody who can respect others, but after 40+ years of listening to the self righteous, I tend to feed back to them the contempt they hold for those who do not share their beliefs. My father, a good Catholic, once told me that I had to respect him because because he brought me into this world. I told him that I did not ask him to and that respect is earned not demanded.

Until my mid twenties I would tell anybody who tried to talk to me about god that if that son of a *bleep* ever showed his face to me I would kick him in the crotch. But I began to be aware of something missing. I had rejected religion and god but I started to investigate other ways of viewing the divine. I started with a blank slate and no particular point of view. What I discovered was far greater and expansive than anything I had been taught. Now I have a very different view of spiritual matters than probably anybody else on the planet and that suits me fine. I have no need to convert, preach or save.

I am open to open discussion but if I get preached at, the gloves will come off.