Bible truths

Is there a god? What is the meaning of life?

Re: Bible truths

Postby capleton » Aug 26th, 2018, 11:11 am

averagejoe wrote:Jonah's Pillar...

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=60482


It's just another dumb story in the Bible, like the talking snake and donkey. No evidence for it whatsoever, try again.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby squire13 » Oct 26th, 2018, 4:17 pm

I find the suggestion Jesus was gay very plausible. As a Jewish Rabbi he would have been married at a young age and have several children before he was 30. Jesus’s compassion, care and tolerance were unusual for the brutal times in which he lived, he feels to me like an outsider, certainly not a member of the ruling classes. The ruling Romans practised bisexuality, their wives were politically expedient choices and young boys much favoured for their beauty and love. Pilate saw no reason to crucify Jesus, couldn’t understand why the Jews wanted him dead but the Biblical strictures against homosexuality come from the Old Testament, it makes sense Jesus was gay. In my experience gays make most compassionate nurses - interesting.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby youjustcomplain » Oct 29th, 2018, 7:43 am

capleton wrote:Jonah's Pillar...

It's just another dumb story in the Bible, like the talking snake and donkey. No evidence for it whatsoever, try again.


Uh ya, but people have believed it was true for a very long time, therefor it must be true.
Oh and there would be scads of pictures out there proving it, but cameras didn't exist at the time, therefor, all of the stories in the bible are true.

With that kind of logic, it's no wonder humans have enslaved themselves to that awful book for so long.

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Re: Bible truths

Postby Glacier » Nov 20th, 2018, 9:08 am

youjustcomplain wrote:
Uh ya, but people have believed it was true for a very long time, therefor it must be true.
Oh and there would be scads of pictures out there proving it, but cameras didn't exist at the time, therefor, all of the stories in the bible are true.

With that kind of logic, it's no wonder humans have enslaved themselves to that awful book for so long.

The reverse is also true. You have these hard core fundamentalist atheist types who say that if there's no evidence of something happening then it didn't happen even though 99.9% of anything written in books doesn't survive a millennium or two. The truth is, the "evidence" averagejoe comes up with is complete bunk, but that's immaterial to whether or not certain people existed or events took place.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby 1nick » Nov 20th, 2018, 11:16 am

We could all benefit from this gentleman’s simple lessons.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihaB8AFOhZo
I dunno man, pretty sure that guy’s batsh$t crazy
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Re: Bible truths

Postby youjustcomplain » Nov 20th, 2018, 3:01 pm

Glacier wrote:The reverse is also true. You have these hard core fundamentalist atheist types who say that if there's no evidence of something happening then it didn't happen even though 99.9% of anything written in books doesn't survive a millennium or two. The truth is, the "evidence" averagejoe comes up with is complete bunk, but that's immaterial to whether or not certain people existed or events took place.


Very true.
You won't catch me stating that Jesus never existed. I won't say he wasn't the son of god. I won't see he didn't walk on water, and didn't turn water into wine. (the biblical stories can go on and on and on). I would never argue that any of it isn't true. My only concern is wondering why people believe some or any of it to be.

Anything that can't be disproved, is not to be believed without first accepting that the reasons you believe it are %100 founded in faith. I'm totally fine with anyone using faith to believe things. But they can stop trying to use science to back them. Just like they can stop manipulating scripture to pretend it meant something relevant to today.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby Omnitheo » Nov 20th, 2018, 5:01 pm

There is no such thing as a “fundamental atheist” or “hardcore atheist”

There are simply people who believe in deities, and those who do not, I can’t believe there is no god harder than someone else who also doesn’t believe in gods.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby Glacier » Nov 20th, 2018, 5:24 pm

Omnitheo wrote:There is no such thing as a “fundamental atheist” or “hardcore atheist”

There are simply people who believe in deities, and those who do not, I can’t believe there is no god harder than someone else who also doesn’t believe in gods.

Fundamentalism = hardcore = rigid = impervious to facts.

A better word would probably be Atheism+. Dr. Gabor Maté when criticizing Jordan Peterson the other day discussed the various rigid groups who can't understand nuance. On the secular side there's atheism+ who can't and regular atheism that can.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby capleton » Nov 20th, 2018, 9:19 pm

Glacier wrote:
youjustcomplain wrote:
Uh ya, but people have believed it was true for a very long time, therefor it must be true.
Oh and there would be scads of pictures out there proving it, but cameras didn't exist at the time, therefor, all of the stories in the bible are true.

With that kind of logic, it's no wonder humans have enslaved themselves to that awful book for so long.

The reverse is also true. You have these hard core fundamentalist atheist types who say that if there's no evidence of something happening then it didn't happen even though 99.9% of anything written in books doesn't survive a millennium or two. The truth is, the "evidence" averagejoe comes up with is complete bunk, but that's immaterial to whether or not certain people existed or events took place.


Books like the Bible makes a bunch of claims, if people insist that a event took place in reality or a certain character existed then they have to show actual evidence, that is how the philosophical burden of proof works.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby Glacier » Nov 20th, 2018, 10:06 pm

capleton wrote: Books like the Bible makes a bunch of claims, if people insist that a event took place in reality or a certain character existed then they have to show actual evidence, that is how the philosophical burden of proof works.

Correct. There was a movie done recently on the central claim made in the Bible. Certainly lots of evidence presented in there, but is it enough to convince you? Well, I don't know -- you'd have to watch "The Case for Christ" and let me know afterwards.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby capleton » Nov 23rd, 2018, 6:30 pm

Why don't you sum it up, I can't find it anywhere. I have watched a lot of Christian movies in the past and am not impressed with the rubbish in them.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby Glacier » Nov 25th, 2018, 2:36 pm

capleton wrote:Why don't you sum it up, I can't find it anywhere. I have watched a lot of Christian movies in the past and am not impressed with the rubbish in them.

Same. Most Christian movies suck massive donkey nuts.

The premise of the movie is something like this: https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/arti ... rose-dead/
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Re: Bible truths

Postby 1nick » Nov 25th, 2018, 4:23 pm

I dunno man, pretty sure that guy’s batsh$t crazy

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Re: Bible truths

Postby youjustcomplain » Nov 26th, 2018, 10:15 am

Glacier wrote:Fundamentalism = hardcore = rigid = impervious to facts.

A better word would probably be Atheism+. Dr. Gabor Maté when criticizing Jordan Peterson the other day discussed the various rigid groups who can't understand nuance. On the secular side there's atheism+ who can't and regular atheism that can.



But an Atheist is someone who doesn't believe in god. Simple and clear cut as that.
How could someone be more lacking in belief than another? For me, it's pretty binary.

Now, if you find someone (and they're not hard to find), that behaves more "fundamentalistic" about their Atheism, I'd bet they actually aren't leaning on a lack of belief. I read a lot of comments from self proclaimed atheists who make all sorts of claims that require belief/faith to be true. Things like "There is no god". That is not a comment supported by a lack of belief in god (atheism). That is a comment made by an atheist who also uses belief/faith to assert their claim that they, too, can't support with the same standard of evidence that they expect from believers.

It's so strange to me that I can't really understand why anyone would disbelieve in something that can't be disproved. Just as pointless as believing in it in the first place.
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Re: Bible truths

Postby youjustcomplain » Nov 26th, 2018, 10:33 am

capleton wrote: Books like the Bible makes a bunch of claims, if people insist that a event took place in reality or a certain character existed then they have to show actual evidence, that is how the philosophical burden of proof works.


Yes, the bible makes claims. Millions of people believe this stuff. There is absolutely no burden of proof required though. They believe based on faith and they don't owe us atheists any reason for their belief.

They certainly don't have to show actual evidence. Lets face it, any evidence they could show would be dismissed as not being valid evidence. Right? Evidence that supports the miracles of the bible would not be founded in science and thus, would be dismissed. It's the impasse we're always at.
They believe, we don't.
They feel their reasons are justifiable, we don't.

It's unfair for us to expect people of faith to use the same standards we use that has us not believing. If they played by our rules, they wouldn't use faith and their God would stop existing to them. This isn't what they want, so we shouldn't expect them to change their ways, anymore than they should expect us to change ours. :)

My only wish is that people of faith would stop borrowing science to attempt to justify their beliefs. They should just leave it at "because I believe".

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