"Sorry" isn't good enough, Bishop Lahey

[fluffy]

I can think of no other mental disorder that carries the stigma that pedophilia does. It brings out a hunger for the severest punishment even from those who would consider themselves forward thinking liberals.

[5VP]

Interesting phenom all this.

What is it, in the religious and, in particular, the catholic process (mindset) that allows this to happen??

[steven lloyd]

I think the more accurate question would be what is it in the pedophiliac psychological process (mindset) that allows this to happen? Your question excludes teachers, coaches, Boy Scout leaders, fathers, uncles, grandfathers, etc.

[5VP]

I agree but was trying to stay on topic.

Could it be that the liberalizing of our moral/sexual rights has led to this or are we simply becoming more informed and less tolerant as a result of this liberalization?

The catholic church has centuries worth of secrets now threatening to be exposed. it seems it would be in their interest to either continue the charade of piety or get to the bottom of the lies with full disclosure lest satan take them all down with him...

[grammafreddy]

I agree but was trying to stay on topic.

Could it be that the liberalizing of our moral/sexual rights has led to this or are we simply becoming more informed and less tolerant as a result of this liberalization?

The catholic church has centuries worth of secrets now threatening to be exposed. it seems it would be in their interest to either continue the charade of piety or get to the bottom of the lies with full disclosure lest satan take them all down with him...

I think with the advances in technology (and even the invention of the printing press for public news papers), it is harder for churches to keep their followers misinformed and ignorant. Word of misdeeds travels instantly around the world now and it is harder for them to keep a grip on people's minds and to keep their little sexual deviant secrets hidden.

Historically, all organized religions had their own ways of controlling people and misusing them. IMO the Catholic Church was, and continues to be, a haven for homosexuals and pedophiles. Starting with not allowing their priests to marry (explained publicly as being "married to the church"), men and women could join the church and hide their tendencies behind the cloister doors and robes to give them respectability within society. The nuns were used as prostitutes when priests and church members strayed off the path but that, too, had a degree of respectability as it was "the church" who sent men to the nunneries.

Putting sexual deviants in charge of looking after children was a recipe for disaster and almost guaranteed to have the results it did. It wasn't just the native kids in Canada who were abused - all kids in every country from all walks of life were subjected to the dictates of these men and women who "used" those kids in their care. There's many an unmarked grave where kids who threatened their existence are buried secretly in the dead of night. Orphans have no one to tell and no one to notice if they just disappear, do they? And who is going to question the all-powerful church if a child goes missing?

Parents did and do not believe their children when they try to tell them of their priest's transgressions and they blame their kids for the acts of brutality, they accuse their kids of lying and they believe the church when they offer up some explanation rather than taking action to protect their own children from these abusers. The parents are part of the reason the church continues to get away with this abuse of children.

When it looks like the church can't cover it up in one community or if there are too many transgressions, they simply move that priests to a new community and keep on covering up his history until he finally ends up in their own "protective custody" inside their own walls of secrecy.

I am not saying all priests and nuns are homosexuals, pedophiles or abusers but they certainly all know about it and all keep the secrets and all participate in the covering up of the ones who are. There are no whistle-blowers among their ranks. Because of the stranglehold they have on their parishioners' minds, the parents and other church members do not blow the whistle on them, either. IMO, they ALL become child abusers then, because they all do nothing to stop it or expose it.

[5VP]

Scary stuff...

[Queen K]

I got to know a Catholic lady really well and once she opened up about what her kids told her when they were adults, and well away from auothority figures, about the catholic school she sent them too. "If only I had known" but truthfully, that was in an age where the kids would not have been believed. No one believed the kids did they.

[5VP]

I think they call this "grooming" behaviour in the pedophile vernacular.

Plus, it seems, the church installs a guilt firewall program early on in the life of young catholics to counteract any deviance getting exposed in the future.

I was recently publicly accused of being a satanist by a catholic devotee because I admitted to being friends with Jehovah's witnesses and reading their "red book" of revelation.

Since I'm "not guilty" of being a satanist, I was able to laugh it off but what an outrageous uproar this apparently caused for the accuser and a few other catholics. I'd never before experienced such bizarre accusations merely for being accepting of other people of faith. I can only imagine the shock and fear people felt during the inquisition...

Where does this elitist zeal come from??

Collective guilt??

Obviously, confession isn't enough these days for some; or perhaps it's always been a dodge and a sham.

Any catholics in the audience care to clarify??

[cliffy1]

I think they call this "grooming" behaviour in the pedophile vernacular.

Plus, it seems, the church installs a guilt firewall program early on in the life of young catholics to counteract any deviance getting exposed in the future.

I was recently publicly accused of being a satanist by a catholic devotee because I admitted to being friends with Jehovah's witnesses and reading their "red book" of revelation.

Since I'm "not guilty" of being a satanist, I was able to laugh it off but what an outrageous uproar this apparently caused for the accuser and a few other catholics. I'd never before experienced such bizarre accusations merely for being accepting of other people of faith. I can only imagine the shock and fear people felt during the inquisition...

Where does this elitist zeal come from??

Collective guilt??

Obviously, confession isn't enough these days for some; or perhaps it's always been a dodge and a sham.

Any catholics in the audience care to clarify??

Confession is a way for the church to instill a sense of omnipotence of the clergy and the church in the minds of the sheeple. After all, the priest has a direct line to god. He can forgive your sins through his initiation into the church that god built on the rock of Peter. It also reinforces the belief that the sheeple are helpless sinners because they need the intermediary of the church to communicate with god. God talks to the sheeple indirectly through the priesthood. How could they wield any power over their lives if the sheeple knew they had a direct line to the source? It is all about money, power and politics and absolutely nothing to do with god or Jesus.

It is in the absolute power that the church and clergy have over their flock that the corruption comes. Humans in religion or politics, who have the power that people give them, are not mature enough to handle that power, because power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. If the flock were to admit that the shepherd is abusing them, their faith would crumble and their lives become meaningless.

[5VP]

Now that makes sense...

I don't mean to single out catholicism but it is, historically, one of the most prominent/dominant/powerful religions.

I think the aim of most religion is true but sheeple are corruptible and very few have the strength of their conviction to remain true to the words of their God especially when, as with catholicism, one can commit sin then simply stop off at the church's drive-thru version of redemption, the confessional.

In the end it really comes down to the individual making the right choices as much as possible.

If a priest is a pedophile then the right thing to do is obvious.

Get rid of him...

[cliffy1]

Now that makes sense...

I don't mean to single out catholicism but it is, historically, one of the most prominent/dominant/powerful religions.

I think the aim of most religion is true but sheeple are corruptible and very few have the strength of their conviction to remain true to the words of their God especially when, as with catholicism, one can commit sin then simply stop off at the church's drive-thru version of redemption, the confessional.

In the end it really comes down to the individual making the right choices as much as possible.

If a priest is a pedophile then the right thing to do is obvious.

Get rid of him...

I won't ask if you mean get rid of him in the sense of bumping him off. No, that would not be proper, I mean asking you, not the part about bumping him off. Oh, I guess that wouldn't be proper either.... Damn!

"one can commit sin then simply stop off at the church's drive-thru version of redemption, the confessional."

I like that. Need to remember it the next time I bump into a catholic that is smaller than me.