West Kelowna Naming Referendum

[canadman]

Ok, I'll respond to that. I've never said there aren't people who voted incorporation who think it makes sense to disassociate with Kelowna. Thre are. I just don't happen to understand the common sense behind that argument.

You also stated we voted to incorporate and made it sound like anyone who would vote to incorporate wouldn't want Kelowna in our name. Just plain untrue. In fact one of the strongest West Kelowna advocates voted to incorporate and is pushing West Kelowna very hard because in this person's opinion they thought when they voted to incorporate they were doing so to get a new name that would enhance our community and make an even better connection to our beautiful location in the Okanagan and not to simply take the generic and relatively obscure name Westbank.

I have heard adnauseum the reasons for keeping Westbank... I know more about the 100 year history of Westbank now than all the combined history I studied in school. But for some reason, disagreeing with that being the best reason to name the municipality Westbank seems to be blasphemy.

Sorry... I don't agree. And I have a right to that opinion.

[canadman]

Lol... ok, you win on the dentist thing. I apologize for that... it was lame.

[canadman]

still holding on to the referendum

No – we voted not to amalgamate with Kelowna – hence why have Kelowna part of the name – redundant
It's not redundant. We voted to not be a part of Kelowna, not share their debt, get lost by insufficient representation on their Council, etc... I don't believe that's synonymous with saying therefore we should shy away from any association with Kelowna. It's right across the bridge. It is one of the most attractive and successful tourist resorts in Canada. Why would you want to walk away from that equity? Not being part of their municipality doesn't mean you have to walk away from the positive things that can come from an association with them. I don't believe it's redeundant.

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a double standard

How?
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You attack when you want to then stand back and cry foul when those you've attacked fight back

.
Nope – did not do that
You may not have done that, I don't know I'd have to go back and look at all the previous posts. I'm not going to do that so I'll take your word for it but others have... Angusog virtually has cornered the market on posts being removed for personal attacks...

You use the referendum when it suits you then cry foul when any of those who oppose you make the same reference.

Again, How?

YOU said you voted Westbank "because most voted against joining Kelowna". That's what you said. How can that not be a reference to the referendum??? Yet every five minutes on here I and others are slammed for being amalgamation zeolots. etc...and for "rehashing the amalgamation issue" even when we don't make mention of the subject.

[fairweather]

Have a glass of wine now - and some cheese. Have you tried those Rainforet crackers?

[canadman]

Wine makes me tipsy.

[Fancy]

Have a glass of wine now - and some cheese. Have you tried those Rainforet crackers?

Whatever.

You use the referendum when it suits you then cry foul when any of those who oppose you make the same reference.
Again, How?
YOU said you voted Westbank "because most voted against joining Kelowna". That's what you said. How can that not be a reference to the referendum??? Yet every five minutes on here I and others are slammed for being amalgamation zeolots. etc...and for "rehashing the amalgamation issue" even when we don't make mention of the subject.

How did I cry foul? I didn't. I don't care what others say. We all have an opinion and a voice in the vote. The naming issue should not be the end all and be all. Get out and vote then deal with the results. Pretty simplistic really. Get some sleep - everything will be better in the morning

[canadman]

Ok, Fancy... let me go back and qualify my original post. I apologize. My post was not directed specifically at you. I was referring to the 'vote Westbank' contingent in general.

You however made the comment attaching your vote to the original incorporate/amalgamation issue, which to me was another remark that, in general terms, seemed to reinforce what has appeared to many to be a double standard. Again, not yours particularly but just in general terms.

Nobody on the Westbank side, generally, ever complained for one minute when there was an onslaught of people writing letters, signing petitions and standing up at committee/council meetings pushing that this community should be called Westbank. It went on for months. To the point where even the Westbank advocates used the fact that West Kelowna didn't seem to have any advocacy pushing for it.

Then the ballot was approved, one that to many of us favoured Westbank as a name.

Then, and only then, people, including myself started expressing our support for West Kelowna. As soon as we did we got called everything under the sun, we were chastized for expressing that opinion, even, as you yourself said, accused of dictating to people... Why is it that when some of us have stood up and spoken out loudly for the name we believe in we get criticized by Westbank advocates who did exactly the same thing for months unchallenged? Is that not a double standard? If not, pleas explain to me how it isn't?

[angusog]

I am writing one last time because I feel compelled to make a statement. angusog, please do not refer to the struggle in South Africa as something so trivial by comparing it to the situation in Westbank. I am from South Africa and have been reading your comments with growing concern. There is a lack of sensitivity displayed towards everyone - not just the communities to the north of yours. Please think before you make such analogies.

I quoted Nelson Mandela but otherwise made no analogy so what are you talking about?

"There is nothing like returning to a place that remains unchanged to find the ways in which you yourself have altered."
Nelson Mandela

Now Angusog compares’ himself and West Bank to Nelson Mandela and Transkei. When in fact:
“Memories can never take you back, home, sweet home.
You can never go home anymore.” The Moody Blues

It's "Westbank" kimosabe and "Nkosi sikelel'i" (God bless) "Westbank"!
Miriam Makeba

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow40LQs0ue4

[angusog]

Ok, Fancy... let me go back and qualify my original post. I apologize. My post was not directed specifically at you. I was referring to the 'vote Westbank' contingent in general.

You however made the comment attaching your vote to the original incorporate/amalgamation issue, which to me was another remark that, in general terms, seemed to reinforce what has appeared to many to be a double standard. Again, not yours particularly but just in general terms.

Nobody on the Westbank side, generally, ever complained for one minute when there was an onslaught of people writing letters, signing petitions and standing up at committee/council meetings pushing that this community should be called Westbank. It went on for months. To the point where even the Westbank advocates used the fact that West Kelowna didn't seem to have any advocacy pushing for it.

Then the ballot was approved, one that to many of us favoured Westbank as a name.

Then, and only then, people, including myself started expressing our support for West Kelowna. As soon as we did we got called everything under the sun, we were chastized for expressing that opinion, even, as you yourself said, accused of dictating to people... Why is it that when some of us have stood up and spoken out loudly for the name we believe in we get criticized by Westbank advocates who did exactly the same thing for months unchallenged? Is that not a double standard? If not, pleas explain to me how it isn't?

Almost everything you state is innuendo designed no doubt to implant your personal view of things in the minds of those who read this nonsense. The fact that you might actually believe it does not make any of this true and your constant repetition borders on defamation!

[angusog]

And FYI, yes I do think it's ok to say what I want... I believe it's called freedom. Much like others on here seem to have no problem saying what they want. That doesn't mean I have to agree with them or you have to agree with me. But you certainly can't tell me what I can and can't say.

And those who disagree with you have every right to say so without being accused of telling you what to say every time canadman.

[Jo]

Every morning I take a look at this thread to make sure the slings and arrows have been kept in reasonable check. It is not a good way to start a day, I can tell you that. It's kind of depressing to think that good neighbours can turn on other good neighbours like this. So much vitriol over a name.

Sure I can understand why each of you cares, but I can't imagine it mattering enough to slam your neighbour as hard as I see happening over and over again in this thread.

I am going to ask the handful of major players in this thread (and you know who you are, if not, take a guess) to leave it alone for a bit and let others have their say. My guess is, there are probably other members who would like to say what they think, but avoid the thread for obvious reasons. Let's give them a chance to say what they think.

[Bestside]

IMO this Okanagan Hills name is for the birds...I can just hear it... oh you Hillbillies from da hills. Just an awfull concept as bad as nondescript Lake Country. About 6 years ago some suggested changing Rutland to the much more likeable Orchard Grove. They were on the right track. Reminds me of some names down in southern Californoa...Lemon Grove, La Mesa, Encinitas, San Bernadito.
I read the posts and I am reminded of Lester Pearson when he first proposed a new flag for Canada back around 1965. People were so upset & wanted to cling to the old. The military was especialy against a new flag just like those now who want to stick with Westbank/Westside. Back then they wanted to keep the Red Ensign/Union Jack flags. Now the military loves the new Canadian flag. It is one of the most distinctive reconizable flags in the world & when worn on a uniform all know that you're from Canada. Pearson's wisdom was correct & he took the criticism for the good of the country.
Westbank/Westside is at the same junction. The time is at hand to move forward & unite the community, what a great opportunity for a new exciting memorable name, unique to all of us.
After reading all the posts I believe that it is best left in the hands of a marketing company who can map out a 5, 10 & 20 year plan to guide us to better planning & prosperity.
An earlier post claimed that changing the Westbank name would cost us money. I contend that not changing the name will cost us much more money, jobs, tourism and the chance to unite our community.
It is incumbent upon all of us to think of the bigger picture just as Lester Pearson did many years ago.

You sound like you have no connection to Westside and you are not aware of what stage we are at in choosing a name. The process has blown past any opportunity to pick a new exciting memorable name.

Our choices are stay with "Westside" or choose 1 of the following four...
Okanagan Hills
Westbank
West Kelowna
Westlake

In respect to this excerpt from your post:

I am reminded of Lester Pearson when he first proposed a new flag for Canada back around 1965. People were so upset & wanted to cling to the old. The military was especialy against a new flag just like those now who want to stick with Westbank/Westside. Back then they wanted to keep the Red Ensign/Union Jack flags. Now the military loves the new Canadian flag. It is one of the most distinctive reconizable flags in the world & when worn on a uniform all know that you're from Canada. Pearson's wisdom was correct & he took the criticism for the good of the country.

Which name would you choose of the four available?
Would choosing West Kelowna be like going with the Red ensign/Union Jack?

My preference for an inclusive non divisive name is Okanagan Hills and everyone will know we are from the Okanagan just like our flag lets people know we are from Canada.

[Fancy]

Jo, at least after tomorrow the voting will be done. However, the name game is still a long process

The process has blown past any opportunity to pick a new exciting memorable name.

I wonder if this is true? An opinion poll may be a far cry from reality and could give residents the opportunity to once again lobby for a catchier name. Unless of course voters do not turn out in droves (as evident in the advance polls) and/or don't care so much about the name and it remains Westside in which case a new exciting name wouldn't have mattered anyway.

[Jo]

Jo, at least after tomorrow the voting will be done. However, the name game is still a long process.

Fancy, I agree with this, and it is for that very reason that I want some of the less-frequent posters to have a chance to voice their opinions!

I'm asking only that the major users of this thread abstain for awhile in order to give others a chance. I have watched others try to join in the conversation only to be completely drowned out by the very long and often hostile posts by the thread regulars.

It'll be good to hear from others - assuming they still come around and aren't permanently turned off the idea of posting in here - and it'll be good for the regular posters to sit quietly and listen for a bit.

[canadman]

No problem Jo. You're right of course. I'll close off my posts to this thread.

Can I just say one thing though, tomorrow's voting day, I hope everyone gets out and votes. I promise you, whatever name wins by majority will have my 100% support. I hope we'll all get behind whichever name wins. It's been a long Summer and long Fall... Fancy, Urbane, steren and others, I know it's been heated, and I'm sorry for the times where I've overstepped the mark and offended you. it's not been my intention though I know I've been guilty of doing it. Jo is right, we are all neighbours and this is probably not the way we should be treating each other, hopefully Sunday things can start turning around.

One final observation, you guys have to admit, notwithstanding the vitrole, in a weird way this has almost been unifying. I know we're all arguing but think about it, we're all engaged in our community and at least we're all arguing for the same single purpose, because we love the Westside and want to protect it.

Good luck to all of you tomorrow!