Seat Belts on School Buses

[stuphoto]

I don't recall ever seeing a commercial vehicle on it's roof due to a rollover. They are always on their sides.

Fire? Water? Not to sound harsh....but these occurences are so rare and remote that it almost isn't even relevant.

I wish that you were right.
I am in Yellowknife at the moment working on the ice roads.
In the last 3 weeks there have been at least 6 trucks burn to the ground. All makes and models.
Yes trucks are different than busses, and yes I am working in a harsh enviroment.
However trucks and busses do share simular engines, electrical, and brakes.
So neither one is truely excempt from issues the other one has.

On a positive note, all busses are equipt with fire extinguishers, and the drivers should know how to use them.

[Dizzy1]

Most modern seats on school buses are designed to prevent children from excessive forward movement and lessen the extent of injuries in a collision by being built with higher and softer backs. Its not as good as a seatbelt, but it is something.

As other posters have mentioned, there are both pro's and con's with seatbelt use - the pro's are obvious but there are scenarios where they can be a safety issue, such as bus fire (we just had a bus go up in flames a couple of days ago where I am right now), roll overs, going into the water. While they do happen, collisions and accidents where seatbelts can be useful, are much more common.

The biggest hurdle is liability, the driver would be ultimately responsible but in the real world, the driver can only do so much. Let's say for example, the driver checks that all the kids have their belts on before they leave, then one of the kids takes their belt off and something happens - the driver says he/she checked the belt and the kid says he didn't - its a legal nightmare.

Then there is another scenario, lets say a kid has problems putting their belt on. Is the driver allowed to assist? Or is that possibly touching the child inappropriately? It sounds silly, but its an unfortunate fact of the world we live in.

[Fancy]

Kids don't know how to unbuckle a seat belt?

In lots of cases - no. And neither do adults in an emergency situation - people panic.

[LTD]

Kids don't know how to unbuckle a seat belt?

theres some adults ive seen that cant operate a seat belt some even post on here

[GordonH]

Bumped
impo there are both pro's & con's to having seat belts on school buses.
Also realizing the way school buses are designed are selt belts actual needed.
Who is liable if the child isn't buckled in.

https://www.castanet.net/news/Canada/24 ... -seatbelts

[LTD]

Bumped
impo there are both pro's & con's to having seat belts on school buses, also realizing the way school buses are designed are selt belts needed.
Who is liable if the child isn't buckled in.

https://www.castanet.net/news/Canada/24 ... -seatbelts

whos liable if the bus is on fire and a child panics and cant undo the seat belt

[jasond_71]

There hasn't been a death in 10 years and before that who knows why they died. Seems like they are not needed?

[chetgunderson]

This is a ridiculous debate, I'm a father of 2 children who take the bus. My daughter is fearful everyday of falling out of her seat because she has seen other kids fall out of their seats. We wear seat-belts in all other modes of transportation, give the kids damn seat belts. This is being debating because transport Canada is trying to protect themselves, cities don't want to pay for them and the bus manufacturers are lobbying against them. So it's $ and sleazy politics over our children's safety.

https://www.change.org/p/transport-cana ... -buses-now

[Fancy]

There hasn't been a death in 10 years and before that who knows why they died. Seems like they are not needed?

There may not have been a death in the Okanagan but there certainly has been in Canada (Calgary 2017 I believe).

There have been accidents concerning busses that had seatbelts and the one comment I read that caught my eye was the schoolbus that had people hanging from their seatbelts.

Some info here:

https://www.cga.ct.gov/2016/rpt/2016-R-0318.htm
http://www.ncsl.org/research/transporta ... belts.aspx

All busses would have to be redesigned according to an earlier article posted.

https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local ... 28572.html

[ShannonG]

I watched a very interesting documentary not long ago on this very topic. The reason Canadian school buses have no seat belt is based entirely on a very flawed 1984 crash test where they tested front impacts only. Of course the padded seat backs performed well in that scenario, but further testing by private groups has shown that side impacts and rollovers rendered the padded seat backs useless. The majority of bus accidents involve the school bus being hit by another vehicle (side impact) and that is where you see terrible injuries and fatalities.
Even the US, with their crumbling schools and thirty year old textbooks, is putting seat belts in their buses.
One day last winter my husband drove past our local school bus hanging off the edge of a cliff on Postill Rd. The tow truck was already there and the bus had been evacuated. I would have liked the kids to have been buckled if that bus had gone over the edge.

[Fancy]

https://www.cbc.ca/fifth/episodes/2018- ... bus-safety

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/school-b ... -1.4826500

[tarasbulba]

I drove a school bus for many many years and I think there are good and bad reasons for seat belts, yes it would keep the child in the seat, in case of an accident, but in any position except right side up would be terrible, kids hanging from seat belts on the side or roof would be so bad, hanging in a seat belt. Who would be responsible to get stuck children out of their seat belt, the driver???? for one, if bus was on it's side what would the driver do, can't touch kids anymore, so what, tell them to take it off and fall to the floor. Now a days even if you were to try and help and something happened, the driver would be hanged, so what should be done????? Let the kids get out on their own, because your in fear of being charged for something. Same as if the child was upside down, would any child just unbuckle and fall without anyone catching them, I fear not. Plus how long would it take for a driver to unbuckle all those kids, some buses are 84 passenger, can't imagine and children stuck in their seats afraid to get out. A long time ago I watched a video about school buses where they did side crashes, front and rear. What they said in that video was, buses are built high, if you notice how far up a child climbs, the floor is quite high, that's for when a side crash occurs, the vehicle goes underneath the bus and not straight on to the children. in a front collision the children slid forward on the seat, impacting the seat cushion in front of them and falling to the floor, if they were to have say a lap belt only, sadly they would hit their head on the cushion in front and snap their necks as they bent forward, bad... rear collision have the least problem, because the seat are taller now than before, only slight injuries. The only way to make sure seat belts are used right would be to have another adult on board who would say, ride in the rear and if something happened could meet the driver half way. plus in case say someone cannot take off their seat belt at their stop, the driver can't be expected to stop the bus and go back to release that child's belt, each time. There clearly needs to be another adult on that bus. More so, as the driver, I don't know what they would do today, not being able to touch a child, we've lost drivers because they just grabbed a back pack to tell them this isn't their stop, so now what????? These are the questions that need to be answered. We already know that seat belts save lives, but what is the best solution to this.......

[Boosted632]

a big old bar that comes down like on a roller coaster or carnival ride no touching of children press a button and down she goes it could be designed to release after a crash so everyone is free.

[tarasbulba]

Not sure about a bar, like a roller coaster, as you've seen an attendant goes around to each seat and makes sure it's down and locked but still doesn't help for a head on crash as the bar would be close to hips and the top part of their body would bend forward and their head would impact the seat in front causing death

[GordonH]

I drove a school bus for many many years and I think there are good and bad reasons for seat belts, yes it would keep the child in the seat, in case of an accident, but in any position except right side up would be terrible, kids hanging from seat belts on the side or roof would be so bad, hanging in a seat belt. Who would be responsible to get stuck children out of their seat belt, the driver???? for one, if bus was on it's side what would the driver do, can't touch kids anymore, so what, tell them to take it off and fall to the floor. Now a days even if you were to try and help and something happened, the driver would be hanged, so what should be done????? Let the kids get out on their own, because your in fear of being charged for something. Same as if the child was upside down, would any child just unbuckle and fall without anyone catching them, I fear not. Plus how long would it take for a driver to unbuckle all those kids, some buses are 84 passenger, can't imagine and children stuck in their seats afraid to get out. A long time ago I watched a video about school buses where they did side crashes, front and rear. What they said in that video was, buses are built high, if you notice how far up a child climbs, the floor is quite high, that's for when a side crash occurs, the vehicle goes underneath the bus and not straight on to the children. in a front collision the children slid forward on the seat, impacting the seat cushion in front of them and falling to the floor, if they were to have say a lap belt only, sadly they would hit their head on the cushion in front and snap their necks as they bent forward, bad... rear collision have the least problem, because the seat are taller now than before, only slight injuries. The only way to make sure seat belts are used right would be to have another adult on board who would say, ride in the rear and if something happened could meet the driver half way. plus in case say someone cannot take off their seat belt at their stop, the driver can't be expected to stop the bus and go back to release that child's belt, each time. There clearly needs to be another adult on that bus. More so, as the driver, I don't know what they would do today, not being able to touch a child, we've lost drivers because they just grabbed a back pack to tell them this isn't their stop, so now what????? These are the questions that need to be answered. We already know that seat belts save lives, but what is the best solution to this.......

Since many of the buses I see here in central Okanagan are driver in front of the front wheels (similar to transit buses). There is little to no protection for the driver, so more than likely in a crash the driver may not be able to help anyone.