Christianity: Shaking the dust off our feet

[sobrohusfat]

sin, evil, and Satan, are not substance nor are they on the par with divinity.

Please explain in a bit more detail what you mean by "are not substance"

[Thinktank]

I'll also note that in every example you give, God is punishing those in question. Not Elijah, not Lot, God.

That tells me that God has the right, we do not.

The bible tells me to be exactly like God. If that means punishing people, I'll do it.


Matthew 5:48

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So when I see God punishing people, I would like to do exactly the same thing.

[TMixer]

The bible tells me to be exactly like God. If that means punishing people, I'll do it.


Matthew 5:48

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So when I see God punishing people, I would like to do exactly the same thing.

And yet the bible also tells us it is an absolute impossibility to be perfect. That scripture is telling you to strive for greatness regardless of the fact you will never reach it.

One thing about God is, he knows who is God and who isn't. He knows what rights God has (anything, really) that others don't. He knows he has the right to judge and punish. What you want or don't want to do doesn't really come into the equation, except that it shows in your heart you covet power.

[1nick]

I'll also note that in every example you give, God is punishing those in question. Not Elijah, not Lot, God.

That tells me that God has the right, we do not.

The bible tells me to be exactly like God. If that means punishing people, I'll do it.

Matthew 5:48

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

So when I see God punishing people, I would like to do exactly the same thing.

^^ I liked this post cuz,man this guy makes me laugh(then shake my head)

[Thinktank]

[What you want or don't want to do doesn't really come into the equation, except that it shows in your heart you covet power.

I just want to be perfect like god, like the bible tells me.

When I see God turn someone into a pillar of salt for looking back, I wish
I could do that to other people in church. But since I can't turn anyone into
a pillar of salt, at least I can shake the dust off my feet whenever they don't
agree with me, and have nothing to do with them ever again.

the bible told me to do that.

[cliffy1]

And yet the bible also tells us it is an absolute impossibility to be perfect. That scripture is telling you to strive for greatness regardless of the fact you will never reach it.

We are born perfect. A baby knows nothing of the world or duality (good and evil). They can do no wrong. That we become imperfect is a learned process; we mimic our care givers and peers. But that we think ourselves imperfect is a result of the judgements of others. Imperfection is in the eye of the beholder. We are not obliged to accept others' opinions of ourselves. They are just mirroring their concept of themselves. We are told not to judge because we cannot see and know another except through the filters of our own self image. The first step is to stop seeing yourself through the eyes of others and stop judging ourselves based on what others think of us. Then find out who we truly are - children of god, perfect at our core. The imperfections are only skin deep.

[TMixer]

I just want to be perfect like god, like the bible tells me.

When I see God turn someone into a pillar of salt for looking back, I wish
I could do that to other people in church. But since I can't turn anyone into
a pillar of salt, at least I can shake the dust off my feet whenever they don't
agree with me, and have nothing to do with them ever again.

the bible told me to do that.

No it didn't. The bible told you what will happen, both literally and metaphorically, if you directly disobey God and/or disrespect him either directly or through his believers.

It does not say you should, or even can, do as God does. To even try that would be an affront to him, a challenge. Strive to be like him while knowing you never can. That is one lesson. God's direction is meant to benefit you. That's another lesson.

Trying to take his job by judging others is no different than trying to build a tower to heaven. You know your children's book of bible stories pretty well, how did that work out?

Your problem is not with the bible or the teachings within. It is whoever taught you these things without making sure you were comprehending one bit. I say this because you mention repeatedly that you have experience in a church. From what you write in this and other threads, it would appear you've never looked for yourself and thought for yourself and decided for yourself. You simply were told to believe something and, have apparently chosen not to. That's fair, and for a time I was in the same boat. However, if you look into the bible and particularly the teachings of Jesus, and really look into it for yourself, you'll see there's something very worthwhile in there. Whether you want to believe Jesus is the son of God or just some really nice guy, the entire bible, Old and New Testament, has some very valuable lessons for life.

Do I believe God exists? Absolutely. Do I follow a particular religion? Absolutely not. I don't even look exclusively to the bible, but to many works, both religious and non, and make the decision myself. What others tell me it is supposed to be does not enter into things for me. It is what it is to me because it is.

Now, if you want it to be the source of arguments and hostility, then you're doing a fine job. If you want it to better your life, look into it for yourself and see what it means for you. It isn't a matter of being lazy and interpreting things so you don't have to do anything, it's about finding out what it really says for yourself.

As such, I'm going to stop directing you to the lessons of particular scriptures if you stop using scripture to incite argument.

[TMixer]

We are born perfect. A baby knows nothing of the world or duality (good and evil). They can do no wrong. That we become imperfect is a learned process; we mimic our care givers and peers. But that we think ourselves imperfect is a result of the judgements of others. Imperfection is in the eye of the beholder. We are not obliged to accept others' opinions of ourselves. They are just mirroring their concept of themselves. We are told not to judge because we cannot see and know another except through the filters of our own self image. The first step is to stop seeing yourself through the eyes of others and stop judging ourselves based on what others think of us. Then find out who we truly are - children of god, perfect at our core. The imperfections are only skin deep.

Notwithstanding babies who don't really live long, it is impossible to live life and not, somewhere along the lines, wrong someone else for your own gain. Knowingly or not, someone was still wronged by you for your gain. I'm guilty, you're guilty, anyone here is guilty.

[Sneaksuit]

That we become imperfect is a learned process; we mimic our care givers and peers.

Isn't that the truth.

[cliffy1]

Notwithstanding babies who don't really live long, it is impossible to live life and not, somewhere along the lines, wrong someone else for your own gain. Knowingly or not, someone was still wronged by you for your gain. I'm guilty, you're guilty, anyone here is guilty.

That is your judgement.

It is impossible to live in this world without being influenced by those around us. A person can be corrupted by society, but the soul is infallible. The soul is divine in nature. I do not believe in evil, only ignorance.

[concernie]

Please explain in a bit more detail what you mean by "are not substance"

Well, for example, darkness is not a something. It is the absence of light. There is no substance to it. Evil is the same thing, more or less. This is not to downplay the viciousness and depravity of certain evils.

St. Augustine puts it much more eloquently than me:

For what is that which we call evil but the absence of good? In the bodies of animals, disease and wounds mean nothing but the absence of health; for when a cure is effected, that does not mean that the evils which were present—namely, the diseases and wounds—go away from the body and dwell elsewhere: they altogether cease to exist; for the wound or disease is not a substance, but a defect in the fleshly substance,—the flesh itself being a substance, and therefore something good, of which those evils—that is, privations of the good which we call health—are accidents. Just in the same way, what are called vices in the soul are nothing but privations of natural good. And when they are cured, they are not transferred elsewhere: when they cease to exist in the healthy soul, they cannot exist anywhere else.

Freudian, Jungian psychology disagrees with this concept. But that is hardly a surprise considering that Freud was a kabbalist, and likely Jung as well. They projected the typical Kabbalist dualistic concept of good and evil as two sides of the same coin. That is why psychoanalysis encourages immoral behaviour. It's considered a necessary opposite of moral behaviour.

The heresy of Calvinism is also staunchly opposed to privatio boni, but Calvin's contemporaries often accused him of "Judaizing", among other things.

[Sneaksuit]

That is why psychoanalysis encourages immoral behaviour.

What do you mean by this? Can you give examples?

[concernie]

What do you mean by this? Can you give examples?

Psychoanalysis is closely associated with the authoritarian personality construct. Basically, Freud theorizes that repressing sexuality is unhealthy and manifests itself in negative ways, like authoritarian behaviour (notice how Freud bypasses any discussion of whether authoritarian behaviour is bad in the first place). The psychoanalysts love to use this analysis to explain the Nazi regime. But they leave out a big piece of that puzzle, which is that many of the leading Nazis were homosexuals, and there is strong evidence that Hitler was also. Anyways, Freud's solution to avoiding this big, bad authoritarian descent is to express all things sexual, debauched or not. So, this supports the kabbalistic concept of order out of chaos: engaging in good and evil to bring about a desired outcome. Freud was a Lurianic kabbalist. Freud was more a mystic than a scientist, and the same goes for psychoanalysis.

[goalie]

That we become imperfect is a learned process;

Huh?

[Thinktank]

Huh?

People learn to be imperfect in church.